Temporary Bridge for Swimming Pool

What does it cost to rent a scaffold or even a bucket truck?

How high above the pool is the roof?

What will the beams be resting on?

the highest point above the pool would be about 15 ft. the beams will be resting on flagstone coping.

Flagstone coping could be damaged by the concentrated load. It would be better to use a 2x4 bearing plate beyond the coping. The 2x4 would run at right angles to the beams and bear on the deck slab around the pool.

Four 4x6 beams spanning 16 feet are easily adequate to carry a concentrated load of 300 pounds at mid-span. The bending moment will be 1200 foot pounds. The section modulus is 4 x 3.5 x 5.5²/6 = 70.6 in³ and the maximum bending stress will be 204 psi assuming all loads are centrally positioned on the beams. The deflection will be about 1/4 inch assuming E of 1,000,000 psi.

If the loads are eccentric to the center of the beams, the stresses and deflections will be increased, but still should be adequate with Douglas Fir or SPF beams.

I would use 2X10's rather than 4X6's

2x10: Area A= 15.44 in2; Section Modulus S=24.44 in3

4X6: Area A= 19.94 in2; Section Modulus S= 18.28 in3

The platform would lighter, i.e.more economical, and stronger.

Use 2x10 headers at ends and 2x2 cross brace at midspan.

Cheers.

Vince

This isn't one of those pictures from Stupid Thing People Do.

I take it the safety goggles are to stop his eyes popping out when he's fizzing in the pool!

I wonder how many bottles of the stuff on the counter they had to feed him to get him to do it?

Your pictural answer is VERY humorous. Your answer is "on-topic" only if you mention a "ladder vendor for pools". Since you found [created?] a picture with some time, your patriotic duty is to spend as much time (or more) finding either (a) ladder vendor; or (b) safety requirements for OSHA-approved ladders of that size. With the safety regulations, he can have a custom-built ladder.

I will give you an "on topic," trusting you will do the righteous things and really help the original poster. Keep us in the fun.

PS: Jesus in the Bible Luke chapter 10 says, "The second greatest commandment is this; You shall love (seek to do the best possible, when cost effective) your neighbor as yourself."

This picture represents a very dangerous condition. No reasonable person should try anything like this. This is just irresponsible on your part to show this. Hearing protection is needed when using power tools.

Hearing protection is needed when using power tools.

What did you say?

Valid point, hearing protection is one of the most under-rated PPEs, and chronic exposure can lead to long term hearing losses in older age. We can all look at the obvious issues of electricity and water, but hearing loss is the hidden risk we over look.

From the purely engineering point of view, rather than how it looks.

Can anybody explain what is the difference between a ladder in the pool and a ladder on dry land, from the stabilty point of view

Hello Planet of the Apes,

I can see no difference between working on land or with the ladder in the pool, as long as !) you are not using electric tools. 2) the pool bottom is level. And 3) you are not worried about messing up the pool water or the pool itself with brick dust, paint residue/flakes, filler, etc etc...........It aint going to do your filter and pump much good.

jfmfit

hehehe.........the ladder has no weight in the pool..............makes it easier to shift!!!!!

Hello MOBI,

you would need long legs working in the deep-end?

I have asked for a pic' when he has finished the new roof. Be nice to see what a good job he has done.

jfmfit

How about long stilts?

The problem might be the stability of the ladder. The 1/4" flexing of the beams might convert into a large lateral swings 15 feet's up the ladder. Make sure that you brace it laterally.

Good point, Marcot. The ladder should be laterally braced near the top to prevent it from falling sideways. This could be done with a couple of ropes, one each side tied off to something solid on the building.

If the work at ceiling level requires considerable reaching from the top of the ladder, a scaffold would be a better solution. Again, it should be laterally braced for stability.

Use screws instead of nails to install plywood ( It will make disassembly easier)

Hello guest,

ba/ael seems to have covered most angles with a good post post.

