A solution to the Economic Crisis

There is no economic crisis.

There maybe however a crisis caused by people thinking there is a crisis...

Del

Here's a picture of a typical English investor discovering the dollar has fallen against the pound and now he can afford to buy a real football team (like the Green Bay Packers).

Have to agree with Del on this one. The main reason for the cost of oil going up is countries like India and China becoming industrialized. OPEC won't increase production and therefore, a limited supply causes competition for it, driving the price up. Between that and "speculators" saying there is an energy crisis. The other part is banks and such have made it too easy to get/give credit to those that can't afford it. It's too easy to file bankruptcy, and what goes around comes around. Their greed has become their downfall, both the individual and the lender. But that is only a portion of the problem, media espouses "downturn/recesssion/crisis in this or that" and everyone starts to hoard what they have, compounding the problem.

I too agree with Del except that OPEC can't increase production because they reached peak oil in 1986 and don't have the reserves to do so. In fact the main well in Saudi Arabia has less than 750 days of current consumption before it becomes less than economical to extract it.

And then the screaming starts.

Blue

As Supertramp once said: Crisis, what Crisis?

Might be dating myself with this one

To paraphrase Marx, Windows is the laxative of the masses!

Actually the so-called credit crunch is caused by the nonsensical belief that year on year 'growth' is a must.
To fuel this people are encouraged to borrow more and more...this is fine until you get to the point where they are borrowing more than they can possibly payback in a lifetime.
The whole thing then falls down like a house of cards.

The 'experts' who make a fortune out of advising and running economies have all feathered their own nest very well...and even if they do get fired they get a huge severance deal.
And who actually pays for their bonuses?...yes folks they still get bonuses even when they screw up....

Oh yes... it's the little guys who can least afford to pay.

Rant over...

When I was a young man, full of testosterone, and lacking good sense, I tried to borrow my way out of debt. It took almost five years of scrimping to dig my way out of that hole. I keep telling President Bush that strategy doesn't work, but he thinks I'm an OF and not very patriotic (Good Americans go shopping when threatened by any crisis). Notice that Greenspan or Bernanke don't seem to take out variable rate mortgages on their houses in order to buy new cars they don't need. mmm?

Notice that Greenspan or Bernanke don't seem to take out variable rate mortgages on their houses in order to buy new cars they don't need. mmm?

Yeh..those bloody adverts...

Are you in financial trouble?
We'll help you consolidated your debts into one easy to pay off loan and you'll still be able to afford that new car/holiday...whatever.

NO... YOU WON'T YOU MUPPETS YOU ARE IN DEBT...DON'T YOU GET IT???

It makes me want to weep...

If you can't afford it...save up, or make it yourself

Del

<...If you can't afford it...save up, or make it yourself...>

Bullseye!

<Rant>

It could be that the UK has forgotten thrift. Those who knew how to do it during the second pan-global conflict in the last century are thinning out, and the young generations haven't learned from them.

• "Just tell me what you want, what you really, really want; I'll tell you what I want, what I really really want..."
• "The best things in life are free. But you can give them to the birds and bees. I want money (that's what I want)....."

(With apologies to the Spice Girls and The Beatles.)

Engineering isn't about what 'want'. It's about 'can have', which is different.

</Rant>

But? They want what they want when they want it!

If you don't let them have what they want when they want it they won't want what they get when they get it!

WAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA.......boooooooooooo...........waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa!!!!!!

Give them a pacifier, give them a pacifier....nah, when they run out of tears they'll stop crying.

It's called tough love and I've had a dose of it myself...but hey it's part of the equation eh?

Take the 'Brain Trust' at the not so big three auto manufactures for example, massive bonuses every year that seems on the surface to be directly connected to how big a loss they can accomplish. Some of these people have made more money in their career than it costs to pay all people who are actually producing something beyond hot air, and wrong decisions, based on 'how to increase my bonus'. Sad state indeed.

