Previous in Forum: Saturn's Tilt Caused by its Moons, Researchers Say   Next in Forum: Program that Will Open a CAD File?
Close
Close
Close
13 comments
Rate Comments: Nested
Participant

Join Date: Feb 2021
Posts: 3

Travel Through Dark Matter

02/02/2021 2:56 PM

I am an avid Sc-Fi fan but something irks about hyperdrive, warp-drive, time travel, and worm holes.The problem is we already know the physics, and they say 'impossible'. Looking at light speed, that is over 670 million miles per hour. In space films they seem to be able to jump to light speed in seconds. Really ? What sort of human frame could stand that ! To my mind it would take a few years of steady acceleration to attain that kind of speed and a similar number of years to slow down for arrival and that has to be repeated for the journey back. No matter what fuel you were using it would take a planet sized fuel source to sustain such a long burn. But the most obvious and probably deliberately missed obstacle (sic) is that space has debris in it, not much but the odd pea sized piece here and there and if you hit one of those at light speed it would be goodbye to you, your crew and your space ship. You cannot depend upon radar obviously. Yet, at speeds nearing light speed you would want to know the forward hazards at least one hundred million miles ahead of you so that you could make course adjustments. But if the obstacles were spread out over a wide area, an asteroid belt - for example, I am sorry you could not simply stop ! So on to worm holes, do they exist ? and if they do, will they be going in the right direction and even more crucial will they be there when I want to come back ?

When a book or a film ignores the facts that we do know about physics they are entering the realm of fairy stories so we are in the hands of Merlin ! This is the reason why I have chosen to write about Dark Matter Transit I have sought a new exciting alternative to warp drive, hyper drive, time travel and wormholes. Dark Matter Transit (DMT). Dark matter has no dimensions and it has its own physics which are not relative with our own. Dark matter is the primordial universe and it is the only common feature in all universes. You do not travel in DM, you set your exit biases before you enter it and you re-emerge at your presets. By reason that DM has no dimensions there can be no A through B method of travel within it. It could be likened to going through a door into another room. In our physical world you have not traveled at all, but you will have disappeared from view. Yes it may be fantasy but it is not disproven fantasy. Which, I feel, adds a little realism to the genre.

author Dark Matter Transit

Register to Reply
Interested in this topic? By joining CR4 you can "subscribe" to
this discussion and receive notification when new comments are added.

Good Answers:

These comments received enough positive votes to make them "good answers".

"Almost" Good Answers:

Check out these comments that don't yet have enough votes to be "official" good answers and, if you agree with them, vote them!
Guru

Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: by the beach in Florida
Posts: 33392
Good Answers: 1817
#1

Re: Travel through Dark Matter

02/02/2021 5:02 PM

Dark matter was discovered because of its gravitational pull, this suggests that it is some form of matter, so this doesn't suggest that it has different physical laws...You can invent a new thing that isn't known to exist, but you can't really mislabel that which is known, even if it is not completely known...Travelling great distances in a relatively short time would be better fantasized as an entangled particle transporter, where a human could be translated into light and transported at lightspeed to a receiver location...We could send receivers out into space and after 100 years transport a human to the receiver in that ship....this might actually be possible in some iteration someday...

__________________
All living things seek to control their own destiny....this is the purpose of life
Register to Reply
Participant

Join Date: Feb 2021
Posts: 3
#5
In reply to #1

Re: Travel through Dark Matter

02/03/2021 7:22 AM

Oh who discovered it ? As far as I know there is absolutely no proof whatsoever that dark matter has a gravitational field, how could it when it is universal. Around a galaxy there will be intense gravitational forces. Trapped in that will be minute particles, some perhaps just electrons, billions of them spread over a vast expanse.although miles apart when combined they will exert a gravitational pull or effect and even from a distance, because it is distance in depth, will appear to be solid. That is probably what they are seeing I don't know how your gravitational particle transporter works but if it relies on any form of transport then you have still got the same problem that nothing can move faster than light in our universe and to go to even the middle of our galaxy and come back would be in time to probably see your great, great, great, great grandchildren buried . All one could say afterwards was ' yes I went there', but it was of no practice or commercial value