I am an ex builder and have been in the same position. I spanned the pool with 6 x 6 to be safe with 1' ply on top. The wood holding the ply and supporting it has to be two or three feet longer to make sure the ground is safe and it does not put pressure on the pool edge. Put the ladder up to where you have to work and, then nail or screw a 4' x 4' on the ply decking to prevent the ladder from sliding. Also put a screw-hook on the building you are working on at the top of the ladder and thread rope through it and round the top rung of the ladder. It won't go anywhere then. This is the way I always used to work and never once fell because the ladder was secure. This is especially useful if you are working at the same spot on the side of the building and want to put another length of ladder over the tiles to get to the chimney. You should tie both the bottom roof ladder and the upright one together.

Good luck, and let us know how you get on.

jfmfit

Hello,

I forgot to mention I tied a one metre length of 4' x4' to the top of the ladder where it meets the roof/wall also.

Once I actually put three screw eye hooks in where the ladder touches, one in the middle and one about half a metre either side and tied the ladder to all three. But that was when I was carrying heavy hods of bricks and it was extremely windy.

jfmfit

I use the illustration shown previously in my occ. health and safety power point, good to show students what not to do.

The question I ask relating to your question is...............can you swim?

Think outside the box...or inside the pool...

There is nothing stopping you putting supprt jacks down to the bottom of the pool!

Del

I'll go along with that Del! I think there is a danger of over complicating the problem! I would also advise battery driven tools!Why not hire a new scaffold tower with out riggers for a few days! Much cheaper and easier than trying to screw bits of wood together and also it's built for such a purpose! If you are worried about damaging the pool, use the wheels, that way, you can move it about with ease! Try moving your wooden structure about! (I bet next time you hire a scaffold tower!) I would still like to know what you want/need to do to the roof!

Question is of course, how did the chap get on the ladder?

Or is the dark lower side of his overall actually showing wet where he waded into the pool to climb the ladder.....with that drill???

Original poster is not telling you what he wants to do with the roof, maybe we should guess.

I think he is just going to close that tilting window that opened too far so the rope construction does not work anymore. Bit of a design error if you ask me

I'll take a stab at removing lazy paint or changing the lamps in the chandelier!

Or taking the whole chandelier down, Del boy style.

Just hope the power cable breaks before it hits the water in the pool

Just for you case! Enjoy

If he is not doing this, what could he be doing I wonder, still no answers.

Taking spider webs down maybe? I would send the wife up for that one. Mind you at 5Ft1 she would need a full size ladder. Me at 6Ft5 would need only to tiptoe.

This guessing is not much fun with only 2 people playing.

If your wife put you on her sholders, you could do it sitting down! There are only a few possibilities! Could be he's cleaning the reminants of the last party from the roof or installing a mirror ball and laser light show for the next!

Talking about "remnants of party" I have this friend who's best mate is a fireworks engineer. He actually mixes up the stuff for shows and displays, best job in the world. Think of all the beer and the bang at the end.

He once put a homemade firecracker in a cake in the local pub. Problem was the party was the pub warming party and the walls had just been re plastered and all that. You know where this is going.

He was not banned for even the new owners laughed a lot unlike the unlucky person who was cutting the cake at the time it went off. Even all these years later they still talk about the cake plastering and some believe some remnants remain hidden under the new coat of paint and will point decidedly at some sinister looking spots.

A party is just not a party without plenty of beer and a bang at the end if you know what I mean!

The original roof Was made up of a composite pressed wood panelling which was looking tired, plus which absorbed moisture over the years. I'm replacing it with cedar boards.

....or using a boat, either!

Your answer could well be : the existence of your roof. If you have a roof it obviously has been designed with some safety factors. Possiblky quite adequate to remove the evident doubts you display for the solidity of the proposed timber frame.

