Am I worthy?

Of course you're worthy! Welcome aboard.

I love your show "Sprockets" - Touch the Monkey!

Naturally I cannot speak for anyone else here, Ms. Sproket, but as far as I'm concerned, please feel free to post any question you like! If there happen to be others here (and there are, sadly, as at least one post a few weeks back has made quite clear) who, in light of their own obviously superior knowledge feel morally obligated to sniff at your "dumb" questions as being beneath their dignity; to them I say, "Phooey!" (And to these folks I'd like to say that there is a simple exercise one can do that is guaranteed to cure this attitude. Naturally, the exercise works only if one is genuinely motivated to dispense with such nastiness.)

Post away, Ms. Sproket. You'll not be getting any crap from me!

--Europium

I agree with europium above, with two caveats though. Both of these points are directed at all users of the site, not just you Sproket.

1) Use a search engine or two to see if the answer to your question is readily available before you ask it here. If it's not or if the answer is unclear, then that's a pretty good justification for asking the question. This is not to stifle questiomns - I do believe that anyone has a right to post questions, but you're less likely to be insulted if you have done a little research ahead of time.

2) When you ask the question, provide as much background information as you can. The most frustrating questions on this site are the ones along this line "I need a sensor to test water flow - which is the best one." What are you testing for, what are you trying to determine? Is it in a stream, a pipe, an aquifer? Are you looking to measure velocity or mass? Is it wastewater, potable water, slurry, etc? The more you let us know, the better the chance that someone on the site will be able to help you find an answer.

Both of these points are very well made. Please note, everyone!

(Shakespearean Logic. Nice!)

Ask away, the question is the hunt, the answer is the treasure but finding your own answer and understanding is far more rewarding than just being told A=B. So I have to agree with Silas, do a little searching, if you use engines like wikipedia (don't shoot me) you will notice hypertext links. These are great pathways to get lost on. Rarely does an answer completely satisfy me, I usually find I have more questions about the answer, and this leads to more treasure hunting ad infinitum.

As to being worthy... I have often told my kids the difference between stupidity and ignorance is the ignorant doesn't know and the stupid doesn't want to know.

We are all ignorant of something, fortunately for the world, some are not stupid!

I'm in total agreement. I wish, however, that there was an alternative word for "ignorance".

I was once at a meeting (a political affair, when I was at college) when someone reffered to the ignorance of a certain group of people. The result was uproar - it nearly resulted in physical violence.

The literal meaning, according to the Oxford English Dictionary, is "without knowledge, unlearned".

Every one of us is ignorant in many, many areas, but the word still carries overtones which don't engender inclusion; none of us wants to be called ignorant - we like to think we know what's what, we want to be "in on it" - but every one of us is.

Can anyone come up with a better word (or phrase)?

"Can anyone come up with a better word (or phrase)?"

I think you already did. "Unlearned" is a perfectly good word. We use the word "learned" very often, e.g. "the learned professor", "his learned host", etc. Why not use its antonym? "Uneducated" is another perfectly good word that takes in the meaning you desire, I believe, although you might need to specify the field of knowledge in which the subject is uneducated.

When I am looking for a specific meaning or a better word I often turn to the Merriam-Webster online dictionary and thesarus. The thesaurus entry for "ignorant" has many excellent synonyms and related words:

"Synonyms benighted, dark, illiterate, nonliterate, simple, uneducated, uninstructed, unlearned, unlettered, unread, unschooled, untaught, untutored
Related Words lowbrow, uncultivated, uncultured; callow, green, inexperienced, innocent, naive (or naïve); unsophisticated; raw, untrained; brainless, dumb, idiotic, imbecilic, moronic, stupid, witless; foolish, senseless, silly"

Obviously, some of these words will also create the same kind of uproar you wish to avoid, so choose wisely my learned friend!

I got a kick out of the list of synonyms for "ignorant". I found that in reading through them, and imagining them describing just one person, I started to LOL.

You mentioned that you might need to specify the field of knowledge in which the subject is uneducated. No such limitation applies to me as the subject. I have a hard time thinking of any field in which I am not uneducated.

I like "uninstructed", uneducated seems to imply no education as does unlearned, untaught etc. I realize that uninstructed has the same conotation, but it somehow seems to at least imply only one specific subject.

I note that the next topic is "Mobile Maggots and the Moving Corpse". I haven't checked that one, but would hazard a guess that your posts could not be too much more unusual.

The comments allready hear are all great ones. I'd add that you should realize that we are all a bunch of nitwits (in my oan case, in more ways than I can count) so don't take anything you read hear as absolute truth. FOllow up with your own research.

"Mobile Maggots and the Moving Corpse"? Sound like the Marines!

Ooh, Rah!

