How to lift a car

I had to reread your post to get the idea.

Are you proposing something like this?

Well, there are all sorts of reasons why this car won't be feasible. I'm not saying that it won't work (it's been done before, the US military tried it back in the 50's or 60's) but that there are a lot of issues regarding it.

However, as a project, it will be interesting. You'll learn a lot about it, including why it won't be feasible. I can tell you but why spoil the fun of learning it yourself?

I'm not sure if the exercise of doing the project requires that it should work. I always thought that a project is intended to train you. If, in the end, the project turns out to be a white elephant, you will at least have learned something...hopefully.

Good luck.

Nice drawings I would not want to have to design the stabilization system to so it won't wobble. Which I believe would be a heavy task. The Brits had major set backs in the design of the Harrier due to stabilizing the plane during take off. That was one of the US problems. Lot Of Issues yeah like GPM

It's good to see someone thinking in advance! Look at the different systems, the bag that is attached to the exhaust, the pneumatic pistons, or even air driven motors to turn a screw jack! When you say a car lifted by 4 air engines, do you mean lifted totally off the ground to change wheels or do you mean lifting the suspension or do you mean floating off the ground like a hovercraft? A good start for your project is to think carefully about how to describe your project so that the examiners are in no doubt as to your goal! If they are unsure what you are trying to do then I guess it will mean less marks for you! How about trying it out here first? If you give us good information then I'm sure we can be a good starting point for your enquires!

Good luck and think about the details

Hello

basically how i see this project, two air motors which will transfer the air to the bins. However, the problem was how to keep the balance, and what u guys think about using range finder sensors instaled on each bin, so depends of this sensors the air pressure will increase or decrease to keep the vehicle balanced

Thanx

Ambitious project! I like it Make a scaled down prototype! put the sensor on the $20 RC helicopter and see if you can get it to hover successfully on its own!

Yes, you could use a range finder sensor (probably ultrasonic) to maintain balance. However, I would suggest that you use a gyroscope.

The problem with a range finder sensor comes when the road is not level. The range finder will try to tilt the car so that it's level with the road, and that will cause the car to slide towards the low side.

Perfect idea with the helicopter! I will do it, and let u know about the results

Thanx

Let my wife drive your car around a corner. She will get it 11.3" high, all four wheels.

Interesting, but the definition could be interpreted many ways.

Whats the cargo/passenger load?

Does it have to travel forward? <- 1 lifting crane engine per corner, vertical lift to required height

Does it have to lift off the ground? <- 1 engine driving each wheel

How long does it have to stay in the air? <- drive forwards off a jump (I do this in Off road Racing)

Propulsion? <- 4 propellers and a nice wing span, 4 lifting fans, 1 on each corner, you can get Gyro's for model aircraft, so I guess the principal would be the same.

Air cushion? <- 2 engines for compressing the air inside the cushion, 2 engines to drive you forward

Propulsion drive? <- Air fan, driven by lawn mower engines, Liquid Rocket Engines (google for it) they will also have the designs for the combustion chamber, exhaust port, and thrust calculations (note, highly dangerous)

Some time back I saw a very clever device for lifting a car in a garage setting. It was just a platform on a curved rolling base. Normally the platform is tipped up and looks like a ramp. As an automobile is driven up the ramp, the weight of the vehicle tips the platform into a level position and one can go under the car though only in a crouched position. The whole trick is to get the rolling base structure geometry and the CGs correct. The car can be reversed off the platform on to the ground where everything happens in reverse order. The beauty of it is that it is done without any motors (except of course the car motor). I thought it a neat solution for home garages or small service stations to get access to the underbody of a car. Wonder why it has not been further developed and commercialised.

Check You Tube with 'Flying Car' for some weird stuff. It might give you some confuguration ideas ( and a few giggles - the R/C 'car' on Top Gear is great).

Hi Db.

I guess you've heard of re-designing the wheel. In your design brief you will need to justify and explain what the difference and advantage is of your idea over the hovercraft.

It may be that you can say you are building it for experimental purposes. Just don't put all the work in, get something you can say is fantastic, and then at the critique someone asks what can it do that hovercaft don't? and you have no answer.

Jim

In looking at the concept I can see an advantage over hovercraft (if it is designed into the project) in steering. Using the 4 engine positions to direct flow to steer all four corners may be really fun.