One word of caution, never point out their follies, they have no sense of humor, and get nasty really quickly, but it is good fun. Don't ask how I know this.

Unfortunately too many people have been convinced that to interfere with capital in any way is the work of Satan. I suppose the propaganda machine could convince chickens to vote for Colonel Sanders.

Dear me- I did not mean to start a discussion about the economy- I merely used that as an excuse to promote putting Microsoft under government control and Steve Ballmer in charge of the United Nations. It seems that has been missed here...Maybe I should have posted this under computers?

Yes.. good point
Microsoft have made enough money..you'd think they could actually give us an open source operating system by now...?
After all I'm sure we have all paid for at least 2 or 3 by now..
Don't we deserve one that works?

Now there is a thought that is really scary, a Mickeysoft OS that actually works???

That would truly be the end of the world, sort of like Lucas wiring without smoke.

Nationalizing MicroSoft would certainly put a new spin on the old axiom

"good money follows bad" . . .

What ever the popular choice is don't do it.

1. My mother taught me TO APPRECIATE A JOB WELL DONE .
'If you're going to kill each other, do it outside. I just finished cleaning.'

2. My mother taught me RELIGION.
'You better pray that will come out of the carpet.'

3. My mother taught me about TIME TRAVEL .
'If you don't straighten up, I'm going to knock you into the middle of next week!'

4. My mother taught me LOGIC.
' Because I said so, that's why.'

5. My mother taught me MORE LOGIC.
'If you fall out of that swing and break your neck, you're not going to the store with me.'

6. My mother taught me FORESIGHT.
'Make sure you wear clean underwear, in case you're in an accident.'

7. My mother taught me IRONY
'Keep crying, and I'll give you something to cry about.'

8. My mother taught me about the science of OSMOSIS.
'Shut your mouth and eat your supper.'

9. My mother taught me about CONTORTIONISM.
'Will you look at that dirt on the back of your neck!'

10. My mother taught me about STAMINA.
'You'll sit there until all that spinach is gone.'

11. My mother taught me about WEATHER.
'This room of yours looks as if a tornado went through it.'

12. My mother taught me about HYPOCRISY.
'If I told you once, I've told you a million times. Don't exaggerate!'

13. My mother taught me the CIRCLE OF LIFE.
'I brought you into this world, and I can take you out.'

14. My mother taught me about BEHAVIOR MODIFICATION.
'Stop acting like your father!'

15. My mother taught me about ENVY .
'There are millions of less fortunate children in this world who don't have wonderful parents like you do.'

16. My mother taught me about ANTICIPATION.
'Just wait until we get home .'

17. My mother taught me about RECEIVING .
'You are going to get it when you get home!'

18. My mother taught me MEDICAL SCIENCE.
'If you don't stop crossing your eyes, they are going to freeze that way.'

19. My mother taught me ESP.
'Put your sweater on; don't you think I know when you are cold?'

20. My mother taught me HUMOR.
'When that lawn mower cuts off your toes, don't come running to me.'

21. My mother taught me HOW TO BECOME AN ADULT .
'If you don't eat your vegetables, you'll never grow up.'

22. My mother taught me GENETICS.
'You're just like your father.'

23. My mother taught me about my ROOTS.
'Shut that door behind you. Do you think you were born in a barn?'

24. My mother taught me WISDOM.
'When you get to be my age, you'll understand.'

25. And my favorite: My mother taught me about JUSTICE
'One day you'll have kids, and I hope they turn out just like you

Stop doing those things that cause you problems............................................................................................

My Mother taught me about economics.

'Never mind...it won't change the price of bread'

This thread made even a no-humor guy like me to laugh out loud; thank you for that, gentlemen.

I agree as usual with Del; there is no crisis. However the political season has convinced the majority that there is. And in spite of historic low unemployment rising wages and historic low interest rates, politicians claim the sky is falling. The Beige Book Report on April 18^th reports labor shortages in some industries.

