What Is This Screw Called?

Hi ky,

That's a weird looking screwbolt!

"The one shown was welded and is a one off".

Did you mean it was welded together and is "one of a kind"?

What type of roof is it used with?

-John

I made 144 of these bastards and I was a first time welder. It was a steep learning curve and included some grinding and filing and what not.They all do what they are supposed to. I just need millions of them and with my experience in welding I'd rather find a name for it and have them made.

Using it on roofs is only one of the applications.

We are a fastener manufacturer in Germany and we have been producing millions of this kind of fastener for a number of years. Our company's name is EJOT. The product is called "Solar Fastener". Upper and lower part (with different diameters) are welded together. It was the first product of this kind to be approved by the German Institute of Construction Technology. Take a look at the product at http://www.ejot.com/ejot.de/Befestigungssysteme_fuer_Solaranlagen--4357,websiteLang__en.htm

Hi Guest

You are a bit late with your information and suggestion. I have by now designed a system which is much easier to deal with than what you are proposing. It is now going through the approval process and after testing and verification should be on the market very soon.

I am not using it in a solar panel application. Those difficulties have been solved. What I have come up with could be implemented in many applications. It's a shame I can't show you any details (Yet) but I am sure you would be surprised how to save on parts and cost to manufacture my standoffs.

We had a Cyclone (Yasi) recently and one of the few things still in place were my standoffs (Prototypes). They could not have been in a better test environment than the real thing. I have heard that quiet a few people with solar panels (on corrugated iron) on their roofs complained about water leaks through the entry holes of the attachment system.

Constant lift and vibration, in this case 15hours of cyclonic winds. I am not sure if your 'solar fastener' system was used.

I am looking forward to my product being tested by the German Institute of Construction Technology (Bundesbauamt?). I am sure that the certification I will have by then, will satisfy their needs and requirements.

"Gottes Muehlen malen langsam"

Questions:

How did you find this post after all these years?

Are you in Germany?

Could you make a contact with EJOT management?

Would Australian standards and computer simulation be similar to the German requirements?

I am sure they are but they would want to do their own testing anyway, I'm certain. To be honest, I miss the German attitude towards perfection sometimes, just sometimes.

Thanks for your reply, Ky.

Hi Ky,

pure coincendence that I found your post. Since we are planning to enter the Australian solar energy market with this product, I was searching the internet for similar parts being used in Australia. All I had found so far were the old-fashioned hanger/rafter bolts, some other labour-intensive, time-consuming solutions and the simple L-foot standoffs for solar panels, all of which I would never trust in terms of strength and watertightness. All of a sudden your photo came up and I just wanted to let you know, that we have been doing that kind of stuff for years. Good that it's possible to make a guest comment.

Your questions:

The German Institute of Construction Technology is the DIBt (Deutsches Institut fuer Bautechnik). See here: http://www.dibt.de/index_eng.html

Yes, I am in Germany, working for the EJOT Holding and being responsible for the business development of the EJOT Group. So I am part of the management and can make any contact you like.

Australian standards and computer simulation similar to German requirements? No idea (sorry, I'm a commercial guy ...). But when we entered the US market last year, everybody said that our national technical approval for this product is the most demanding they have ever seen. German perfection ... as you said.

I could send you the English translation of the approval if I had your e-mail address. Here's mine: hkortschakowski@ejot.de

So who are you and what are you doing? Any roots in Germany ... seems like.

And by the way: no, our solar fastener did not have to resist an Australian cyclone yet, but I'm absolutely sure it would.

Best greetings,

Holger

Hi Holger

Thanks for the reply. We usually don't publish email addresses here. You should become a member of CR4 and then one has the chance of choosing Private Mail. We are still a bit "durch den wind" around here, as they say.

We have all lost a lot of time and everything has to be rescheduled. Long story short I have had a look at what your company is doing and I am surprised you are not on the Australian market yet. Thanks for the links.