Register to Reply
Guru

Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: Land of Shining Waters
Posts: 916
Good Answers: 35
#8
In reply to #5

Re: Travel through Dark Matter

02/03/2021 11:44 AM

Particle transporter, warp drive... whatever. These are simply premises on which to hang the story that follows - premises that require the reader's willing suspension of disbelief (see my post #6). The reader of sci-fi says, 'Okay, I'll temporarily accept the premise that travel to distant galaxies is possible. Now tell me your story.' This is no different than the reader of a Jack Reacher novel, saying, 'Okay, I'll accept the premise that the vagabond Jack Reacher is the smartest, toughest man in North America. Now tell me your story."

__________________
It is easier to let the cat out of the bag than to put the cat back in the bag.
Register to Reply
Guru
Hobbies - CNC - New Member Hobbies - DIY Welding - New Member Engineering Fields - Electromechanical Engineering - New Member

Join Date: Aug 2007
Posts: 23647
Good Answers: 420
#2

Re: Travel through Dark Matter

02/02/2021 6:50 PM

I also was a Sci-Fi fan. When I went to college... I pretty much stop reading Sci-fi, because most good sci-if reading was written by Physicist’s, scientist’s and engineers.

Where they took actual facts, give it a entertaining twist where it loses it’s value for the readers entertainment.

Being a layman, I had to limit my exposure to sci-fi just because, if a discussion came up, I didn’t want to say, ‘well, I read it....’, not knowing where I actually read it, whether it was a textbook, technical journal or a sci-if book.

__________________
“ When people get what they want, they are often surprised when they get what they deserve " - James Wood
Register to Reply
Guru
United Kingdom - Member - Indeterminate Engineering Fields - Control Engineering - New Member

Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: In the bothy, 7 chains down the line from Dodman's Lane level crossing, in the nation formerly known as Great Britain. Kettle's on.
Posts: 32175
Good Answers: 839
#3

Re: Travel through Dark Matter

02/03/2021 2:16 AM

<...fairy stories...> have been told around the campfire for millennia. And there's nothing wrong with that.

__________________
"Did you get my e-mail?" - "The biggest problem in communication is the illusion that it has taken place" - George Bernard Shaw, 1856
Register to Reply Score 1 for Good Answer
2
Guru

Join Date: Dec 2010
Location: North West England
Posts: 1170
Good Answers: 153
#4

Re: Travel through Dark Matter

02/03/2021 4:44 AM

You appear to have missed the point of Sc-Fi. I always think of it as an acronym that stands for Suspend Cognitive Functions and Intelligence

Register to Reply Good Answer (Score 2)
Guru

Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: Land of Shining Waters
Posts: 916
Good Answers: 35
#6
In reply to #4

Re: Travel through Dark Matter

02/03/2021 10:03 AM

I disagree. Sci-fi simply requires what is known in literary criticism as the "willing suspension of disbelief". Two examples in the genre come immediately to mind. "The Time Machine" by H.G.Wells requires that the reader accept, for the duration of the story, that time travel could be possible. "Flowers for Algernon" by Daniel Keyes requires that the reader accept, for the duration of the story, that a brain operation could be possible that would transform a mentally disabled person into a genius. The stories do not demand that the reader accept either premise in actuality, they only ask for the willing suspension of disbelief in the premise while reading the story. Provided the author adheres to an internal logic that follows from the premise, the reader's cognitive functions can be stimulated and engaged.

__________________
It is easier to let the cat out of the bag than to put the cat back in the bag.
Register to Reply Score 1 for Good Answer
Participant

Join Date: Feb 2021
Posts: 3
#12
In reply to #6

Re: Travel through Dark Matter

02/04/2021 9:38 AM

That is one way of looking at it of course, ' the fairy story' but then they ought to begin with once upon a time maybe ? However, I think the essence is really in 'just beyond our grasp at the moment.' But once the already; 'known to be impossible' is ignored, then the realism for me is lost.

