KV Electric fence

Standard fine wire mesh deer-proof fencing seems to do a wonderful job of keeping deer in, is it not suitable for keeping deer out in your application?

If electrification is used, expect at least a 1 in 10 chance of you forgetting to turn it off before trying to check the garden (1 in 2 chance if it is your wife). Oh, the fix is worse than the problem .

RF generated may be a potential problem. Have you considered building a sentry system consisting of a couple of PIR sensors, that way the garden defense system (electrification, 140dB klaxon with 20 million candle power strobe, point-defence paint ball gun, etc) is only active if something approaches it.

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Send that dear Doe a Dear John.

There is a company that sells an intruder-activated sprinkler (more like a high-powered squirt gun). Any possibility in checking this out or is your heart just set on roast venison?

Be very cautious, The Neon Transformer can be lethal to humans, especially if they become entangled in it. Only a few milliamperes through the heat circuit can cause fibrillation and these transformers are capable of supplying it. This is a matter of record.

I concur with Snakers. I've messed around with these transformers. They're no joke. Also, you may have problems when it rains. A neighbor has an anti-cat fence set up which doesn't quite leave the unfortunate feline ever quite the same. When it starts misting, the voltage conducts down to the wooden fence... He constantly has to put fires out in his fence.

I would recommend that you make sure your insurance is paid up, if you go that route.

Actually, I have had excellent results with standard fence chargers. The trick I had to use to make it work is a strand about every foot or so with the first one about four inchces above the ground. It seems to keep all the critters out but you have to keep after the weeds to keep them off the lowest strand.

Many of the farmers in my area use what they call "weed chopper" fence chargers. When they are initially plugged in (or switched on), they have a higher output for some time period before settling down to their static pulse rate and amplitude. They do seem to keep the weeds clear of the fences.

Hello Steve-o

Basic idea is good. I agree with Snakers, neon transformers can kill. Furthemore it depends on whether you want to do this legally or not.

I don't know where you live, but where I am in South Africa, our OHSA (Occupational Health & Safety Act) requires no more than 10kV at a pulse frequency of no more than 1Hz... (there are other energy limitations as well.. and more)

How will you prevent yourself from getting caught in your own trap!

If you think that the sounds and light will be enough to keep them out, then perhaps your first choice should be to see whether sound and light will do the trick; by arranging a speaker and perhaps Christmas lights to flash?

Neil

Thank You All for the answers. I am familiar with HV I work with gas laser supplies and am also an electronics tech where I work, been bitten a few times by tube (valve) amplifiers and it's not fun. A picture is worth 1000 words so...

As you can see, the HV portion is far above any human's reach.

The problem is I've seen deer jump over 8 foot, 2.4 Meter fences when they're hungry for the garden goodies. Incredible but true. I've seen it.

Lights and sounds don't work. Tried that too. Motion activated auto (car) horn and strobe light. I thought that the arcing and sparking might deter them. If I kept it to 50-60 Hz maybe RFI wouldnt be a problem?

(Don't know if my metric to English Imperial calculations are correct :)

Wouldn't they only hit the electrified part of the fence when they're in mid leap? Makes it it a bit difficult to turn back.

Is there any mileage in planting some sacrificial food outside the fence or would that just attract more deer?

We have wild deer in this part of the world & I know that people have tried all sorts to keep them excluded. We also have trouble with wild boar, they're a whole different set of problems.

I wouldn't recommend it for several reasons; including those cited in other posts. At 50 - 60 Hz you will generate significant RIV (radio influence voltage) and TVI (television interference). If you do elect to proceed, check generated RIV in the vicinity of the energized fence with an AM radio tuned to around 1 MHz.

Your proposed fence layout would probably be effective but not because of the electrification. Corona discharges and the resulting light and noise would temporarily deter them but deer and most other wildlife become accustomed to their surroundings. If the fence is energized for significant times, the light and noise associated with it would just become part of the normal background noise.

You mentioned seeing deer clearing 8 ft high fences. Looks like yours is 11 ft high. I think I'd go for height without the electricity. Why not just stack 2 courses of the 6 ft wire mesh fence to achieve a 12 ft high enclosure? I would think that, along with an access gate, would solve your problem.

Why not just buy a gun? Venison can be quite tasty.

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>>Wouldn't they only hit the electrified part of the fence when they're in mid leap? Makes it it a bit difficult to turn back."

Yeah it would! I'm hoping the HV could be heard/seen/sensed before the jump.

"

>>Is there any mileage in planting some sacrificial food outside the fence or would that just attract more deer?"

I think that they would still go in the garden.

I imagine wild boar would be a whole set of wild and dangerous different problems!

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Why not just buy a gun? Venison can be quite tasty.

I dont care for vennison. I have a 12 ga shotgun but I have a hard time killing things.

>>it would just become part of the normal background noise.

You'are probably right.

>>Why not just stack 2 courses of the 6 ft wire mesh fence to achieve a 12 ft high enclosure? I would think that, along with an access gate, would solve your problem.

Mainly expense/ time constraints. It's "plantintg season" here

>>They do seem to keep the weeds clear of the fences.