I'll be in touch, Ky.

Hab ein email geschickt. Gut ding braucht weile, Ky.

I have seen this type of fastener before and I will look through my files - it appears to be a metal or corrugated type fastener. It looks like a wood screw thread on the left end that would screw into a structure - the head of the hex is designed to hold without pulling thru the material - it also appears to have a rubber washer or flat grommet for holding and sealing. I will look into it and try to come up with a mfg and description.. Have you any other pictures of it or the fastener being in the holding position.. Can you describe where it is used and on what ??

Good luck

There you go, it's not a screw or a bolt. It's a fastener.

Thank all for your reply, although I still don't know what to call this screw/bolt/fastener/break away lag bolt with double function.

Moto has diligently covered the dangers of altering/modifying any specifically designed and certified implements being used. Not wanting to do the same was the reason to find a company that could manufacture these (Ky-Bolts, for now) and still conform with required specs.

For IP reasons I cannot get into what it will do in the end. I can only say that it will have to withstand something like the forces your standard roof-screw is subjected to.

The Boston Tunnel will have to wait. I will get in touch with Mc.Master Carr and find out what they think about it. I suppose they will be able to assess the alterations and their effect on strength and durability.

Another part of my question was aimed to find out if there was a nomenclature for screws, like there is for the plant world etc. It would have made my enquiry a bit easier. How would I have described the item without having the photo as a reference.

Even with the photo as a reference there has not been any conclusive naming done.

I am after a "standard screw with hex head, inserted with thread to allow for M4 bolt to be fastened to the hex head once the screw is in position". Would you know what I am talking about without the photo as a reference? There must be a "talk" for this.

Thanks for the help. Ky.

Hello ky,

This question has come up before. Take a look at this.

-John

Thanks John.

Does this confirm that there is no Braille for screws etc? I think it does and I am surprised. See what happens. Ky.

a very useful tool for identifying components is....wait for it.....supplier catalogs! Particularly those one finds in machine shops etc. (Grainger is a favorite)

I have come to depend on these publications very strongly. I am constantly looking for a doo-ma-hickkey I once saw God knows where. I ref. the catalogs for ID, then a good eng. ref for specifications.

Happy tinkering.

Charles

I don't know the proper name for it, but if you were to check under a wooden table with bolted on legs ,you would find a couple bolt/screws like that holding each leg on and tight. If that is what you are looking for ,the next place to look would be at a furniture manufacturer.If they can't supply them, they can at least tell what they are called and where to get them.

"I will look into it and try to come up with a mfg and description"

I don't know what a mfg (manufacturing figures guide?) is but it sounds like it could help me find what I am after.

IP protection stops me for disclosing any more details. I hope you understand.

Thanks for your help. Ky.

mfg = manufacturer.

Or is it the stuff they put on Chinese food? I like Chinese food. mmmmmmm...Chinese food

That's it! A "Ky-Fastener".

Acme hex-nut headed roof screw, with optional pressure washer, grommet seal and acme-stud.

www.mcmaster.com

Looks like it will be great for mounting solar panels.

See if McMaster Carr will make them for you.

I would "double nut" it.

Isn't that, "acme hanger bolt (or screw)?

an 'ACME' thread is a thread type on which the crest has been removed (box thread) not a mfg. Acme threads are usually used for power transmission. The lead screw on a manual lathe, or on milling machine as well as on propellor shafts etc. are examples is an ACME cut.

After looking closely at it;

I'd call it a "break away lag bolt".

Technically it is described as an Acme hex-nut headed galvanized roof screw, with optional pressure washer, grommet seal and acme-stud.

Looks like it will be great for mounting solar panels... but...

Only problem is galling of the primary screw thread portion will rock and allow up-lift failure, as corrosion will wallow the steel and or wood penetration, over time; especially if there's any wind load or machinery vibration to the acme threaded stud.

