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Join Date: Sep 2008
Posts: 2

need help calculating butt-weld length

09/20/2008 9:36 AM

Hello,

I am usure about calculating the weld length to butt-weld two pieces of 32mm mild steel plate 300mm wide. The load on the plate is 20 MPa. My calculations give a weld length for a single pass, partial penetration weld of just 210mm on either side of the plate with a 5mmm electrode. It seems like a very small amount of weld for such a large plate.

The thinking behind is: If 20 MPa is applied to the plate it is the same as 20 N/mm^2 so to find the force on the plate I have multiplied the cross sectional area 9600mm^2 by 20 N to get 192 kN.

The weld metal UTS is 410 MPa with a safety factor of 3 gives 137 MPa allowable and for a 5mm electrode throat thickness is 5*0.707= 3.54 mm. So (stress allowable * throat thickness) should give allowable force per mm which is 484 N. Then 192kN/484 = 397mm. Divided by two gives approx 200 mm per side of plate and 2* 5mm is added for stop and start= 210mm per side. Can anyone confirm this result?

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Anonymous Poster
#1

Re: need help calculating butt-weld length

09/20/2008 10:17 PM

Yes, your calculations seem correct.

Just a few things:

  1. Are you looking at a 'T' joint with fillet welds? (I am just trying to see why you went with 0.707 of throat thickness)
  2. The amount of weld material seems so low because the loading for that size of plate is low. See 3 below.
  3. Normally welded joints are designed/welded so that they have a minimum strength of the base material. I guess a general point is - if that is the maximum loading for that plate, why so large/thick? Could you not get away with smaller plate to save money? ........... (you didn't mistake 20 MPa loading for 200 MPa, did you?)
  4. Are there any other applicable loadings? How about fatigue considerations?
  5. If this is a true butt-weld (not a fillet welded 'T') it would be general practice to fully weld out the prepped edges of the plates (as per 3 above)
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Anonymous Poster
#2
In reply to #1

Re: need help calculating butt-weld length

09/20/2008 10:19 PM

oh yeah - another thought ........

If this is a fillet welded 'T' - then are you sure of the direction of the loading? Is that 20 MPa in pure tension on the weld/plate, and not with any form of bending?

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Anonymous Poster
#3
In reply to #2

Re: need help calculating butt-weld length

09/20/2008 10:47 PM

Hi - "Guest" here again.

I was thinking a little more - would it be possible to attach a little sketch? Something seems a little off, because normally in these configurations, the loadings are expressed with forces and not pressures (unless you just already calculated the pressure loading).

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#4

Re: need help calculating butt-weld length

09/21/2008 12:53 AM

If you are prosperous enough to use 32 mm plate for only 20MPa resultant loading -- go all the way to make a full penetration 32mm butt weld-- AND FULL LENGTH OF IT.

Use Mig/Mag or Submerged Arc using 1 or 2 600Amps Mig/Mag welding sets simultaneously.

Why make the weld seam the weakest part of your system?

MM

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Participant

Join Date: Sep 2008
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#5

Re: need help calculating butt-weld length

09/21/2008 3:21 AM

Thankyou very much for you replies, I wasn't expecting any so I'm very happy with that, thanks.

The question is actually theoretical because it has appeared on an assignment I am completing. It has thrown me a little that the load was given in MPa because, as you say, loads are normally in kN. I'm thinking because butt-welds have to endure tensile loads mainly that is why the load is given as the tensile stress within the plate. With only 20 MPa stress the plate if fully welded would have a safety factor of 20, the weld material UTS being 410 MPa. It may be an exercise in demonstrating that only the required amount of weld need to be used. Therefore saving costs in joint preparation, weld metal, time, etc. It has confused me because the equation for a butt-weld is just f=F/A, or f= F/ (l*t), and throat thickness (t) in a butt-weld application would be a similiar size to an ordinary fillet weld I'd imagine. So it works out to be the same thing.

I was going use three passes per side with a 12mm electrode and double "V" joint preparation. But it wouldn't be needed for 20 MPa stress with a static load. In reality, at the design stage a much smaller area plate coud be used.

Thanks for the feedback and help, its nice to be able run a strange result by someone else.

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#6
In reply to #5

Re: need help calculating butt-weld length

09/21/2008 8:05 AM

Mind if I ask you what your're studying - UG or PG and if UG then where your are doing it from?

We had to study design of welded joints last semester. But the problems we solved were very elemetary - didnot involve depth of weld, time of weld just the safe length of weld

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