See above picture. The lowest charged line is above the top of the fence.

I like the motion-activated sprinkler idea the best -I may try that. I'll have to "globalspec" and find an electric 120v actuator water-valve.

Thanks Everyone!!!

Cheers!

Steve

Another cheap fix is get an outside dog, big enough that the deer see it as a deterant. This work really well at my Dads place.

Jim

See my avitar! -that's our dog; Fairly big dog with loud bark! The dog pen is located next to the garden about 20 ft away! The deer are getting braver every year. Thanks for the suggestion though!

There are some chemical-based deterents for deer on the market. One called Liquid Fence (and some other similar ones) use olefactory channels to deter the deer. I believe they use putrified egg. Another chemical can be sprayed on the garden vegetables but is so bitter to the deer that they will only go after the vegetable once. These chemicals should only be sprayed on the leafy portion of the plants as they will be bitter to humans too.

Why not include the garden in the dog run.

Free fertilizer for the garden and fun & exercise for the dog.

I think everyone is just concerned about the fact that we live in such a litigious society. Just let one person get zapped, and you and your wife may be doing your next gardening project out of a cardboard box.

But you know the local lay of your land better than we do.

Vermin- the lowest "hot wire" would be 9 feet in the air. The person to get zapped would have to bring a ladder into our yard to get up that high! ( I know in my original post I said 7 ft. but I had to re-think that..) Thanks

Guest- I like it! I'll mention that to my wife (it's her garden) but I'm sure that there will be some reason that the dog cannot be allowed free-run of the garden...but...maybe not!

Guest- Liquid Fence- Hmmm -I've never heard of that . And bitter leaves- I'll make a note of that to try to find that chemical. Thanks!

Here it is

Looks promising.

Thanks everyone, my better-half appreciates it! And so do I.

These ideas are better than a million volt fence :)

How many tomatoes does a snake eat? And can you tell by the bumps?

I give up Vermin--is this a joke or riddle? I guess 12 and no.

I have absolutely no idea! I think I was under the influence when I wrote that.

"If you type, don't drink. If you drink, don't type... Ahhh! What the hell!"

I know . I'm a member of PL (a laser forum) and frequently am making an idiot of myself while TWI

speaking of.. your new signature..LOL ..

Well, they're always talking about your sight... I think that goes without saying. But what have we heard about the other senses? I could add "don't try to feel the beam, neither!" I know that one from first-hand (one still remaining) experience.

You need to talk to the guy in this video clip about feeling lasers. http://www.videosift.com/video/Laser-magic

Very impressive!!! And quite imaginary new magic. I do, however, know how some of it was done. Still very clever. Thanks!

Just a thought... Have you ever seen yard apes climb?

I would suggest you go to a tractor supply co and by an electric fence unit for cows of sheep fencing. A square net sheep fence might suit you, they are normally nylon rope strands with small wire strands woven in to them, you will have to check out the height availability. The standard units run of 12V batteries, either a Eveready type that fits in the unit of a car battery connected externally. The systems are usually in the region of 1000v capacitive discharge with a very low current. These are approved and proven devices, mains powered versions are available and are capable of supplying fences over 20miles long. Because the return path of the current is through the ground, it is best to keep the fence area clear of overgrowth that will short the fence, and if low level protection is not required a non conductive lower section should be used, this is typically incorporated into the square type sheep net. I know a few people who are able to hold onto live electric cow fences without reacting like most people, they claim to feel only a warming or tingling sensation, but for everything else included bulls it is a good deterrent.

We have a "horse box" designed for large animals (it works --ouch!) and the nylon-type wire inter-woven electric fence. I just haven't had much luck with it keeping the deer out. I guess I'll try running them 15 feet up this time: 1 hot, 1 ground, 1 hot 1 ground etc.

This is a quote from a letter in today's Daily Telegraph newspaper;

"We have found that the one thing that deer hate is the smell of Wrights coal tar soap. We have hung bars around the garden, particularly at the entrance, and it really works."

I don't know if coal tar soap is available in your part of the world, it's a very old fashioned product but maybe it's worth a try.

Of course! good point, we should have thought of this sort of thing before. We all (I think all) know that most animals sense of smell is extremely acute, so we should have thought along the lines of "what smell do deer detest"... I'll take your word for it that deer don't like coal tar soap!

Just before us engineers sign off, there will still be some vector calculations to be made with respect to down-wind smells... it will need to be tried / hung all around the veggie garden (before someone says it doesn't work).

I've heard that deer REALLY hate the smell of loaded 12 Ga. shotguns! I suggest you hang a bunch of shotguns (by their triggers, of course) around your garden. When you hear the boom! You'll know it's time to fire up the stove - or possibly time to dig a hole for Rover.

Thanks! I'll give it a try if the electrified metal bowls with the peanut-butter and molasses start to fail. They seem to be working so far...

Is this the stuff? : http://www.britsuperstore.com/acatalog/Wrights_Coal_Tar_Soap_Original.html

That's the one.

I had to hold myself back just then, that peanut butter & molasses sounds tasty.

Hehe, it seems to be working but the 7-8KV is probably not very tasty.

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