You are directing thread "up-lift" to a soft steel, galvanized roof screw. It's not rated for the added tension or pressure, (especially after galvanizing). You may end up with liableness for modifying the manufacturer's intended use. I would think about through bolting and not cut corners.

If what you are attempting to fasten flies around during a storm, opening up the roof, you may be found negligent by violating the chain of liability. The washer will allow movement, unless you screw it down tight, ruining the seal.

My uncle had an issue when an engineer changed a roof joist bolt design on a Sears building. The first thing the insurance investigator did was come after the installer, not the engineering firm. (Forget about the 24 inches of ice on the roof because of clogged drains).

Had a file with the engineer's change order and signature not been maintained by the installer, (my uncle); his installation company would have been liable for a massive fine and his insurance rating would be ruined. Roof collapsed, no injuries.

I miss the SAE. I have watched it degrade for years in the name of speed on a construction site. Read up on the boys at the tunnel in Boston, and what a few dollars in epoxy, proper lag-bolts and poor process cost them.

They blamed the installers for allowing "pull away' during the cure time and not using enough rated fasteners.

...as if they were in charge of specifying the process or the location of the re-bar blocking attachment points.

Been there, done that with embeds. Nothing more aggravating.

These are common for installing corrugated roofing materials, fiberglass and tin, down here. As a machinist I would not use outside of designed application, and would hesitate at any lofty claims to do much more than roof the porch/shed/greenhouse/kids fort.

The problem with looking for a name, is that when it comes to something specialized like this, any combination of descriptive words that apply are likely to have already been used in more than one application. The same word can mean something quite different from one industry to another, especially jargon. Your best bet is either to go industry specific, as in talk to those that might use such a thing in an application as close to yours as possible, or talk to fastener manufacturers and see what they can come up with, as in what they have or are supplying to others for a similar application. But often, the manufacturers don't even know exactly what their custom products are used for, or what the limits of their application are, as they are producing to an engineered spec provided to them. In either case, the more detailed the description of your application, the better your odds of finding the right thing, and it may differ significantly from what you have come up with! I have been a mechanical designer for a long time, and in many different fields, and sourcing specialized fasteners is a common occurence. So A) Don't re-invent the wheel (odds are someone else has already picked up the engineering "tab"), B) Pick the right brains to pick, and C) If your not clear and concise about what your asking for, your not likely to get what you want. Hope this helps.

The nut part looks like a standard shear nut, they're used in automotive & security systems when a tamperproof fixing is needed.

The bolt is a common hanger bolt, wood screw threads on one end, and machine screw threads on the other.

What is this screw/bolt called? Is there a nomenclature for screws so that I could describe what I am after?

This just happen to be called a TEX Screw. There are two types, one for metal and the other for wood. They are commonly used for fastening corrugated roofing to metal C purlins or also of wood. They are self tapping and can be screwed directly using an electric drill with a hex wrench adapter.

Here is a sample image:

While I can not remember the name off hand, they are very common. Down here, in Florida, we use them to attach corrugated metal hurricane shutters over windows. The coarse threaded end screws in to the house, around the window frame. And we attach the shutter over the machine thread end with a wing nut. Very handy when you have to put up (and take down) hurricane panels several times a year.

Go figure.

I here 1/8" "Elcheapo Tin-filled Easy-Bend Wallboard Screws" are designed to hang hurricane wallpaper in Florida. I wonder why they break so easily?

*************************

"Just because you have been doing it wrong for 18 years, doesn't make it right... or ethical." - Unknown

Look up "Hanger Bolt"

Hi KY:

I have seen something similar to this (without the nut) used in the furniture industry to attach coffee and end-table legs to the body of the table. They can be purchased from Home Depot.

mechtech

You are absolutely right. I do remember having seen these on my 4 person mini dining/coffee table during my college days in early seventies used for exactly the same purpose. Makes for quick assembly/disassembly. If I recollect properly these were about 5/16" diameter.

