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Raiders Golden Head Puzzle

07/16/2014 4:32 PM

We all know the scene at the start of Raiders of the Lost Ark, where Indiana Jones weighs out a bag of sand so it matches the golden head on a pedestal. He replaces the head with the bag of sand so as not to trip the trap. As he walks away the bag of sand slowly starts descending into the stone setting off all kinds of mayhem.

My question is, if you are the engineer living in this ancient civilization commissioned to build this trap, how would you go about designing the golden head pedestal trap?

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#1

Re: Raiders Golden Head Puzzle

07/16/2014 4:47 PM

Easy, the weight is holding down a piece of twine that is attached to an opposing weighted lever that when released starts the flow of sand that triggers a larger lever that releases another weighted lever and so on and so on.....

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#2
In reply to #1

Re: Raiders Golden Head Puzzle

07/16/2014 5:06 PM

Oh, SE... Rube Goldberg would give you such a scolding.

Why make it simply when it can be complicated and expensive and wonderful?

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#4
In reply to #2

Re: Raiders Golden Head Puzzle

07/16/2014 7:29 PM

"...when it can be complicated and expensive and wonderful..."

.

Throw in the average throng's enthusiastic acceptance, perhaps strong preference, for such devices as substitute for plot development and twists.

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Asking an audience to follow along the same mental path for an hour and a half is no longer reasonable. Most adults and adolescents lack sufficient attention assets to handle continual streaming nontrivial feeds for a number of minutes exceeding the running count of their own attended birthday celebrations.

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Replacing large amounts of grey-matter-taxing plot development with alternatives like, Golden Rubeburgers brand rubyberg gold, refreshes audiences with reassurances that their unflinching acceptance of such involved wonderment is incontrovertible evidence of their obvious genius.....reassurances not at the mercy of fair weather friends of 'fact' and 'reason' notoriety.

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On a different issue, a scolding or two might be headed your own way. Though it is less than clear if the probabilities of various such scolding, would that these were and anteced by a particular outcome being in actual route, favored Noam Chomsky or Nim Chimpski, it is clear that Lindley Murray would not be realistically favored as, much like Rube, Lindley is not in a stage of life given to issuing scolds.

.

The grammatical mis-structure and flagrant loquacious affronts that comprise the bulk of this comment are my effort turn the path of the ChimpChom ski-bus and its certain wrath safely away from you..... towards me. That I will survive this selfless act is not a certainty, but with knowledge of what is on the way, there is at least some chance that I might remain in that group capable of delivering scolding, were the need to arise. You are welcome.

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#5
In reply to #4

Re: Raiders Golden Head Puzzle

07/16/2014 7:39 PM

OMG I fell asleep three sentences in......what did he say?

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#7
In reply to #5

Re: Raiders Golden Head Puzzle

07/16/2014 8:26 PM

It's not important.

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#14
In reply to #5

Re: Raiders Golden Head Puzzle

07/17/2014 12:18 AM

Just pointing out how many people these days have fallen into attentruptcy. Even the cheapest literary devices are beyond reach as they cannot afford to pay attention beyond what is bright shiny and brief.

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...the predictable outcome being, all else pales in comparison to the immediacy of glitz....how could anything unconsidered and un-understood compete with what dazzles?

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#15
In reply to #14

Re: Raiders Golden Head Puzzle

07/17/2014 12:36 AM

Seen any of the newer special effects movies?

There is no connection to reality, at all.

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#16
In reply to #15

Re: Raiders Golden Head Puzzle

07/17/2014 1:08 AM

I agree wholeheartedly with the claims you make in your comments in this part of this discussion...talking about #7 and #15...

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re: #7; Absolutely! If this discussion ranked as 'important' in part or whole, it would be cause for concern.

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re: #15; Exactly! No critical consideration/understanding required nor desired/accepted. All unreal glitz.

.

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What I seem to be missing is how these relate to the comments to which you replied. The spot-on assertions seem to be at odds with the context/tone/implied meanings.

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#17
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Re: Raiders Golden Head Puzzle

07/17/2014 1:16 AM

One of the problems with an anonymous forum, such as this, is the lack of connection to context/tone/implied meanings that goes with the lack of inflection, knowing the responder well, seeing the responder's facial expressions, etc.

