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Small Hole Drilling

06/24/2015 6:50 PM

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Thanks Randall for the photo help {I was on a iPad no icons} From these two pictures can anyone help me identify how these holes were drilled? Punched, CNC etc.? Any help please!!! Thanks

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#1

Re: Small Hole Drilling

06/24/2015 7:14 PM

Can you give us an idea of the material and physical size?

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#2

Re: Small Hole Drilling

06/24/2015 7:45 PM

If I was designing a machine to make these holes, my machine would include a spiked roller with a gear matched perforated cylinder to punch these holes. Then again depending on the type of plastic material being used, the same geared roller and cylinder could just be strategically placed in the extrusion location before the plastic has finished curing. A strategically placed infrared laser beam might also be used to place these holes in a solid film.

Since you obviously are incapable of successfully reverse engineering somebody else's product, what are you willing to pay me to solve your problem?

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#3

Re: Small Hole Drilling

06/24/2015 7:55 PM

Yes thanks, the holes are drilled in a flat piece of high density polyethylene 2" x 48" x 1/8", approximately 1400 holes. Water flows through the holes under moderate pressure. Being a prototype we need about 8-10 pieces for testing to start before final nozzle is complete. Have been given some good ideas but haven't found anyone to do the work yet. Thanks Hook

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#4

Re: Small Hole Drilling

06/24/2015 8:07 PM

RedFred, well let's help you out since you make judgements without any information which is a very dangerous thing to do. Let's paint a simple picture for you. You are in the ambulance business and have a partner in another division handling the above project. Let's pretend that he took company money went to China had a few of these prototypes made and them all of a sudden was caught embezzling money from the project and somehow has disappeared with all the project plans and material. Let's also pretend that I have only a few pictures which I just found today after a long time looking and now trying to reconstruct my own project all over again. Or let's put it in your terms, I am trying to reverse engineer my own project that was started in another country! Maybe that will help you from jumping to conclusions you know nothing about. Have a nice day.... Hook

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#9
In reply to #4

Re: Small Hole Drilling

06/24/2015 11:26 PM

You are correct, I jump to judgements without enough information here because far too often insufficient information is provided to make an accurate assessment. Frequently my premature comments provoke more information when the person realizes they did not explain their situation well enough.

As for your embezzlement problems, I'm very sorry to hear you lost a partner from embezzlement. I lost a friend, too. He was accused, arrested and jailed for several months on the charge of embezzlement. A month before my friend's trial, the assistant manager (my boss) disappeared leaving his wife and infant twins. When he vanished, his wife found out that her husband had four bank accounts she didn't know about. These accounts and the one she knew about were now empty. The bank records for the four other accounts had deposits that coincided with the missing embezzled money. Charges against my friend were eventually dropped (months after the original trial date) and a paltry sum paid by the state for his time lost. To this day my former friend believes I some how played a part in this tragedy.

I offer a shoulder and maybe buy a pint for those having a hard day. I despise pity for any excuse.

I don't know why you think reverse engineering is a bad thing. It is an integral part of forensic analysis. Many companies do this to see if they can undercut their competitions fabrication costs. If you have your hands on a sample you maybe able to figure out how these holes were made under a microscope.

I still like the idea of a perforating roller.

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#10
In reply to #9

Re: Small Hole Drilling

06/25/2015 12:20 AM

The work piece is 1/8" thick, a rotating perforator is best used on thin films. Just sketch the interface between the tool and the workpiece as the tool approaches, broaches, and retracts, all while rotating. The resultant holes would be elongated, not be symmetrically round, and hardly be of nozzle quality, plus it would take multiple passes given the close spacing of the holes.

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#12
In reply to #10

Re: Small Hole Drilling

06/25/2015 12:26 AM

Thank you for taking the time to help. All these ideas are helping us get on track. Hook

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#11
In reply to #9

Re: Small Hole Drilling

06/25/2015 12:24 AM

Thanks all is good...

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#14
In reply to #4

Re: Small Hole Drilling

06/25/2015 12:55 PM

Why was that information absent from the original post, then? Its presence would save others from jumping to the wrong conclusion.

More information in the original post = better answers, quicker.