So do not look down look up ! Most long span bridges are based on suspension. Therefore apply that to you span. Rather than risking a catastrophic dunking, ladder and all , see if you can solicit the roof frames structure to give added security and support to the : flimsy bridge on which a limb or life could depend. Generally good nylon rope will do it .This should be attached to a piece of timber say 4 x 4 fitted under the proposed frame you have in mind i.e. with one rope on each side of the timber connected to the roof . After reaching say the truss of the roof , the ropes should be long enough for the ends thereof to reach the sides of the pool where you secure them adequately.( you can use a long stick or bamboo pole to help you thread the ropes so you do not have the risk of a ladder failing you)

So work safely and intelligently. ( and dont get wet )

Labor Omnia Vincit

Your post is the BEST by far. You gave useful information that was cost effective.

You did not mention how to follow your advice for the original question. The question implies the person is not a civil engineer. Such people need step-by-step instruction how to obtain the information from the roof, since getting plans is more work than overdesigning the needed result. Overdesigning is not cost-effective.

I request you consider adding [specific, detailed instruction]to your potentially cost effective comments already made.

Dear Mr Quey,

Your remarks are true. He is seeking help from Engineers obviously. He has not responded by requesting for more detailed information . As with my peers I am always ready (if able ) to extend help . More so when it relates to safety. As you know the TV showing all of the best video jokes about hapless accidents ( the majority happening in the homes ) evidence, in most cases quite glaringly the dangers of :Do it yourself .

Thus I have suggested that considering that he is a man of substance (no offensive pun intended) his safety would have to be assured. He himself is concerned . As well he should be. I would surmise in absence of fully detailed questions that the roof has been installed with a roofing material. This implies that worker(s) did install same and therefor the frames have that supporting capacity. So that from purely a safety angle (even though good jokes are made that if he falls in the water he will not hurt himself. That is not disputed ) what is disputed is that if he falls it will depend :how he falls . No less importantly if his head hits anything on the way to the water ! His dependents could well and with good reason sue the pants- off all involved. Given that I feel that we all have a duty of care when (what appears to be a genuine question) I would suggest further :

-use the tressle type ladder(as suggested by others ) high enough to be pulled across on the floor of the pool. Provided it reaches the lower chord of the trusses he could swimm to it and reach the roof to do whatever has to be done there.

-If his needs are to work externally on the roof or frame of the building or : its roof, he could consider throwing two ropes across the ridge capping to the other side (use a light rope as what is known as a "heaving line " (which then pulls the strong rope across if he is on his own ) .At the end of the two ropes he can make a simple hanging scaffolding - Here I am assuming that the frames staunchions are on solid ground. and that an ordinary ladder can be safely used to reach the hanging scaffold ) Of course if his needs are on the inside of the roof then other solutions should be considered by him.

-Another simple solution is that he uses minimum : eight : 8 x 50 gallon drums can be lashed onto simple wooden frames. If they are adequately spaced (particularly in the width ) they form a very good floating and stable platform. A couple of sheets of ply-wood are screwed onto the frames . Thereon he can get a double (hinged ) aluminium ladder properly. secured and reach whatever it is he wants to do internally in his pool shed . For his record that float will carry quite safely up to: 1000 kilos or more than 10 times his weight plus ladders and tools ( He should not even have to get his feet wet to float across the pool). He can return the steel drums or sell them as scrap. The rest is quite :re-useable.

-If all the above is too complicated for him and given that he has doubts in his mind as to the integrity of the system he fist suggested . He should consider stabilising same. (either by the earlier suggestion or as follows : That is by threading (some are actually a frame ) a steel or aluminium staunchion of the type which have an adjustable screw to support his "bridge" in the middle ). Again safety: nail on his brige deck wooden "stoppers" to stop the ladder from moving sideways Then and if his ladder is going to be angled thereon . and in order for him to reach the underside of the frame, he had better make sure that "both "ends of his temporary " bridge" are properly secured to resist a lateral movement of his "bridge"

-Give us a drawing of the present installation so we can all sheperd him to a safe conclusion instead of wasting everyones time by having us make suppositions.

I, like others , do not mind helping people but some of the questions asked need in the first instance be sifted. Is this under stating the facts ?

Labor Omnia Vincit

He should consider stabilising same.

You may have reached the perfect solution.