By the way... is here a grammar? speeling checker?

See above an example of another error.

WOW. My oan(?) post has several: hear, allready... maybe more i don't even sea????

Cen u ar goin ove topp! stpo it! Slap on rists!

Okay. Why didn't anyone tell me there was gonna be beer? I'm shattered.

Now clean up this mess. Company's coming.

Eye halve a spelling chequer
It came with my pea sea
It plainly marques four my revue
Miss steaks eye kin knot sea.

Eye strike a key and type a word
And weight four it two say
Weather eye am wrong oar write
It shows me strait a weigh

As soon as a mist ache is maid
It nose bee fore two long
And eye can put the error rite
Its rare lea ever wrong.

Eye have run this poem threw it
I am shore your pleased two no
Its letter perfect awl the weigh
My chequer tolled me sew

Mardon me, Padam, but I believe you are occupewing the wrong pie.

If you'll just mollow fee, I'll sew you to another sheet.

(BWT, I'm not under the affluence of inkahol as some thinkle peep!

I've only had tea martunies and skottl of botch.)

I love this. Not long ago I was trying to remember it, but couldn't. I'll make a copy and save it. Thanks.

Hey, Guest, reveal yourself.

If you've got any more like this, we'll have 'em!

Hi there guest,

There was no misspelling in your little poem that I could find, but then again I am a bad speller."Tri linguisticly challenged" I call it. Arrogant are the people that think they know. They can only be recognised by the people that know. So that helps.

The best of teachers are not arrogant. The pupil can never ask wrong questions but receive only bad answers. Some times moral support can achieve more than technical information.

Its arrogant to bounce a question that was meant "in a honest way" and not cosider the other persons "disabilities" that he/she mentioned in the first place. I am a bit of a "funny learner" myself and have stopped caling it names.

Your Questions are welcome. If I don't like them, I will not react like I did. You keep asking away and making $$ like the rest of us. Good luck. Ky

Should one ever appologies for bad spelling??

Re your comment on poem by guest - spelling mistakes. "its" appears twice. It should be "it's" (abbreviation of "it is"). How's that for pedantry?

Piont is, the spel chekr doesn't find it!

Codemaster,

You are incorrect because "its" is a perfectly good word spelled correctly. No, it is not the contraction for "it is", as you pointed out. It is the correct spelling of the possessive of "it". Just like "he" and "his", we have "it" and "its". And that was the point of the poem, a spell checker will not catch correctly spelled words that are misused for another word that sounds the same but is spelled differently.

Due ewe sea watt eye halve bin tall king a bout? Its ass plane ass the knows on yore vase!

Replying to #38 by STL Engineer

I know "its" is a perfectly good word, as you say it is the abbreviation of "of it" so is not always incorrect. I didn't say it was.

But it's not a possessive in the poem. The words of the poem (written out in full and without the jokes) are "It is rarely....." and "It is letter perfect...." and as I said the abbreviation of "it is" is "it's".

The poem was amusing, all the same.

Butt the hole point is that the owed gets passed the spell chequer!

Re #41 by JohnDG

OK, it's probably half-way between a spelling and a grammatical error, but as we've all agreed there is a word "its" so spell checker wouldn't find it. I just tried Word grammar checker and that didn't notice it either.

Cheers

So I guess you are saying you only made a "half-way" mistake? Way to go!

The "owed" gets buy the spell chequer? I think you meant to right: The wood gets paste the spell checker.

(Please don't hit mi!)

Codemaster,

Here is your quote, in case you forgot it,

"Re your comment on poem by guest - spelling mistakes. "its" appears twice. It should be "it's" (abbreviation of "it is"). How's that for pedantry?"

Pedantry? Dictionary says "presentation or application of knowledge or learning". I would say it was not very good pedantry! Here is why:

It looks like you were disagreeing with "ky" who said he found no misspellings in the poem. Most people would interpret your comment as saying that "it's" is a spelling mistake. And now you try to cover YOUR mistake by denying it and adding to your mistake at the same time! You did this when you said, 'it is the abbreviation of "of it" ' (which I did NOT say by the way).

Funny, "Its" is not an abbreviation at all. It is an adjective or a possessive pronoun, depending on use. "It's" is not even an abbreviation either, it is a contraction. The word "dept." is an abbreviation, so is "CR4" or "FBI".

If you knew that it was a perfectly good word, why did you pick it out from all the others? No, it is not possessive in the poem. Almost none of the words in the poem were used properly. That was the "hole" point!

You did say, at least by implication, that "its" was spelled incorrectly, don't deny that, and I said that it was a correct spelling, just incorrectly used, like most of the other words. Geeesh!

Will someone give me an A-men?

Pull ease stop beaten a dead hoarse!