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#17
In reply to #14

Re: Small Hole Drilling

06/25/2015 9:35 PM

Assume people aren't interested in ones life problems or circumstances. One would think after 33 years in a well respected business you would know who to trust. Seems like it's the ones you have helped the most. Hook

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#18
In reply to #17

Re: Small Hole Drilling

06/25/2015 10:08 PM

We don't need a life story but sufficient detail and explanation as to why you are asking the question helps due to the large number of homework and other dubious questions that get asked on CR4. Some of us are prone to jump to conclusions from time to time.

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#21
In reply to #18

Re: Small Hole Drilling

06/26/2015 9:01 AM

I wouldn't really call it jumping to conclusions, just offering opinions on the information given which,,,, as we all know in many, many cases is not enough as suggested elsewhere in this thread.

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#5

Re: Small Hole Drilling

06/24/2015 9:07 PM
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#13
In reply to #5

Re: Small Hole Drilling

06/25/2015 12:30 AM

Watched the video, CNC machine doing 1600 holes approximately the same size. Might do the trick! Thanks again Hook

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#26
In reply to #5

Re: Small Hole Drilling

07/14/2015 8:58 PM

Watched the video, CNC machine doing 1600 holes approximately the same size. Might do the trick! Thanks again Hook

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#6

Re: Small Hole Drilling

06/24/2015 9:15 PM

I don't see the difficulty here. Use an industrial laser above a 2 axis table driven by two servo motors, create a jig, fix the workpiece into it, program the hole pattern into the motion control computer, then pulse, move, pulse, repeat 1398 more times per piece.

It will take more time to determine the proper laser power level, program the computer, and create the jig fixture, than it will to blast the 10 prototypes. It shouldn't take an experienced shop a day to do the whole job.

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#7
In reply to #6

Re: Small Hole Drilling

06/24/2015 9:59 PM

Exactly.

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#15
In reply to #6

Re: Small Hole Drilling

06/25/2015 2:03 PM

Most industrial lasers (CO2) do not do well with Polyethylene. It melts rather than vaporizing yielding a ragged hole. For laser, a better choice of material would be acrylic or PETG. Even then you won't get a straight hole. the hole will be tapered and hour glass shaped. Drilling is the only way to get a true strait hole.

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#8

Re: Small Hole Drilling

06/24/2015 10:33 PM

its a rotating punch

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#16

Re: Small Hole Drilling

06/25/2015 2:05 PM

That piece being a prototype I guarantee you was done on a CNC milling machine

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#19
In reply to #16

Re: Small Hole Drilling

06/25/2015 10:25 PM

Thanks again Bryan, CNC machine it is. Now on the quest to find a shop that will do the job! Hook

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#20

Re: Small Hole Drilling

06/25/2015 10:47 PM

As I stated previously, the only way this can be done with any degree of accuracy and integrity is by CNC drilling - just make sure your contactor understands the idiosyncrasies of machining plastics.

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#25
In reply to #20

Re: Small Hole Drilling

07/01/2015 7:03 PM

Yes I think from all the help received in this forum the CNC drilling is the best way to go but am having much difficulty in finding a vendor/shop who can or is willing to drill this size hole, but I am continuing to search and hopefully will be successful soon. Again many thanks, Hook

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#22

Re: Small Hole Drilling

06/30/2015 1:38 AM

Hot wire piercing, 3D printing, laser drilling...

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#23

Re: Small Hole Drilling

07/01/2015 3:52 PM

Something does not look right with the picture. You stated that the parts were 2" wide and the holes are .015" dia, I may wear glasses but to me there is no way that that's true for the picture shown. If the parts are 2" wide then the holes are way bigger than .015" - maybe .150", which makes it way easier to drill on a CNC.

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#24
In reply to #23

Re: Small Hole Drilling

07/01/2015 6:55 PM

Well good observation , the piece of high density polyethylene is 2" wide to fit into the 2" square channel but the 5 rows of holes are drilled in the center 3/4" of the 2" wide piece. I have found two sample pictures in our records one is listed as .015" but apparently the piece in the picture is actually .027" by all indication. So I appreciate your observation . Thank you, Hook

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