• First turn off the heater to the pool. (if used)
• place as much ice in the pool as needed to drop the temperature to around 40*f
• Add as much Jello (gelatin desert) as needed
• Stir with an electric trolling motor till the Jello sets.
• Now the pool is suitable to place as many sheets of 1/2" plywood as needed to support the ladder.
• If a fall should take place, the Jello should cushion his fall.
• When the product is finished, just heat the pool to dissolve the Jello back to liquid form.

If the OP can not provide any additional information, I'm sticking to this answer.

ROFLMAO

Dang, I see he has a skylight, well back to the ladder. He could pump all the water out onto the lawn, and fill up the pool after the refurbishing is done.

Hello Dave Christian Quey:,

I would just like to point out that, as long as the structure will take the weight, it is better to have a little 'over designing' than have the roof collapse after it is finished?

Just a thought.................

My Dad and me have put a few roof trusses together in our time so 'automatically' know what 'spec'' to use on a roof. For DIY it is a little different and, maybe a bit scary! Roofs are dangerous places. And if you don't know what you are doing in the first place, get a professional in. What was that? You can't afford it? Can you afford to be off work for three months or more because of a fall, or worse be paralysed? Unless you have done it before I would get a roofer in and I would be his labourer, and 'Boss'. Of course I am assuming you have done no roofing before.............

If you are replacing your roof as is, with cedar planks, that is a two man job anyway right? It makes the whole roofing deal safer........Good luck and, keep us informed and, maybe send a picture of the new roof?

jfmfit

When I say 'you', I am referring to the original post, OK.

If indeed the roof is a structural roof, this is well. In many pool enclosures, it is only a screened enclosure. If it is a screened enclosure there is no strength to the aluminum support used to mount the screening. If the weight of a person is placed on it, it will almost surely fail. With none of my usual stupid jokes, this could be dangerous.

A couple of heavy duty walkboards would work better than plywood, we used a walkboard and two aluminum "Hangers" I welded up hanging beneath a boat lift cover over water (A inlet off off Captiva Island FL) to lace the cover on.

Please define a "walkboard" to make you comment really useful.

Also add synanyms to the word "walkboard" so your post can be implemented by finding a vendor of "walkboards" quickly and cheaply.

What do you want to do to the roof? Can it be done using telescopic tools? Paintbrush on a stick trick! Scraper on a stick trick! And for the circus minded or mentally deranged, builder on a stick trick! Of course, ask the builder if he minds being strapped to the stick first!

Go to http://www2.wwpa.org/TECHGUIDEPAGES/Literature/tabid/883/Default.aspx

and get the Western Lumber span tables. You can then find the specifications which will answer your question. ~ T.R.North ~ Maxozone@comcast.net

Just fill the swimming pool in .............and stop wasting water!!!!!!!!!!!

You need new blades on your mower mate. Save some petrol.

..............I blame it on the drought...........should have just thrown the grass ino the pool.

By the look of the pool...........it may have improved it............oops, sorry.

Nice pool.

I actually like the ladder in the pool. It's on a firm foundation. You can boat out to it in a rubber boat with your battery drill, or whatever. If a cat isn't afraid of water, why should you be? Actually, I can do him one better: Get on the roof, cut a hole, then hang from a rope and do the repair. After it's finished, put in a skylight to hide the hole! Maybe a light was what you wanted in the first place!?

Do you think that an 250 h.p. outboard would be sufficient to reach the ladder in the pool??

Is this all getting out of hand............or what????

Definitely, but we're having fun!

This is also true.............and I would probably be one of the worst offenders in some threads...............still, nothing like a good laugh.

As the saying goes. "All work and no play makes Jack a dull boy"

I always remember, a couple of my report cards whilst doing my apprenticeship.......

...........is the court jester of the term...........

.........shows signs of leadership............but always in the wrong direction.......

What's changed??????

Here is the before picture. I"m replacing the pressed wood paneling with cedar board

Aha! All is clear now! Nothing to do with chandeliers or the removal of party debris! What you need is a temporary floor to work off but we've gone through all that so I won't repeat it ! Nice swimming pool!

