5kw DIESEL GENSET

Hi Spark,

It's an aircooled generic model from China.

It's marketed by every Tom, Dick and Henry here in Canada.

It's called "Western Rugged"

I'll make sure it gets enough cool air.

I have an old gas genset, which I operated in that way and it never took any damage, but I just wanna make sure I don't wreck this new diesel.

I've had the gas genset since 1975, but it was only 2.7 KW just a little too small.

I know you are a ham, me also, maybe we can talk on 20m some day when the solar cycle gets back up again.

My callsign is VE3OOA

Thanks for your advise

all the best

Jens

in Canada

Jens:

Let not yer heart be troubled, if yer not creating pressure by putting 6 or more elbows within a 2' span all is well.

For generic diesel extension pipe:

Make with shallow bends and increase pipe size 25%-50% of OEM, incline upwards with tip bent outward to keep rain/snow out. Run pipe up higher than shed roof, is okay if increase pipe size and suggest make with hard pipe not flex. Diesel does produce a soot, so you point the exhaust up and the soot will cool then drop to the ground within 200'.

In Guyana, what you've done is common practice. I've never personally experienced or heard of any such problem with such an installation. Since your engine is aircooled, what you could possibly try is some ducting from your big fan to the unit.

If unable to resolve the question with the manufacture use larger tubing as you extend the lenght so as not to provide back pressure. Allow for expansion in your piping.

Read page 12 on this site.

http://www.deep.org/reports/mechanicsman.pdf

Hi Dad with 5 boys,

It's a small world.

That PDF came from the college where I took my 3 year technology program in

instrumentation and robotics and automation.

What a surprise

All the best

Jens

Thanks guys for the advice

all the best

Jens

the electronics guy

Now that we know it is possible, you might want to provide insulation around the exhaust pipe where it goes through the wall or ceiling of your shed. It would be embarrasing to set the bloody thing on fire... especially if you had no hotdogs or marshmallows.

Bill

Hey thanks for mentioning the need to insulate the wood from the hot exhaust,

I did have enough foresight to do that.

I'm more concerned about my old gas genset leaking on the floor and setting the shed on fire, that's why I built it far enough away from the house so if it should happen, I'd still have the house.

all the best

Jens

Dear Jens,

I am using Diesel gensets of 6KVA to 160 kva capacity

and are running them sometimes for even 24 hrs continuos

basis ,each of them have extensions of 6ft(1.8 metre) to

16 ft (4.8 metre) .We have not had any problems even at

47 degree celcius ambient tempratures.My own experiance

is over hundred thousand hrs. As you have provided

forced ventillation I can say that you should not

have any problem.

Regards

Kishore K.Gupta

New Delhi INDIA

Thanks Kishore for telling me, now I won't worry about overheating.

We only get temperatures as high as maybe 35 Celsius and that rare for a summer in

northern Ontario Canada, but we get real cold in the winter sometimes -45.

And a diesel is hard to start in that cold temperature.

Long time ago I had a Case430 tractor and to start it in the winter one would have to

"rub on it" and pray over it. "I'm only joking", but it was very hard to start in the winter, we ran a small hobby farm at the time.

Take care Jens

If the fan you are using to bring fresh air in is of sufficient volume it should force air to escape out from any leakage as pipes pass through the walls. A CO2 monitor would be a good idea as well. Not too expensive. An older Detroit Diesel that we had came equipped with a factory "cold start" option. In addition to the in block electric heater, it had a propane assist for starting in the extreme cold. The system could spray a small amount of propane while starting if temperatures demanded it. By some good luck we never had any temperatures hear in Fort Lauderdale that required it. If your diesel is hard to start in the cold weather, I would suggest trying to bring some heat to your shed.

I like their answer every time I hear it. They don't have a understanding of the mechanics of the exhaust system. The purpose if the system is to mover the smoke and the noise away from the engine. The old time applications belched out so much unburned fuel and at low temps that it would clog the exhaust system. The other extreme was to allow the exhaust to exit the head and not to worry about the noise and smoke. If the engine is left uncovered and in rain the water could enter the ports and destroy the engine. The exhaust on the trail bike is great in technology for research. You can make it long enough to exit the the confined area. The real way to optimize the system is to take the pulse rate of the exhaust (RPM). Them the speed of sound. You them tune the exhaust so the shock wave creates a pulse at the valve port at the cylinder head. The term is called (Tuned Exhaust) Every racer uses this system to optimize the performance. NASCAR, and NHRA. The thing you are looking for is a pipe long enough to remove the exhaust and noise. A pipe to long or to big becomes cool and fill with shoot.

NASCAR, and NHRA.

Using diesel these days and for performance applications too...

To that list add the American Le Mans Series.

Yes slightly more work, but insignificant in your case, sounds like you did it right.

Just be sure to provide sufficient air for cooling and injestion.

There is a company, called Markal, that sells crayons that melt at specific temperatures. I bought mine from Grainger years ago. Find the max recommended temperature from the gen set manufacturer. Rub the crayon at, or just below the max temp on the crankcase or some other assessable area. If the crayon temp is reached, it will melt, and appear shiny. All of the suggestions on the exhaust so far have been good, but try to avoid PVC pipe as it will not do well in the cold environment.

Jens,

I am certain that there is a specific exhaust extension kit for your particular set. They have them for RV's and home use sets. It usually comes with the proper exhaust manifold gaskit and would probably give you better tuning and performance. They are redily available on the internet, and are fairly inexpensive. Also you should insulate at least around your exit point to insure both fire safety and the threat of re-entering carbon monoxide.

