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Can't Reach Bolt on Power Steering Pump

12/31/2012 4:52 PM

I asked a question earlier about a '98 Chevy Cavalier that could crank but not turn over. I am now almost certain the timing chain broke (I had fuel, spark, and air, and I can't get compression and I think I have nothing left). Anyhow, I am trying to pull the power steering pump off before getting to the timing chain cover. I've removed 5 of the 6 bolts, but the last one is tough. It's on the engine side, I can barely see it and I don't have enough head space to get a socket wrench in there, and I can't get a combination in there either (I don't think I could get a stubby in there if I had metric ones). Are there any tricks? I saw no special instructions in my Chilton's for this job and nothing online.

Thanks in advance.

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#1

Re: Can't Reach Bolt on Power Steering Pump

12/31/2012 4:55 PM

You might be missing or overlooking something in the order of how other brackets or parts of the accessories on the engine need to come off to get access to it.

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#3
In reply to #1

Re: Can't Reach Bolt on Power Steering Pump

12/31/2012 5:05 PM

Agree with tcmtech. Things often must come off in a certain order, this removal order is not always intuitive.

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#2

Re: Can't Reach Bolt on Power Steering Pump

12/31/2012 5:03 PM

Consult Greg Morris of "Mission Impossible."

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#4

Re: Can't Reach Bolt on Power Steering Pump

12/31/2012 5:19 PM

Not sure on your car but my experience has been if there is spark then the timing chain is not broke. My limited experience has been the distributor is driven by the cam shaft and the cam shaft is driven by the timing chain.

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#6
In reply to #4

Re: Can't Reach Bolt on Power Steering Pump

12/31/2012 5:42 PM

Works off the crank sensor

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#5

Re: Can't Reach Bolt on Power Steering Pump

12/31/2012 5:39 PM
  1. Cavalier Power Steering Pump Removal | eHow.comwww.ehow.com › Car Repair & MaintenanceCavalier Power Steering Pump Removal. Chevrolet Cavaliers have power steeringinstalled as standard equipment. The power steering is assisted with ...
  2. How To: Replace Power Steering Pump - PartSource: Automotive ....
  3. Power Steering Pump Replacement - ClubCav.com: Chevy Cavalier ...
  4. How to replace a power steering pump on a 97 cavalier 2.2
  5. Cant get to the bolts to remove power steering pump on 92 - FixYa

Not gonna say, "why are you doing this again?" No timing belt, no spark. Yes timing belt, yes spark".

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#10
In reply to #5

Re: Can't Reach Bolt on Power Steering Pump

12/31/2012 7:02 PM

Thanks for the links. I had found and read all of them previously except #5. I followed the procedure (and Chilton's) with the exception of disconnecting the pump lines (they're not in the way). No joy.

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#12
In reply to #10

Re: Can't Reach Bolt on Power Steering Pump

12/31/2012 7:14 PM

Sorry they were no help. I'd have thought that everything that could fail, would have failed by now, and been documented.

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#7

Re: Can't Reach Bolt on Power Steering Pump

12/31/2012 5:45 PM

Don't you realized that a team of GM's most experienced automotive engineers spent countless sleepless nights making sure that that critical bolt was unaccessable

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#8

Re: Can't Reach Bolt on Power Steering Pump

12/31/2012 7:00 PM

I understand the crankshaft sensor CPS drives the spark so a broken timing chain only affects the camshaft. My manual says that if the camshaft sensor CMP signal is lost to the PCM while the engine is running, it will continue to run using another calculation method. So, it sounds like the CMP (and working camshaft) is not required for spark (?). Nonetheless, I just had an idea that I should have measured the signal off the CMP while manually turning the crank while the ignition is on (but remove the PCM fuse for safety). A turning camshaft would yield a changing voltage. A broken timing chain would show no change.
Does this make sense?

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#9

Re: Can't Reach Bolt on Power Steering Pump

12/31/2012 7:00 PM

before you do that...take the distrib cap off and turn it over....see if the rotor turns...if it turns the chain is intact

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#11
In reply to #9

Re: Can't Reach Bolt on Power Steering Pump

12/31/2012 7:10 PM

It's distributorless (so I assume there is no rotor or any other clue to seeing a rotating camshaft).

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#13
In reply to #11

Re: Can't Reach Bolt on Power Steering Pump

12/31/2012 7:23 PM

is there an oil fill on the cam cover? can you remove the oil cap and look there?

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#14

Re: Can't Reach Bolt on Power Steering Pump

12/31/2012 10:33 PM

Have you heard of Sidewinder Products?...90 deg ratchet. Check it out.

About $45 on Ebay.

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#15
In reply to #14

Re: Can't Reach Bolt on Power Steering Pump

12/31/2012 11:02 PM

In the initial posting, he said that he, "(didn't) have enough head space to get a socket wrench in there, and . . . can't get a combination in there either (I don't think I could get a stubby in there if I had metric ones)". I own conventional ratchets, breaker bars, torque wrenches, and one Sidewinder. If you can't get the breaker bar or a combination wrench on the bolt, you SURE aren't going to get the Sidewinder in there!