Water looks a bit too green to be a pool. You need yourself some algae eaters, few Koi Carps and a handful of devil sharks to make a stonking good indoor pond. Throw that plant from the corner in for good measure and se it develop into the ass kicking wildlife pond it should be over the next few months or so.

What is that, a floater in the middle?

Also some dark sinkers on the bottom I would not trust between my toes.

Sorry but the roof is the least of your problems I think (_{only kidding you})

Off course it is a nice.....pool

I think you could be on to an earner there Case! If he knocked out the glass doors and that glass roof bit he could hire it out to the fly fishing community as a practice pond! Quick number crunch.......crunch, crunch... $10 an hour, if you book it for the day it's only $100 with a BBQ lunch, rod hire and basic casting lessons, Or convert it into a koi carp farm!

Well that's that then! The thread has truly been lost!

You may also be able to obtain some very cheap European carp................and heaps of them...............at the moment. They (the carp) are even having problems because of the long drought and lack of water in the Murray Darling Basin

I went for a cruise and morning tea on a small vessel on the Murray River, last week.

The skipper said the river is 4' below its normal level and they expect it to be another 4' down in 6 months. He even has trouble now, getting his vessel alongside, because of a sand bar. He is not allowed to move the sand bar or put a mooring further out, because of................native title!!!!!!

I think we have a problem.

Hello MOBI,

Just to point out I used to work in a fish Farm. Meant in the best possible taste..............UK/English Carp are not cheap! They have very good, not to Say tasty lineage from Japan...........

Sumut fishy going here.

Another choice is to move to the Kelvin scale and freeze toward the bottom end and watch all the lovely 'fog' float over the pool which working on the roof.

jfmfit

Nice pool,

Had you done this before, all of us do-gooders would have been saved valuable "procrastinating CR4 time". It does merit , at the very least , a beer party for the boys who may live near by ( Count us out we are at : the pools water level "down under".)

Probably we might ship to you beer that can be called beer.Quite unlike the Budwater you guys swear by.

Meanwhile the parthian shaft is : Get a bloody good carpenter. Its safer and possibly cheaper for you

Labor Omnia Vincit

It appears you have chosen lime flavored Jello.

Very quick bob c!

I know this guy who might be able to help you out...

Again we have a blatant disregard for the most basic of safety standards. Where are the leveling devices for the ladder.

This has to be the best post so far.

Up a bit more Brian!

Oh Mr Truman, (camp voice) That is a lovely pink box you have got!

Ok ( normal voice) I will shut up.

Collars and cuffs I'll have you know!

someone sensibly suggested one of these would make the job a bit safer too

We knew Del had to get in on the act! Pesky cat!

oh CRAP!

Not to worry! Wait, what's that thing lurking at the bottom of the pool? Sorry, got to go and rescue a management in crisis!

Just to clarify. This roof is only accessible from 1 side?

Are the other 3 sides or more of the building blocked in some way?

Another option is to hire one of theses ( the smaller one!!) for the day! Use it through the glass doors! No getting wet and you could clean the top aswell! Practice outside with the arm first before you attempt the door entry!

Make sure that this does not happen

Hello Guest,

why do you not join CR4? Its great!

Along with other more serious input on your problem.................

Leave the water as it is and work with am appropriate type of ladder in the pool, but, add three or four bottles of Coidiene...................If you fall in, the water swallowed in trying to get out will have any headache better by the time you climb out!

jfmfit

If you fall in, the water swallowed

Would you drink that water...................not this little black duck.

Hello MOBI,

I actually can't swim, so yes I probably would be gulping 'air' when 4' under! .

jfmfit

What about freezing the water? That would be really cool.

Excellent idea. That is if the whole of the CR4 mob is coming to the beer party. After returning to the old " ice box " concept . Why Not ?

" Plus cela change , plus cela est la meme chose"

Labor Omnia Vincit.

With this many legs on the job, it never gets done