Previous in Forum: Encapsulated Pole   Next in Forum: Modbus Master on RS485 with Digital Outputs
Close
Close
Close
11 comments
Power-User

Join Date: May 2009
Location: Some where on Earth !!!.
Posts: 243
Good Answers: 2

Fault Level

02/20/2020 7:09 AM

Does having higher incoming voltage ( say , 440KV grid and secondary 66kV feeding to various substations) reduces fault level in the system, when compared to similar set up but having voltage level to substations at 33kV from 220kV grid instead of 66kV from 440kV grid.

Pls share your knowledge as I am not a design engineer. :)

__________________
"Know something about everything and everything about something"
Register to Reply
Interested in this topic? By joining CR4 you can "subscribe" to
this discussion and receive notification when new comments are added.

Comments rated to be Good Answers:

These comments received enough positive ratings to make them "good answers".

Comments rated to be "almost" Good Answers:

Check out these comments that don't yet have enough votes to be "official" good answers and, if you agree with them, rate them!
Power-User

Join Date: May 2009
Location: Some where on Earth !!!.
Posts: 243
Good Answers: 2
#1

Re: Fault Level

02/20/2020 11:46 AM

Minor correction:

but having voltage level to substations at 33kV from 220kV grid instead of 66kV from 440kV grid.

Pls read it as 33kV stepped up voltage from local generators* instead of 66kV from 440kV grid.

__________________
"Know something about everything and everything about something"
Register to Reply
Guru
United Kingdom - Member - Indeterminate Engineering Fields - Control Engineering - New Member

Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: In the bothy, 7 chains down the line from Dodman's Lane level crossing, in the nation formerly known as Great Britain. Kettle's on.
Posts: 32119
Good Answers: 838
#2

Re: Fault Level

02/26/2020 5:39 AM

To carry the same power at a lower voltage would require an increase in current. If the physical arrangements are satisfactory for increased current then they will be sized accordingly. Under these circumstances it would be fair to state that one might expect them to withstand higher fault currents until a circuit protective device operates to disconnect the fault. Sizing them to withstand the fault lays within the domain of the Electrical Engineer, who will be specialised in this art.

__________________
"Did you get my e-mail?" - "The biggest problem in communication is the illusion that it has taken place" - George Bernard Shaw, 1856
Register to Reply
Guru

Join Date: Oct 2012
Location: 100 miles North from the World Center
Posts: 879
Good Answers: 42
#3

Re: Fault Level

02/26/2020 10:44 AM

If we trust in IEC 60076-5/2000 Power transformers –Ability to withstand short circuit Table 2 – Short-circuit apparent power of the system says for 245 kV System [Current North American practice] S220kV=15000 MVA and for 765 kV 83000 MVA.

Let’s say the both transformers are 400 MVA 20% short-circuit impedance.

Then for 220/33 kV we have Zsys=33^2/15000=0.0726 ohm and Ztrf=20%*33^2/400=0.5445 ohm

Then S33kV=33^2/(0.5445+0.0726)=1784.7 MVA

For 440/66 kV Zsys=66^2/830000=.05248 ohm

Ztrf=20%*66^2/400=2.178ohm

S66kV=66^2/(0.05248+2.178)=1952.9 MVA

If transformer short-circuit impedance will be 22% at 400 MVA 66 kV then the transformer impedance will be 2.4 and S66kV=66^2/(0.05248+2.4)=1776.2 MVA

Usually will be the same short-circuit apparent power.

__________________
Julius
Register to Reply Score 1 for Good Answer
2
Power-User

Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Hyderabad
Posts: 343
Good Answers: 22
#4

Re: Fault Level

02/26/2020 12:23 PM

Fault level at the distribution substation busbars is decided by two factors - source impedance and transformer impedance.

Whether at 400kV or 220kV, it is the transformer impedance that is dominating to the extent that the source impedance can be ignored.

Then, what remains is the transformer impedance. The transformer impedance depends on the MVA and not voltage level. So, if 400/66kV and 220/33kV transformers are of same MVA and have same %Z, the fault level at 66kV bus and 33kV bus is going to be same.

If the distribution voltage is 33kV and hence, one more 66/33kV transformer is added in series with 400/66kV transformer, the fault level at 33kV will be much lower (than that at 33kV bus with 220/33kV transformer) owing to the additional transformer impedance.

__________________
Raghunath
Register to Reply Good Answer (Score 2)
Power-User

Join Date: May 2009
Location: Some where on Earth !!!.
Posts: 243
Good Answers: 2
#5
In reply to #4

Re: Fault Level

02/27/2020 12:20 PM

Thank you ..My doubt is cleared to some extent.

If possible please provide the calculations as an example

How the fault level remains same at 33kV & 66kV GIS bus.Is it not fault level at higher voltage (66kV ) would be more than fault level at lower voltage.(33kV), even though fault current will be higher at lower voltage .