I'm confounded all the time by statements made here, some to me; others not.

It just goes with territory in an anonymous forum.

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#22
In reply to #17

Re: Raiders Golden Head Puzzle

07/17/2014 11:58 AM

I don't consider this an anonymous forum. Seems to be a seductive fantasy to large group of members here. It's no group of slouches either... which makes me re-review when this comes up, as it has previously, is presently and will again.

.

In that direction, 'pseudonymous' is about as close as it gets and with pseudonymity sounds pleasantly familiar and reassuring, it's bit misleading. oddly enough, certainty about pseudonymity offers no guaranty or even in much insight into anonymity.

.

I find this a fascinating discussion. It is peculiar that so many hold so tenaciously to assumptions that don't seem to bear out.....

.

... assumptions like;

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That the name linked to your social security number is more real than other names that you recognize as refer to you.

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That all the various people someone interacts with in a day, that 'know' that person by some part of their government registered name 'know' the essence of that person far better than if a pen name had been substituted.

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That all these people are interacting with a unitary individual in which consistent values and codes can be seen to influence how they wield their agency as whatever their government registered verbal/font collar command word is.

.

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Those seem like fairly fat unsupported assumptions.

.

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Oh, I guess I should offer some support for my contention that this is not an anonymous forum. Declaring repeatedly on this forum a specific, credible, threat of greivous bodily harm to certain national political figures and their families, would almost certainly remove any ideas about anonymity to who so ever is foolish enough to be the test subject.

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#28
In reply to #14

Re: Raiders Golden Head Puzzle

07/22/2014 1:56 AM

"Just pointing out ..."

You mean all this time you could've said this instead of ALL THAT? What happened, mate? Someone cut the line to your compressor?

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#30
In reply to #28

Re: Raiders Golden Head Puzzle

07/23/2014 4:56 PM

"...You mean all this time you could've said this instead of ALL THAT?..."

.

As long as you are committed to drawing no distinction between discussion and meta-discussion, then certainly.

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#18
In reply to #1

Re: Raiders Golden Head Puzzle

07/17/2014 7:00 AM

But the sand goes down when placed on the pedestal, if it were on a piece of twine the sand would go up. The twine must be in tension.

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#3

Re: Raiders Golden Head Puzzle

07/16/2014 6:13 PM

I wouldn't put a pressure plate trap in the pedestal, that's too obvious and in my opinion prone to false tripping using the primitive materials available, the environment its in (humid, fluctuating night and day temperature cycles, etc) and the long duration it has to continue to work.

I would put a trap around the pedestal instead which would hold a FAKE idol, the real idol being hidden behind one of the first spitting dart head traps (accessible without having to step on to the pressure triggers). Who would think to look there!

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#6
In reply to #3

Re: Raiders Golden Head Puzzle

07/16/2014 8:02 PM

EEEEYYYAAAAAHHHHHHH!!!!!!!

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#8

Re: Raiders Golden Head Puzzle

07/16/2014 8:53 PM

He should have held his hand on the pedestal top while he exchanged the bag of sand for the idol....anybody can see that bag of sand is not going to weigh as much as the gold....it would have to be like three times what he's got there....

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Pr-8AP0To4k

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#9
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Re: Raiders Golden Head Puzzle

07/16/2014 9:23 PM

It's movie sand.

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#10
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Re: Raiders Golden Head Puzzle

07/16/2014 10:25 PM

1 qt of sand weighs about 3.2 lbs....1 qt of gold weighs about 40.3 lbs.....So the volume of the sand would have to be 12.59 times the volume of the gold....subject to arms length 3 rd party verification....

http://www.aqua-calc.com/calculate/volume-to-weight

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#11
In reply to #10

Re: Raiders Golden Head Puzzle

07/16/2014 10:29 PM

Silly goose. Movie sand can weigh as much as the scene demands.

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#12
In reply to #10

Re: Raiders Golden Head Puzzle

07/17/2014 12:10 AM

Well sure, with ordinary silica sand, that would be true.

In places like that, Tung-sand brand cubic tungsten sand anodized sand-blonde is the norm though. Parallax and foreshortening exactly offset what is lost to packing efficiency...didn't you see him pour some out to get the weight right?