Only difference is that the nut is a bit fancy. You can find these nuts too (not as tall though) in the "Machinery Handbook" by Industrial Press , only without the undercut.

This appears to be a form of Jack Screw. Primarily designed for installing a metal panel on the wall of a wooden structure.

The common name for the "bolt" part of this is a hanger bolt. See http://www.rockler.com/product.cfm?page=373&cookietest=1 for an example.

The washer is simply called a sealing washer.

Hex nuts are available with integrated washers, and the washer can either turn with the nut (truly one piece) or not (two pieces loosely swaged together). I think "STL Engineer" (on this site) gets involved with this stuff all the time, so could steer you in the right direction re finding a manufacturer, or simply getting the pieces from stock offerings.

The Item is "Hangermate" Threaded Rod Anchoring System.

Google Textron fastening systems

Google "HangerMate"

Sorry, forgot to include a US distributer for these. Can be purchased in a variety of sizes from Fastenal Industrial & Construction Supplies. They should have a Web site. Hope this helps.

Thank You All.

The baby has a name. Hanger Mate. Just what I was looking for. I could have saved my self a lot of time going to CR4 first. Then again, I would have not picked up some welding skills, which I will possibly never ever need again. Serendipity and her friends do amazing things.

I hope I can be as helpful to someone one day. Ky.

AH HA. I was having a senior moment. I though the hex head on this was a nut. Had I read Ky's post correctly, I would have been stumped -- I don't think I've come across these HangerMates. They look really handy.

There's all sorts of fixings out there. I'm still wondering if Ky needs the Hex bit to be there for some reason. No matter, it seems like the answers been provided. Like somebody said, checking Global Spec produces a mass of fastenings specialists. I'd have probably just shown a sketch to somebody if I saw a roofing contractor at work, since terminology varies a lot.

I practically invented the things because I needed just those. I did go around the hardware shop (Don't forget this is Magnetic Island) and only received the "Carp Look". There are no fancy catalogues just chicken-wire and 6m tall terracota vases if you know what I mean.

I wanted to mention since some time now, that CR4 has practically replaced my old ways of researching. Anything. Very helpful. Congratulations to this service.

Thanks Ky.

This type of screw is called Hilti roofing screw I think.

It should be called a laundry fastener!

That is called a head pin or lockbolt pin and collar system, and on it is a flange collar. I could not tell what type of head pin it is because there is only a partial piture of it. Here's some links to help you.

http://www.micometals.co.nz/PDF/fasteners/MICO_Huck.pdf

http://www.imperialinc.com/grp232.shtml

http://www.directindustry.com/industrial-manufacturer/lockbolt-78637.html?gclid=CO2EnbOctI0CFQ8aHgodXkm1tA

http://www.aboveboardelectronics.com/Avdel/structural/alrivet.html

Hope this helps. There is also a special tool for proper instalation.

http://www.alcoa.com/industrial/en/products/category.asp?country_id=999&market_id=32&market_cat_id=567&cat_id=562

Let me know if this helps.

New here. But I'll be watching.

MillWright

Hi Guest MillWright

Thank You for considering your time to solving my problem. CR4 is a good place to be if you need to solve a problem fast. Pay back time is just around the corner. If I can I will. Welcome to the fast and friendly world of CR4. Your input has helped me even further. Ky.

It think the unique thing about ky's fastener is that the head is internally threaded to receive a machine screw*: in other words, what he's showing is two pieces, a HangerMate with something screwed into it. When I first looked at it, I thought the head was a nut on a typical hanger bolt.

*or bolt, or threaded rod. Turns out that the international standard is now to call anything with a machine thread a bolt, whether or not a nut is used. I don't know that I'll ever adapt to this. I can't imagine going to my fastener store and asking for a box of 8-32 x 3/4" bolts.

I believe this is called a coachscrew rod. They come in different lengths and diameters. Most pipe hanger manufacturers such as Anvil/Grinnel, Erico, and PHD manufacture these.