Previous in Forum: Determination Of Power Factor in Three Phase System   Next in Forum: Shorted Coils Repair Question
Close
Close
Close
8 comments
Rate Comments: Nested
Power-User

Join Date: Nov 2011
Posts: 286
Good Answers: 15

VTs / Potential Transformer for Protection Relay

02/14/2014 6:21 AM

Guys - Do we have any VT / potential transformer gurus out there?

I'm looking at a VT on the end of an 11kV generator. The VT is 11kV/110V with only the 3 phases brought out. L1 and L3 have fuses and L2 has a link. L2 is also through a link to earth. The star point is there but not brought out.

We are installing a new protection relay which needs all 3 phases and the star point brought out.

A comment has been made to say leave L2 grounded but ensure the star point doesn't go to ground. Surely we would be better grounding the star point. Does anyone have any experience of this?

Register to Reply
Pathfinder Tags: potential transformer Protection relay VT
User-tagged by 1 user
Interested in this topic? By joining CR4 you can "subscribe" to
this discussion and receive notification when new comments are added.

Good Answers:

These comments received enough positive votes to make them "good answers".

"Almost" Good Answers:

Check out these comments that don't yet have enough votes to be "official" good answers and, if you agree with them, vote them!
2
Guru

Join Date: May 2010
Location: Liverpool, NY
Posts: 961
Good Answers: 131
#1

Re: VTs / Potential Transformer for Protection Relay

02/14/2014 9:33 AM

Are you sure this is a full 3-phase VT? And that the secondary has a star point? It sounds to me like you may have an open delta VT:

That would make sense if the L2 is grounded. It is a very common VT configuration. If you need wye-configured VTs, you may need to install 3 single L-N VTs instead of this one, unless you can find a 3-phase wye VT single unit.

__________________
To get the right answers, first you need to ask the right questions.
Register to Reply Good Answer (Score 2)
Power-User

Join Date: Nov 2011
Posts: 286
Good Answers: 15
#2
In reply to #1

Re: VTs / Potential Transformer for Protection Relay

02/14/2014 11:22 AM

We have someone trying to get details off the VT. What you have suggested makes a lot of sense and explains why L1 and L3 are fused and L2 is a link.

Register to Reply
Guru
United Kingdom - Member - New Member

Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: Resting under the Major Oak
Posts: 4347
Good Answers: 181
#3
In reply to #1

Re: VTs / Potential Transformer for Protection Relay

02/14/2014 8:24 PM

Peter,

you've just answered something that's been in the back of my mind for years.

The first gear I worked on was Whip & Bourne and they were Yy for the VT's.

It just carried it on as "the norm" in my mind.

I'm ashamed to say how many makes of 11KV gear I've worked on without question.

I'm an old dog, you've taught me a new trick.

Thank you.

__________________
The reports of my death are greatly exaggerated.
Register to Reply
Associate

Join Date: Feb 2009
Posts: 35
#4

Re: VTs / Potential Transformer for Protection Relay

02/15/2014 12:07 AM

The VT is probably a 3phase British make to standards BS 81, BS2046 or BS3941.

The most modern BS for this VT is BS7729 & a schmematic is included in all the BS's referred to above.

If you are now contemplating installing a more modern relay this 3PhUVT will not be usable & the 3PhUVT will have to be replaced with 3-1PhEarthed VT's to IEC 60044-2, BS7625 or a 3Ph5Limb to BS7729.

This may open up a "can of worms" as the original 3PhUVT(3Ph3W) was inversion free, the replacements(3Ph4W) may not be so due to neutral distortion.

The grouding is only for safety, you can change provided you earth the secondary at one point only.

Register to Reply Score 1 for Good Answer
Power-User

Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Hyderabad
Posts: 343
Good Answers: 22
#5

Re: VTs / Potential Transformer for Protection Relay

02/15/2014 1:08 PM

y-phase grounding of VT secondary in generator feeders is quite an established practice. This is especially relevant for generators with high resistance grounded neutral.

IEEE242 has good discussion on the benefits of this arrangement.

__________________
Raghunath
Register to Reply
Active Contributor

Join Date: Nov 2012
Posts: 21
#6

Re: VTs / Potential Transformer for Protection Relay

02/16/2014 11:16 AM

install a 5 limb 3 ph VT. 3 limb VT is for 3P 3W system not for3P4w. in 3P3W system Y ph always earthed as it is a reference for 2 element metering. generally in 11 KV system PT is used for metering only a there is no directional element in O/C relays

Register to Reply Score 1 for Good Answer
Active Contributor

Join Date: Feb 2014
Location: India
Posts: 11
#7

Re: VTs / Potential Transformer for Protection Relay

02/16/2014 11:48 AM

Take all the three phases out and the neutral grounded to the protection Relay.That would be sufficient but disconnect the y phase earthing, instead of y phase we use to ground neutral and that neutral closes its path through the common point of relay star point.

Register to Reply
Power-User

Join Date: Nov 2011
Posts: 286
Good Answers: 15
#8

Re: VTs / Potential Transformer for Protection Relay

02/17/2014 2:46 AM

Many thanks for your useful comments. We have managed to get to the VT and have found A,B,C,N and A1,B1, C1 and N1 coming out on terminal posts. Likely the VT is 30 years old.

Register to Reply
Register to Reply 8 comments

Good Answers:

These comments received enough positive votes to make them "good answers".

"Almost" Good Answers:

Check out these comments that don't yet have enough votes to be "official" good answers and, if you agree with them, vote them!
Copy to Clipboard

Users who posted comments:

avra.setcl (1); Instruform (1); PeterT (1); raghun (1); silverfox (2); TNEB kathirasan (1); TonyS (1)

Previous in Forum: Determination Of Power Factor in Three Phase System   Next in Forum: Shorted Coils Repair Question

Advertisement