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No Alternative to Free Speech

12/02/2020 6:10 AM

https://news.cornell.edu/stories/2018/05/psychologists-there-no-alternative-free-speech

Always open for constructive comments.

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#1

Re: No alternative to free speech

12/02/2020 6:32 AM

This is really disturbing...

  • 74 percent said universities should cancel speakers if students threaten violent protest;”

what is wrong with these students... when I went to,college, we had speakers visit, and if it’s something I disagreed with, I didn’t waste my time.

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#4
In reply to #1

Re: No alternative to free speech

12/02/2020 1:40 PM

Graham Chapman came to speak at my college when I was attending . . .

. . . and yes, I did gleefully attend. Very good and engaging speaker by the way.

https://digitalcommons.wpi.edu/newspeak/227

PDF download below

https://digitalcommons.wpi.edu/cgi/viewcontent.cgi?article=1242&context=newspeak

But sadly, even my Alma mater has gone all P.C. Social conscience (whatever the hell that means) seems to be more important than engineering education. Never mind the tuition costs ($52K+). I couldn't have afforded to send my kids there. The college has spent a lot of money to attract big money (fluff for amenities rather than engineering).

My tuition in 1983 was about $10K, adjusted for inflation would be about $27K today. WTF?

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#5
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Re: No alternative to free speech

12/02/2020 3:03 PM

Graham Chapman sounded so familiar, I had to look it up... and did,... and should have known.

my wife thought that he was very handsome...

I’ll have to look at your link. Of the MP troupe, he was very well educated... which is saying allot.

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#8
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Re: No alternative to free speech

12/02/2020 4:02 PM

The whole troupe was very well educated. I believe their collective intelligence/education was a large part of why their humor was funny on several levels. Many people just thought of M.P. as slap-stick humor, which it was, but there were a lot of references that probably went over the heads of many.

If you were not well-steeped in history, literature and to a degree U.K. politics, you would miss out.

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#9
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Re: No alternative to free speech

12/02/2020 4:06 PM

Or should I say, "Slap herring humor" ?

(Reference to one of their skits in one of the Flying Circus shows.)

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#12
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Re: No alternative to free speech

12/02/2020 4:16 PM

I saw a talk show that was similar to Point/Counter Point where they had the Troupe on and a Cardinal on, John Cleese ripped him up throughly.

Also, there was a competition between the two colleges, one was foot lights and something else I can’t recall...

and then came the American in a mink coat with to ‘broads’ on each side... Terry Gilliam... I guess that really brought the Brits together with that damn American... lol

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#2

Re: No Alternative to Free Speech

12/02/2020 7:19 AM

These students are so weak minded they are afraid that somebody will convince them they are wrong about core beliefs they hold, and they will be marginalized...they don't have the courage of their convictions, they care less about being right than they do about being a part of the current thought prevailing cliques on campuses around this country...The smug righteousness of the west coast elitists is spreading...We have free speech for a reason, it's to keep those seeking power over us from steamrolling society into a train wreck of plank-walking blind-sided disasters....Keeping one foot on the land while testing the thickness of the ice is always a sound strategy...

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#3

Re: No Alternative to Free Speech

12/02/2020 9:35 AM

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#10
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Re: No Alternative to Free Speech

12/02/2020 4:10 PM

If only more had this attitude . . . .

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#6

Re: No Alternative to Free Speech

12/02/2020 3:12 PM

The word "to" in the thread title is not present in the Cornell title. That changes the meaning almost to its opposite.

OTOH, the discrepancy may be with the Web site title vs. the original article's title.

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#7
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Re: No Alternative to Free Speech

12/02/2020 3:31 PM

They must have updated it... but the body remains the same.

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#11

Re: No Alternative to Free Speech

12/02/2020 4:15 PM

Here is what G.H.W. Bush had to say about political correctness:

IMHO,he is absolutely right.

https://www.c-span.org/video/?c4700577/user-clip-president-george-hw-bush-political-correctness-college-campuses

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#13

Re: No Alternative to Free Speech

12/03/2020 11:29 AM

Hey Buddy,

I grew up in a highly political family. Virtue of having a highly respected US senator as a close relative. EV Dirksen.

I was indoctrinated Republican. Word used intentionally.

The process of indoctrination required study of the founding documents of America. It required a working knowledge of and philosophical grasp of the Federalist papers. It also came with challenges. When I was seven we went to the Dirksen family reunion in Pekin. There I met “the man” Ev. He looked just like my grandfather Dugan and had the same voice and easy mannerisms. He held forth and people sat entranced. He gave me a record called Gallant Men. I still have it. This was my introduction to politics and why America is so different.

Since we just had Thanksgiving the memory is fresh in my mind. Here is my youth. Family gathers, often up to 50 people. Children were relegated to special tables. As you get older you realize there is something going on at the big people tables. It often goes on into the night. Frequently involving cards and alcohol and loud voices and laughter.

AS I got older I learned what it was. I was surprised to learn that we would have family debates. Only the trick was you had to argue the opposing side not yours. Until you could do that effectively you didn’t get promoted to the big persons table. You had to be knowledgeable, well spoken, capable of reason and quick thinking and most importantly you had to be fluent in arguments you would normally argue against. Possibly the best lesson ever in civilized discussion because if you lost your cool you were “sent down” to better develop your skills before the next dinner. You were not shamed though. You were encouraged to better your skills.

So my understanding of free speech is thus. All topics can be discussed, respectfully, rationally, reasonably by adults who have mastered self control. Discussion is an intellectual activity not an emotional one. Arguments are emotional. Discussions are dispassionate so that the information and can be processed properly and a good decisions reached. If you become emotional you lose effectiveness, flexibility in thinking, and worse yet you develop a bias. This was the base lesson to learn from these exercises in adulthood. This was important in the Dirksen family. It was the proof of your having “grown up”.

You also learned how to cheat at cards. But that’s another story.

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#15
In reply to #13

Re: No Alternative to Free Speech

12/03/2020 1:40 PM

Being able to argue both sides of a topic is essential for arriving at a clear understanding of the truth....This is the basis of the judicial system....however it must be acknowledged that things change over time as does what's true...what's true today may not be true tomorrow...Free speech is a basic tool for seeking truth that must be preserved, without it, we are lost...

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#16
In reply to #15

Re: No Alternative to Free Speech

12/03/2020 2:31 PM

A GA for that one buddy.

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#17
In reply to #13

Re: No Alternative to Free Speech

12/07/2020 4:51 PM

Bravo, and mega-kudoes, to you and your family for your collective understanding, and practice, of Freedom of Speech...

...but how far do you yhink you would get trying to have that same discussion with with Pelosi, Schiff, Nagler, etc., or any other demo-pathic member of the U. S. House of Representatives?...

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#14

Re: No Alternative to Free Speech

12/03/2020 1:08 PM

While not an engineering or scientific topic, I appreciate the addition of this topic to this site. Well, expressed. It is a hard rule to always personally live by. But it is a necessary personal rule to live by. I can be the judge of what I chose to listen to, ponder, and absorb. But, I should not be the judge for others.

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