All of this economy bashing affects consumer confidence, which in turn affects the Leading Economic Indicators. Still, the LEI rose last month; it did not recede. And despite the shrill notion of "recession" repeated for a year there was an economic expansion. Now, as the election nears, the word "depression" is being thrown around.

But this negative hyperbole happens every four years regardless of reality. It is the politics of fear; the same as global warming and it is designed to accommodate the ascendancy of the state.

The current credit crunch from banks (if one wants to call it crisis) is an over reaction to foolish lending practices that, in an attempt to expand the target market, gave mortgages to folks with no down payments and bad credit. But these folks got their own homes for a while, and now they have to go back to renting until they clean up their credit and save up a down payment – the way it should be.

The mortgage companies who gave these time bombs charged excessive rates to take that chance and now they are ending up with the properties they mortgaged worth less than the principle. That is justice. If there is a taxpayer bailout it will simply delay the shakeout and reward bad behavior by both lender and borrower.

Microsoft is simply continuing the capitalist tradition of built-in obsolescence. Putting up with that is the consumer's fault for excessive patronage of Gate's virtual monopoly. If people supported competitive opponents the market would be less vulnerable to Microsoft.

Be careful what you ask for when you request government control of the computer industry. George Orwell warned us in "1984."

I don't know what the rest of the country looks like but here in western PA, we're in a recession, still fairly mild but real.

Solution: LIVE AT, OR BELOW YOUR MEANS, AND STAY OUT OF DEBT.

(Hey, cwarner7; Nice try at drawing attention to your application at Apple, although I don't think Steve Jobs is paying attention.)

Simply put; the PROBLEM is a result of a lack of lending regulations and principles, which allowed lenders (mortgage companies) to provide loans to those that couldn't afford to make the payments either to begin with, or in the event of an interest rate increase. Lending institutions package debts, and sell them to larger banking institutions. In doing so they were able to make huge profits by selling the loans, whether or not they would be repaid. As people began defaulting on those mortgages, (often over-inflated) property values began dropping back to realistic levels, making homes more available - which in turn lowered the value of homes over-all, which then led to more foreclosures as folks abandoned homes that they owed more for than they were worth. Nothing to do with Microsoft... Question now is, when will governments step in and make changes to the credit card industry, which has every intention of keeping students, immigrants, working moms and dads saturated with debt at such high interest rates, they will never be able to be financially independent and free? DON'T be a SUCKER!!! Shred those cards while you still can.

And for heaven's sake - QUIT OBSESSING WITH MICROSOFT AND SWITCH TO MAC LIKE THE REST OF US...no virus problems, friendlier operation system, easier than learning Vista, and absolutely great multi-media - wish I'd switched sooner.

Question now is, when will governments step in and make changes to the credit card industry, which has every intention of keeping students, immigrants, working moms and dads saturated with debt at such high interest rates, they will never be able to be financially independent and free? DON'T be a SUCKER!!! Shred those cards while you still can.

There is no premise for government involvement. It is not illegal to allow someone to take advantage of you, if there were no precedent shame on them but since this is a repetitive ordeal shame on the debtor's. Students are still required to think in the real world like the rest of us whom know how to use windows (: too

The true thought process of a republican, sovereign wealth and the plan for global economic control that is the cause. You out smarted yourself again.

When the left wingers start to come out of the woodwork it is time to leave.

It's interesting that so many of them post as Guest.

So as not to scorch their feathers

I'm getting ready to go hear former Treasury Secretary Paul O'Neill speak. Now there's a closet leftwinger : Republican, head of Alcoa, member of Bush's cabinet. It should be interesting to hear his take on this economy.

BTW, I didn't run up huge debts, didn't speculate on shaky markets, and didn't benefit from the tax cuts. But, my 401(k) is in the toilet and the empty houses in my neighborhood have dropped my home's value. Why the heck can't I get the same deal as Bear Stearns? I'm too big to fail also...what's that?..oh, so they didn't mean waist size. Well....OK, but just see if I vote Federalist again.