__________________
"Know something about everything and everything about something"
Register to Reply
2
Guru

Join Date: Oct 2012
Location: 100 miles North from the World Center
Posts: 879
Good Answers: 42
#6

Re: Fault Level

02/28/2020 6:05 AM

The fault level [Short-circuit apparent power] depends on power source impedance and user's transformer impedance if we consider the fault at user's transformer secondary terminals.

Let's say we have 5*400 MVA generators supplying one OHL of 220 kV.

From IEC 60909-2 Table 2 let's pick up a turbogenerator of 389 MVA Ur=17.8kV and x"d=20.3% and a transformer of 390 MVA 16% ukr.

Neglecting correction factor for generator , for transformer and OHL impedance, the short-circuit power at transformer terminals will be S220kV=U^2/(Zg+Zxfr] Zg=220^2/389*20.3%= 25.26 ohm Zxfr=220^2/390*16%= 19.86 ohm.

S220kV1=220^2/(25.26+19.86)=1072.7 MVA

If there are 5 parallel same generators then total S220kV=5363.5 MVA.

Zsys33kV=33^2/5363.5=0.203 ohm

As per IEC 60076-5 420 kV System could present 40000 MVA short-circuit. Zsys66kV=66^2/40000=0.1089 ohm

Now we have an user transformer of 400 MVA 20% at 33 kV and the same at 66 kV.

Ztrf33kV=33^2/400*20%=0.5445ohm

Ztrf66kV=66^2/400*20%=2.178

S33kV=33^2/(0.20304+0.5445)=1456.8 MVA

S66kV=66^2/(0.1089+2.178)=1904.8 MVA

Never the less the system short-circuit power it is 5363.5/40000*100=13.4% the final power it is only 1456.8/1904.8=76.48%.

__________________
Julius
Register to Reply Good Answer (Score 2)
Power-User

Join Date: May 2009
Location: Some where on Earth !!!.
Posts: 243
Good Answers: 2
#7
In reply to #6

Re: Fault Level

02/28/2020 11:57 AM

Nicely written..It means, though there is huge difference of fault level at upstream voltage levels , there is not much difference at downstream side of transformers.So 33kV and 66kV will have nearly same fault level and fault current.

thanks replying...!!!

__________________
"Know something about everything and everything about something"
Register to Reply
Power-User

Join Date: May 2009
Location: Some where on Earth !!!.
Posts: 243
Good Answers: 2
#8
In reply to #6

Re: Fault Level

03/02/2020 2:26 AM

Nicely written..It means, though there is huge difference of fault level at upstream voltage levels , there is not much difference at downstream side of transformers.So 33kV and 66kV will have nearly same fault level and fault current.

thanks replying...!!!

__________________
"Know something about everything and everything about something"
Register to Reply
Power-User

Join Date: May 2009
Location: Some where on Earth !!!.
Posts: 243
Good Answers: 2
#9
In reply to #6

Re: Fault Level

03/02/2020 3:46 AM

Nicely written..It means, though there is huge difference of fault level at upstream voltage levels , there is not much difference at downstream side of transformers.So 33kV and 66kV will have nearly same fault level and fault current.

thanks replying...!!!

__________________
"Know something about everything and everything about something"
Register to Reply
Power-User

Join Date: May 2009
Location: Some where on Earth !!!.
Posts: 243
Good Answers: 2
#10
In reply to #6

Re: Fault Level

03/02/2020 3:46 AM

Nicely written..It means, though there is huge difference of fault level at upstream voltage levels , there is not much difference at downstream side of transformers.So 33kV and 66kV will have nearly same fault level and fault current.

thanks replying...!!!

__________________
"Know something about everything and everything about something"
Register to Reply
Power-User

Join Date: May 2009
Location: Some where on Earth !!!.
Posts: 243
Good Answers: 2
#11
In reply to #6

Re: Fault Level

03/02/2020 3:46 AM

Nicely written..It means, though there is huge difference of fault level at upstream voltage levels , there is not much difference at downstream side of transformers.So 33kV and 66kV will have nearly same fault level and fault current.

thanks replying...!!!

__________________
"Know something about everything and everything about something"
Register to Reply
Register to Reply 11 comments
Interested in this topic? By joining CR4 you can "subscribe" to
this discussion and receive notification when new comments are added.

Comments rated to be Good Answers:

These comments received enough positive ratings to make them "good answers".

Comments rated to be "almost" Good Answers:

Check out these comments that don't yet have enough votes to be "official" good answers and, if you agree with them, rate them!
Copy to Clipboard

Users who posted comments:

7anoter4 (2); giri (7); PWSlack (1); raghun (1)

Previous in Forum: Encapsulated Pole   Next in Forum: Modbus Master on RS485 with Digital Outputs

Advertisement