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#19
In reply to #10

Re: Raiders Golden Head Puzzle

07/17/2014 7:57 AM

Someone had already hollowed out the idol taking the bulk of its gold. What was left was sand held together with a thin gold shell.

Keep in mind that we see the idol from the back. The idol figure was hunched over making it seem bigger from behind.

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#23
In reply to #19

Re: Raiders Golden Head Puzzle

07/17/2014 12:01 PM

Smells like the dirty deeds of a bullion bank.

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#20
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Re: Raiders Golden Head Puzzle

07/17/2014 10:06 AM

Its a hollow head, Stupid!

Ya know!

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#21
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Re: Raiders Golden Head Puzzle

07/17/2014 10:44 AM

"The Chachapoyan Fertility Idol was a solid gold statue, six inches tall, representing Pachamama, the Chachapoyan goddess of fertility. The idol was hidden by the tribe's priests in a temple deep within the jungles of Peru. Braving the temple's deadly traps to stare into the idol's eyes became a rite of passage for young Chachapoyan warriors."

"A Princeton archaeologist named Forrestal disappeared in the jungles of Peru while attempting to recover the fertility idol of Pachamama from the Temple of the Chachapoyan Warriors in Chachapoyas in 1935.

In 1936, Indiana Jones, on commission from the National Museum and working from Forrestal's notes, managed to locate the temple and extract the statue, only to have it immediately stolen by rogue archaeologist René Emile Belloq. Belloq promptly unloaded the artifact in Marrakesh, where Jones later re-appropriated it from the shop of antiquities dealer Saad Hassim."

http://indianajones.wikia.com/wiki/Chachapoyan_Fertility_Idol

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#25
In reply to #21

Re: Raiders Golden Head Puzzle

07/17/2014 9:27 PM

But in the movie its hollow!

It still is a stage prop!

(you win)!

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#29
In reply to #21

Re: Raiders Golden Head Puzzle

07/22/2014 3:25 AM

The Chachapoyan fertility idol is based upon, and is about the same size as, an Aztec fertility idol from that same region (Peru). The movie prop had a volume of about 300 cubic inches, or about 5000 cc. Were it made of solid gold it would weigh about 220 pounds (approx 100 kg) - the weight of a large man.

Were that a real idol and Jones a real person, he would not have spirited it off without considerable effort - and a hand-truck. That paltry bag of sand wouldn't have made a gnat's arse worth of difference when in fact Jones' own body weight would not have sufficed as compensation.

Now, were that bag to contain a slightly smaller volume of osmium? Well, Mr. Jones, it might work (consult the script) but good bluddy luck placing it with one hand whilst taking the idol in the other.

For a trap I'd have embedded a slender stone column in the idol's base at the time the idol was cast. The column would protrude and freely move through the pedestal, and connect to a stone lever several meters below floor level which, when moved either way, acted to release a weight that drove the rest of the mechanism - including releasing more weights as necessary to keep the viewer's interest. Stone is brittle and easily broken but hard to cut with hand tools unless you shatter it. Chances are a raider would break it (as intended) in trying to free the idol, the column would descend under its own weight, operating the lever and the rest is celluloid.

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#13
In reply to #9

Re: Raiders Golden Head Puzzle

07/17/2014 12:12 AM

And I don't think the movie prop idol is a lump of solid gold either.

;)

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#24

Re: Raiders Golden Head Puzzle

07/17/2014 7:28 PM

Even though the Indiana Jones stories were fiction, there were some elements of truth that they were based on. The crystal skulls, arc of the covenant were used and based on truth, at least as far as we can determine. Not to say it is true, but there is some fact involved. Makes for a good story anyway.

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#26
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Re: Raiders Golden Head Puzzle

07/18/2014 3:15 PM

"...The crystal skulls, arc of the covenant were used and based on truth..."

.

While it is true that those are indeed stories, setting the bar that low risks depriving such words of utility....

.

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#27
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Re: Raiders Golden Head Puzzle

07/18/2014 4:03 PM

For you to say that, "The crystal skulls, arc of the covenant were used and based on truth" is indeed a far reach of imagination, not based on fact.

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