It isn't just the credit card companies, the real villains here are the people who run the Federal Reserve Bank (about as "FEDERAL" as the Federal Chili and Pizza House down the street)

Every dollar that they LOAN to the Government comes with interest. Every single dollar. And the only way you can get out of debt is to borrow more??? Does any one else see the illogic of this? Oh, and by the way the law that established the Fed was never ratified by the required number of votes.

That my friends should really piss you off. This whole National debt, and the Depression and the current recession were and are manufactured.

Blue

Ever hear about personal responsibility? Do not borrow more than you can afford to pay back and don't sign contracts you cannot fulfill. That is the best advice a father can give a son. It is rediculous to claim that credit companies keep you in debt??? Do not take their money! Is it that you can't help yourself?

Good morning, Cornelius. It would be an ideal world if everyone had self-control. I have no problem saying "no" to the urge to "buy now" if I haven't cash in-pocket, yet the reality is that too many have no self-control, and too many are irresponsible. It is the goal of credit card companies to keep those people in debt, and generate a lifetime of interest income. There are other cases of basically responsible people having hard times that get into trouble as well, but I don't want to type all day long. Thing is, I see instances of insanely high credit card interest being applied in instances where the purchase balance has been paid several times over - and suspect one day the credit card companies will attempt to balk on the debt (look for taxpayer bail-out) as more and more folks default on the payments. I see cases where mildly retarded individuals have been given credit cards as well, and they are being taken advantage of by the credit industry on a daily basis - and that's just short of criminal. It's a shame.

It's not just the US. Take a look at what the Bank of England is doing to buy up mortgage securities:

http://www.ft.com/world/uk

BTW, I attended a talk which included the former Secretary of the US Treasury, Paul O'Neill, last evening. Mr. O'Neill is fairly conservative, quite knowledgeable about finance, and blunt as can be (which is why he's the former Secretary). He was asked about the Bear-Stearns bailout and the Credit Window opened by the Fed. His response was that we had been within perhaps hours of a point where our ATM cards would have been good only for shimming a wobbly table leg!

GA for pull your own weight

Although I can't read all the threads, especially these economic words, its out of my depth. I'm still interested in reading it.

DAlcat said at #1

---There is no economic crisis. There maybe however a crisis caused by people thinking there is a crisis

This words is very differ from I hearing from our medium machine. I heard from our TV program that the world is experiencing a large economic crisis, every thing's price is going up rapidly.

petroleum break out 100usd and approach to 120usd/barrel. more employees in Europe and America has lost their work. and capital transfer to the third world for more benefit.

Rice goes up as well.

to solve the issue of out of work, German gov has to encourage workers to go out to other countries seeking for job.

Britain has also such problem. only a few the rich has got such problem in the world.

Del Cat may be one of them.(joke)

all the news are from foreign papers reported by our reporters.

Yes there is a crisis of food and fuel...I was thinking of the 'Credit Crunch' which is all a load of hype about house prices crashing...they have fallen slightly in some areas but are still priced above what most people can afford. The stupid rise in house prices over the last twenty years or so has been fueld by unsustainable credit.

They've gone up about 100% now people are squeaking like stuck pigs because they've dropped 10% (20% in some extreme cases)....

If people didn't borrow beyond their means there wouldn't be a problem.

Del

DelCat, I was told that your Britain teachers begin a large strick today against low salary.

shall we stop to answer any question to support them?

They seem to be striking over the wrong thing...the government keeps messing about with education..every year there are 'new initiatives' most of which are stupid..

What the teachers really want are smaller class sizes (fewer pupils) .. which the government won't legislate for (of course all the politicians send their kids to private schools...).

The result is teachers who are stressed out and want to be paid more.

Del