Register to Reply
Guru

Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: Land of Shining Waters
Posts: 916
Good Answers: 35
#13
In reply to #12

Re: Travel through Dark Matter

02/04/2021 12:03 PM

As another example, "2001, A Space Odyssey" was a speculation on the origin of human consciousness, and the evolution of our species from tool-makers to the birth of the first star-child. It was not a "fairy story" for children, and if you can dismiss that work of art as such, then that says more about you than about it.

__________________
It is easier to let the cat out of the bag than to put the cat back in the bag.
Register to Reply
Guru
Engineering Fields - Mechanical Engineering - Ever Changing United States - Member - From the Redwoods to the Valleys Engineering Fields - Control Engineering - Building blocks or writing code - to keep you comfortable

Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: 38th Parallel
Posts: 750
Good Answers: 19
#7

Re: Travel Through Dark Matter

02/03/2021 10:41 AM

Though I understand the logic to your comment, where is the fun in that. Sci-Fi was created to entertain and create fantasy and thoughts of achievement. As a die-hard Star Trek fan, good old captain Kirks flip communicator became a possibility in the 90's when the "Flip Phone" became an item.

Spectrometers are basically a "Tricorder" device used as a fantasy item in Star Trek. Though Light "warp' Speed is a likely fantasy, many other attributes have come from those Sci-fi fantasy nerds/geeks.

I say hurrah for the Sci-fi wonders and imagination it has created for many.

Then again maybe my mind has fallen into a Dark Matter worm hole and I still don't know where it will end up.

__________________
To be or not to be........ok that's a trick question.
Register to Reply
Power-User

Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: North Carolina, USA
Posts: 423
Good Answers: 9
#9

Re: Travel Through Dark Matter

02/03/2021 12:43 PM

IMO - Good science fiction, or fantasy, uses the science or magical world as a framework to build the human story around. The framework has to be designed and explained enough to hold together in the context of the story so it becomes the background. When it does not become the background it becomes a distraction. The framework does not have to hold together with physics reality we know as fact today to make a good story.

If you want to write stories using travel through dark matter as a framework that's great, as long as the story is a good one. The point of the story can't be that travel through dark matter doesn't violate the known laws of physics though, then it's a text book.

Register to Reply Score 1 for Good Answer
Guru

Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: Land of Shining Waters
Posts: 916
Good Answers: 35
#10
In reply to #9

Re: Travel Through Dark Matter

02/03/2021 2:07 PM

Very good. As always, the story has to be engaging, and we have to care about the characters. I particularly like your last sentence, "The point of the story can't be that travel through dark matter doesn't violate the known laws of physics though, then it's a text book." I accept that sci-fi can speculate beyond the known laws of physics, since our knowledge of those laws and what is possible is incomplete, but I want the speculations to retain some futuristic plausibility. I read a story by Ray Bradbury about virtual reality that he wrote fifty years ago! Sci-fi writers with a grounding in science often give us visions of an actual possible future that seem like fantasy at the time of writing. I think it was Arthur C. Clark who said that any technology sufficiently advanced will be indistinguishable from magic.

__________________
It is easier to let the cat out of the bag than to put the cat back in the bag.
Register to Reply
Guru
United Kingdom - Member - Indeterminate Engineering Fields - Control Engineering - New Member

Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: In the bothy, 7 chains down the line from Dodman's Lane level crossing, in the nation formerly known as Great Britain. Kettle's on.
Posts: 32175
Good Answers: 839
#11

Re: Travel Through Dark Matter

02/04/2021 2:30 AM

Just use a flux capacitor.

__________________
"Did you get my e-mail?" - "The biggest problem in communication is the illusion that it has taken place" - George Bernard Shaw, 1856
Register to Reply
Register to Reply 13 comments

Good Answers:

These comments received enough positive votes to make them "good answers".

"Almost" Good Answers:

Check out these comments that don't yet have enough votes to be "official" good answers and, if you agree with them, vote them!
Copy to Clipboard

Users who posted comments:

canadianslidewinder (4); jhhassociates (1); JRiversW (1); phoenix911 (1); PWSlack (2); SolarEagle (1); Stedou73ish (1); Vermony (2)

Previous in Forum: Saturn's Tilt Caused by its Moons, Researchers Say   Next in Forum: Program that Will Open a CAD File?

Advertisement