As a motorcycle rider I would hope some thought to containing the road debris (sand rocks sticks animal parts etc) should I ever fall in behind ----

we will miss those bumpy rides , flat tyres ,suspensions

Hello

You find an amazing video about this topic. The name however can be mis leading

http://www.cartoonland.de/?s=feuerwehr-spass.wmv

This can be used to document your project

Good Luck

Great job dB, now that you've got everyone with internet access doing your project, what do you expect to learn from it?

Jesse

Come now, Jesse, research involves hitting the books, watching videos, searching for information on the internet, among other things, and asking people for information. If you're a working guy, I'm sure that you've conducted research by asking around, right?

Okay, asking for formulas, plans, and asking Dad to build your school project is cheating. However, asking people for ideas is a perfectly legitimate research method. It's up to the guy to decide whether he's going to pursue any of the ideas we give him.

There's one other post elsewhere asking for the volume of a liquid at such and such specific gravity and mass. That I ignored. They're supposed to teach that in school. If he wasn't listening, too bad.

I totally agree with asking for help if you've already been through the "hitting the books, watching videos and searching for information on the internet". I don't agree with asking for help right out of the box, and that's what it sounds like to me.

My biggest rewards while in this trade have come from taking an idea and running with it from start to finish and being able to step back and say that, I did it.

Just my thoughts

I like DB's idea in that it can adapt the hovercraft idea to a four-point support system. I'm sure it's been contemplated thousands of times before. Instead of the skirt around the entire perimiter of the platform/vehicle (solves the stability problem somewhat) as in existing hovercraft, how about four individual skirts deployable at each wheel position. I'd suggest, since this is just an exercise, to design a solution that works for a light platform, then increase weight/size of vehicle and associated fans/power req's, etc. until impractical. Determining the cutoff point/limits of present technology in relation to this idea would certainly bring the high grades.

It's been done.

Called a hybercraft.

We built, under contract, and sucessfully flew a prototype, built for the patent owner.

It was eight feet in diameter.........raised up about 40" off ground...much like a hovercraft but infinately more controllable on speed turns....could fly in any direction /control attitude...........would not climb an increased grade beyond mild differential.

Better check and be sure you are not violating the patent.

MR. GUY.

Mr.Guy wrote":

"Better check and be sure you are not violating the patent."

Patents protect commercial rights they don't protect the invention from being used by someone who builds it for themselves.

Hello dB,

What you are proposing is not a car but a hovercraft!

1, 2, 3, 4 or more motors does not make much of a difference.

I have seen PRODUCTION Hovercraft with all of these engine configurations. I have owned both a single and dual motor hovercraft.

They are fun but they all have 2 basic problems:

1. They do not turn very well!

2. They do not stop very well!

Since they ride on a cushion of air there is no friction available to convert into turning or braking force.

Go buy a toy hovercraft, (they run about $20.US,) and become educated in the physics of how they work.

Paul Moller has spent over 40 years and $50 million and still has not built a fully working vehicle.

http://www.moller.com/skyc.htm

(I personally am horrified at the thought of your typical commuter driving around in the sky talking on their cell phone while eating a burger and brushing their hair.)

Buy the model, play with it and then rethink your project.

To the other "Guest" I believe if you don't go commercial and are only experimenting or for educational purpose ... there is no violation of any patent.

Am I wrong?

Reagrding a comment about the car tilting with the road's tilt ... I believe the car would be maintaining a level state by adjusting higher thrust to the lower (higher Delta h) part of the terrain ... and a ground scanner or something feeding a computer chip could avergae out any roughness in the terrain ahead ... and timing it with the speed of the craft?

I believe any effort or polling or bouncing or collecting ideas, information, experience, books, internet, ... anything besides someone's hands on take charge ... is the ultimate holistic form of research ... why attenuate that by boundaries of who and what and how much you can learn from others and others' ideas, experience, instructions ... it will all go towards learning ... sometimes learning somethings much faster and earlier that so that one may build upon and ... who knows ... he might even one day discover ANTI-GRAVITY-DARK-MATTER-PHYSICS just because he was PROPPELLED along by us all !!!

Regards, KP Sugar Land.

I believe the car would be maintaining a level state by adjusting higher thrust to the lower (higher Delta h) part of the terrain

This is where I draw the line on giving information to students. I'd really like to comment on your comment (in fact my fingers are itching to say something ) but I'd like to give DB the chance to discover for himself how to get his project to work.

Okay, giving him the gyroscope idea is a giveaway but, as I said, part of research is asking for ideas. How he uses the gyro is up to him. Why he needs a gyro instead of just the height sensors is up to him to find out.