Cheers.

Thanks guys for your help, it's much appreciated.

Jens

Jens,

I think I have the same generic Chinese generator set that you have. I installed it in my garage and extended the exhaust through the wall similar to what you have done. I also used a section of flex pipe to isolate vibration. Just to be safe, I used all 1.5" ID pipe, slightly larger than the size of the muffler outlet, to reduce back-pressure. There are 4 elbows in the system. The total extension is over 10', with no noticeable problems. I did make sure to install a sleeve in the wall and pack the area between the pipe and sleeve with non-flammable insulation so the wall doesn't catch fire. I also wrapped the entire pipe with fiberglass header wrap.

I also welded a pipe nipple to the muffler outlet and put a union right there, so I can easily disconnect the exhaust extension and remove the generator if I need it portable.

Hi Greasy,

It looks like we have the same kind'o genset.

But I didn't have to do any welding. The flexpipe 1 1/2 inch dia. fit snugly over the small black pipe sticking out of the muffler. And I just used an automotive mufflerclamp to fasten it.

How many hours of operarion have you got so far ????

Have you looked at the waveform of the 120/240 ???

Very lousy immitation of a sinewave. I expected it to be much better.

I would NOT run my computer on it, with out a good 60 hz filter.

Laptop is OK I think, but not desktop.

I noticed the multiple step waveform and I was surprised that it wasn't smoother

than it showed.

I'm kind'o disappointed, but it'll have to do. It will however run my whole house, but only with the hotwater tank turned off. That's OK with me.

All the best

Jens

Jens,

My outlet pipe was a little small to clamp the 1.5 inch directly to it. Plus, I just like to find welding projects, and I thought it would leak less than a muffler clamp. I brazed the 2' flex pipe to a threaded nipple and used schedule 40 galvanized pipe from there. To keep the rain and bugs out, I capped it off with a tractor exhaust flapper too.

I really don't have many hours on it because it is a standby generator. Maybe 15 hours total. I added a digital hour meter even though it sits most of the time. I have also been able to run the whole house including the oil furnace, the fridge, and the well pump.

Thanks for the warning on the waveform--I was not aware of that. I will be careful what electronics I am using when under generator power. I figured there would be some cons with this machine, but for the price, you can't beat it.

Hi Greasy,

I think I'll also put a flapper on the end of the pipe.

I told you that I can't run the house with the hot water tank ON.

But I found a way to do that and if you are interested I'll let you how.

But if you are on natural gas you're OK without the modification.

Where did you get an hour-meter ???

I live on a small farm here in northern Ontario Canada

and I had 3 black outs this month alone.

One was 10 hours. (a drunk driver knocked out a pole and transformer).

I didn't buy the genset just for the toy. We really need it up here.

Last summer we were out (if I remember correctly a full day).

And I won't ever forget the blackout of 2003 (I think it was 4 days).

I did have the old gas genset then and we didn't loose any food.

But we live in the country (in the bush) and we are not as important

as all the folks in the city. So they get first help.

all the best

Jens

Jens,

The hour meter came from my local NAPA auto parts store. They have a master catalog of parts for all sorts of things. Not the flapper, though. That came off the shelf at Tractor Supply Co.

I was expecting to lose power more often where I live, but "out in the woods/bush/country" is only 15 minutes from civilization near me.

With one major ice storm, hurricane, or blizzard it will pay for itself. They are rare for us, but only time will tell when the next one comes. And I'll be ready.

Take care

Thanks greasy,

We have a NAPA store nearby.

I'll get one

Thanks a million

Jens

How did you solve the hot water heater problem?

Hi Bob,

Very simple :

We don't have the kids at home any more. We are kind'o retired.

So we don't need 1 or even 2 hour recovery on our hot water.

We only take 1 shower/person/day and we only wash clothes when we have enough for a full load.

So I simply rewired the tank and the panel to run at 750W instead of 3000W.

I don't care if it takes even all day to recover the heat in the tank.

Now it takes 4 times longer than with 3000W.

3000 divided by 750 = 4.

You can even lower it to 375W if you really want to sqeeze it.

But if you have kids (especially girls, they take a lot of showers) forget it

(you'll run out of hot water)

So now I can run almost everything. Hot water tank, well pump, furnace,

sump pump and stove, light (CFL only) and 1 window air cond.

(but the wife can't bake though, that'll have to wait till the grid comes back on).

and no clothes dryer. (dry it on a line outside or inside).

all the best

Jens

That includes fridge and freezer, I forgot to mention.

I'm sitting in front of the computer, I can't think of everything, sorry I'm past 65.

And I don't run my PC on the genset. Very lousy waveform coming out of those type of generators.

Jens

Main thing is that you do not put too much back pressure onto the engine ... which you will not with an open ended 1.5" x 16" tube connected onto the end of the existing. You should not have any problems.

Hi Thanks for your advice,

I didn't think I had too much restriction on my exhaust either, thanks.

regards

Jens

Hello Jens, TMF here.

I just happened upon your 5kw diesel genset thread. Here in sunny Florida, many of the Orange groves are irrigated with diesel powered well pumps. Many of these are housed in inclosed sheds. They all either leave the large doors open for ventalation or have very large louver panels mounted both near the bottom and tops of the walls. This permits the engine to pull cooler air in from the bottom for combustion and have the hot air exhaust naturally at a higher level. I have noticed that the exhaust pipes can be lengthy, depending on how the engines are arranged within the building, but the exhaust pipes are always larger than one might think necessary and are not reduced after the exhaust vacates the engine.

TMF

THANKS TMF

REGARDS

JENS