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Water Down the Drain & the Coriolis Effect

Posted March 14, 2007 9:33 AM by masu

In the recent CR4 threads, Aeroplanes and Water Down the Drain and Does One's Hemisphere Effect the Direction of a Bullet's Spin? the subject of the way water rotates as it drains from a container, being hemispheric dependent, has come to the forefront of the discussion. The myth is that as water drains from a container the direction of rotation in the northern hemisphere is opposite to that in the southern hemisphere.

The effect that most people attribute to producing the driving force behind this rotation is called the coriolis effect and is related to the rotation of the Earth. Conventional scientific wisdom, however, states that force generated by the coriolis effect is way too small to initiate any rotation and therefore, any observed rotation is due to some sort of asymmetry in the drain, container or way the water enters.

In the thread Aeroplanes and Water Down the Drain I proposed that we engineer and construct some sort of simple device that could test the effect. This would then be shipped to several CR4 members to test for the effect at numerous locations across the globe. The results would then be collated on CR4 and settle the argument once and for all.

So far James P. Hollen, dkwarner, PlbMak, Yanthram and of course myself have indicated they are interested;

So are you interested in being involved in a global CR4 experiment? How would you go about building a device to test the effect? What do you think could be involved, is it coriolis or is there some other effect coming into play?

I believe this is a first for CR4 and it looks like it could be a lot of fun and set a precedent. So, if you are interested let us know and give us your thoughts.

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Re: Water Down the Drain & the Coriolis Effect

05/16/2007 4:39 AM

What about display settings masu ? Things like open windows and air conditioning (there must be something as it's on the Equator ). Also , what about people moving around a display room causing air circulation. I don't think it would take much to sustain an established flow pattern. Does sunlight strike the display in a differential manner , this could also be a cause. It's hard to speculate wthout having seen it , but an explanation for 'natural' cause would be helpful to hear.

ps - most manuals seem to have some unique language , understood by only those who read them . I don't know the languages name , but it's probably made you utter it by now ! All manuals have this effect.

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#103
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Re: Water Down the Drain & the Coriolis Effect

05/16/2007 5:28 AM

"Manual" means by hand; too often the writers take this literally. In such cases, you should on no account try to read it with your eyes.

Fyz

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Re: Water Down the Drain & the Coriolis Effect

05/16/2007 6:10 AM

I'd never thought of this rather useful interpretation of 'manual '. I may morph into a 'pig-in-clover' with happiness !

I slightly misread the point in my 101. No explanation for natural (as in planetary ) cause , comes to my mind.

Having looked at mapping methods etc , I am still confused about knowing en exact latitude wrt Earths cente and exact radius wrt Earths axis. I'll take as read that it doesn't matter , and persue this slowly for my own edification. I've elaborated someplace else , so I'll leave you all to progess for now.

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Re: Water Down the Drain & the Coriolis Effect

05/16/2007 7:43 AM

Earth's centre - that's a long way down. "Exact latitude" - no such thing really, as even the exact location of the axis is time dependent, and the Earth's shape is not exactly constant. If you want full grizzly detail, you could spend a lifetime trying to understand the way GPS and Glonass have defined things - but this would likely be a truncated lifetime due to near inevitable suicide.

Fyz

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Re: Water Down the Drain & the Coriolis Effect

05/16/2007 8:03 AM

It was those precise points that were annoying me. Fear not , I am tencious and have a strong sense of survival . You'll find it hard to avoid my irritating posts !

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#107
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Re: Water Down the Drain & the Coriolis Effect

05/16/2007 5:40 PM

Technical manuals are always a source of amusement. Especially those that have been translated from another language by a non technical person. The person who stated "When all else fails, read the instructions." obviously hadn't read some of the very soft translations of what was probably only a reasonable manuals to start with.

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Re: Water Down the Drain & the Coriolis Effect

05/17/2007 12:45 AM

I've been discussing this exact point with another (non- European) member for a while now . I think I may initiate a general thread on this. It may lead to some funny examples , but more importantly it may reveal some points of general use. Keep your eyes out on general discussion.

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#109
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Re: Water Down the Drain & the Coriolis Effect

05/17/2007 12:53 AM

"...I think I may initiate a general thread on this..."

And you have a bunch of professional technical writers here, to assist you, should this turn into a blog.

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Re: Water Down the Drain & the Coriolis Effect

05/17/2007 1:46 AM

Thanks Yuval. I was aware of Steve and Chris's writing - They probably don't have a lot of time to discuss extensively , because of numerous call on their time in general CR4 work. I hope both they (and others ) find time to post something on "Lost in Translation" which I just put up.

fyi - check your mail , new thread creation date , and a recent posting I made. My radar must have been twitching last night.

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Re: Water Down the Drain & the Coriolis Effect

05/16/2007 5:25 AM

No, and I'd be amazed if it were mere confusion. This is a tourist museum, and the tourists won't be prepared to wait however long it takes for any initial movement to settle. The only way to get a systematically directed vortex either in a short time or on a continuous basis is by constructing the experiment so that there is a systematic bias.

The bigger difficulty is to avoid an accidental vortex appearing in the centre bowl in the presence of draughts due to visitor movement; assuming the bowls are all apparently identical, this suggests quite a degree of loss in the bowls, and therefore a totally deliberate asymmetry.

Fyz

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