I've had my Sidewinder for at least five years (it was a gift), and still haven't found a good use for it. When there's enough space for its bulky ratchet head, it seems like there is always something in the way to prevent turning the T-handle on the end... and Murphy wins again. It is heavy enough, but seems too round to use to drive tent pegs, and is likely too delicate to drive cold chisels . BTW, I have a ratchet that can be driven by squeezing a plier-like handle next to the main bar; it is less bulky, but gets about the same amount of use, and for similar reasons. I also have a very flat bar with a stubby 1/2" square on the side near the end; looks like a breaker bar that went under Wile E. Coyote's Acme Little Giant Road Roller, and came out a bit under half thickness. NO ratchet, just the fixed drive square - but it has gotten to things unreachable with conventional tools, even if I've had to shorten a socket in the chop saw a few times! If I ever see a 3/8" or 1/4" square version, they'll join my tool collection pronto. Some serpentine belt tools have a similar fixed drive setup, but are usually about four steps lower on the quality chart.

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#16
In reply to #15

Re: Can't Reach Bolt on Power Steering Pump

12/31/2012 11:30 PM

I don't own a Sidewinder and I have no clue as to how big the head is so I'll take your word for it.

Happy new year.

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#17

Re: Can't Reach Bolt on Power Steering Pump

01/01/2013 12:18 AM

Thanks, all. I hadn't heard of the Sidewinder, but it won't work. It sounds like Ron's Wile E. Coyote's thing might work. I think I'll be visiting a tool store for a narrow stubby or an ultra shallow socket or get a cheap socket or wrench that I can grind down.

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#19
In reply to #17

Re: Can't Reach Bolt on Power Steering Pump

01/01/2013 3:37 AM

Ask to see a serpentine belt tool set, too, and study how the long skinny handle is made. It MIGHT even have some suitable short sockets, in which case a cheapie could be worth purchasing.

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#18

Re: Can't Reach Bolt on Power Steering Pump

01/01/2013 12:55 AM

Have you tried one of these and a hammer yet?

A photo of your impossible to remove bolt posted here might provide some inspiration for us.

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#20

Re: Can't Reach Bolt on Power Steering Pump

01/01/2013 11:18 AM

Can you remove a (or the) valve cover and observe their operation of the valves as the crank is turned.

And any way, if the Cav engine is like most, and it was cranked around with a broken timing chain, most likely you have trashed your valves. In that case you are going to have to pull the head(s). So you might as well think about pulling the entire engine.

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#21
In reply to #20

Re: Can't Reach Bolt on Power Steering Pump

01/01/2013 12:13 PM

That's a good point. I'm too much of an optimist. I was hoping if I saw little/no debris with the cover off and cleaning the oil pan, I'd be okay, but it sounds more like a moderately lengthy but limited overhaul so I'll take this more methodical and get a replacement car to take the pressure off this. Thanks, all!
BTW, I was able to get the last bolt by bending a cheap wrench so the bar is more like an offset but still had better torque.

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#22
In reply to #21

Re: Can't Reach Bolt on Power Steering Pump

01/01/2013 9:52 PM

Coming in late to the conversation:

When my timing belt broke on my '87 VW Jetta (base model GX engine), the thing I noticed immediately was the engine cranked over much faster than it ever did before. With no camshaft movement, the engine no longer acts like a pump and either valves were open providing no appreciable resistance, or if both valves were closed, relatively little work is being done (some loss of heat to cylinder walls/head).

Fortunately, this particular VW engine uses a trapezoidal combustion chamber (pocket) with generous squish zones and a slightly dished piston with clearance between fully open valves and pistons at TDC. Other VW engines (HT for the early Mark II GTI and later the 16V PL) engines would not have fared as well.

Good luck with your quest.

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#23

Re: Can't Reach Bolt on Power Steering Pump

01/02/2013 9:23 AM

You have to remove the pulley from it first. And I never heard of a power steering pump held on with so many bolts. So I did some research and there is only two on most models of the cavalier.

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#24
In reply to #23

Re: Can't Reach Bolt on Power Steering Pump

01/02/2013 12:03 PM

Thanks.

Chilton's did not say to remove the pulley (although three of the mounting bolts were only accessible through the pulley cutouts - thick walled sockets would not have fit). All 6 were necessary because it didn't budge until the 6th and hardest one finally came out (and the Chilton's figure showed them all in that step).

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Users who posted comments:

Brave Sir Robin (1); Doorman (1); fixitorelse (1); fredhag (6); Fredski (2); gringogreg (2); lyn (2); ozzb (1); Ron (2); tcmtech (1); TerraMan (2); The Mechanic (1); Tornado (1); Wal (1)

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