I would certainly give you an amen, even at the risk of bringing religion into the forum.

As for beating dead ladies-of-the-night, tho -- we haven't been doing that here, halve we, along with all our other sins?

OK STLengineer, I was missing the obvious point that "its" is a word so OK for the context of the poem.

So I admit I was wrong - how's that for humility?

Dang! There ain't no beers here. If you think that Silas's picture looks like a beer, you must be city folk. That there is a kat!

Do not be deceived by appearances: that is a khat, not a kat. Khat is even better than beer and contains central nervous system stimulants which produce feelings of happiness and pleasure - explaining in large part the general tenor of this thread .

A large part of the economy in the countries of Kenya, Somalia, and Yemen and neighboring areas of east-central Africa, khat has been used socially for centuries – much as alcoholic beverages are used in western countries. Cathinone, one of the alkaloids in khat, has recently been designated as a Schedule 1 controlled substance by the U.S. Drug Enforcement Agency (DEA).

I don't mind, really, as I'll take a good, full-bodied stout over a hairball any day.

--Europium

Michelle:

I just had this sinking feeling. Several of us have taken taken off on a tangent in this thread re spelling. I suspect you've struggled with spelling, and hope you realize that we are not making fun of you: we're making fun of ourselves as well as our reliance on spell checkers. You are very welcome here: you'll find many thoughtful and helpful people here (and an occasional dud -- but they are easy to ignore).

College -- exciting times. If I were going to offer old fart advice, it would be to take advantage of every opportunity college offers you. Learn everything you can. Have fun.

Regarding the spell checker (and this has come up so many times since the site format change). There isn't one .

I cut and past to word and use it instead . Easy.

I would rather have the emoticons than the spell check any day. They just seem to help convey the message better (and certainly brighten up my day) .

Someone told me long ago "Ignorance is correctable, Stupid is forever". There is no-one on the planet that knows everything. Keep on trying.

best wishes

Ditto what everyone else has said, for the most part.

The only stupid question is the one you can easily find out for yourself. We are not your professors or your TA's. We are not your college library. If you are having trouble with a subject you should go to those resources first, or try Google or another search engine.

Contrary to what someone else posted, Wikipedia is not a search engine, rather it is an easily accessible, web-based, database of general knowledge. However, do be careful of fully accepting any answer from only one source, unless it is one which is well known and authoritative (like Merriam-Webster for dictionary and thesaurus informatiion). Wikipedia is nice, and I quote it a lot, but it is definitely NOT the Encyclopedia Britannica! Since Wikipedia takes contributions (and editing) from any and all, it cannot be considered authoritative, merely informative. Always, ALWAYS, use multiple sources to confirm a "truth", especially if it is really important and hard to retract.

One other thing about your post had me puzzled. You claimed to have dyscalcula and dyslexia and so changed majors from Chem(istry?) to Finance. I take that to mean that you have extreme trouble reading and writing (Dyslexia) and doing calculations (Dyscalcula). If that is so, you should perhaps change majors again, perhaps to something more artistic or hands-on, like graphic art, theater, physcial education, etc. Having completed degrees in both Engineering (B.S.) and Business (M.B.A.) I feel qualified to say this. Outside of the realm of Math, Science and Engineering, I can't think of any major based more on reading and writing (other than English or Journalism) than Business subjects, and no Business subject based more on calculations than Finance. If you truly have dyslexia and dyscalcula you may be biting off more than you can chew in choosing a major in Finance.

When you are truly stumped, and can't find the answer anywhere else, or just want to participate in a discussion where you have something useful to add, by all means, we welcome your contributions. What many people object to here is college students who decide that this is some sort of "homework cheat site" where they can have someone else do the work for them. While some here might relish the opportunity to sharpen up old rusty skills by working the homework problem, consider this and consider it well, if you cheat on your homework by using someone else's answers, you are only cheating yourself, because the purpose of any homework or other college assignments is to help you learn, by practice, repetition, and self-discovery.(That's when the little light bulb goes on over your head!)

And, having taught college a little, you can quote me on that!

(standing) Bravo!

You Wrote: And, having taught college a little, you can quote me on that!

I just might quote you (if that's OK of course)! I'm reworking some of the site policies and since you've rather eloquently explained the situation, I may use your words in relation to homework.

Thanks,
- Chris

Of course. Feel free to plagiarize....I mean paraphrase.

Quoted text: "If that is so, you should perhaps change majors again, perhaps to something more artistic or hands-on, like graphic art, theater, physcial education, etc."

I must stand up for the Graphic Artists. Graphic Arts might seem like a non technical profession to you, but you are wrong to assume there is no need to be able to write or do calculations to be successful in this field. The graphic arts field is a very technical area which requires a solid background in science, applied mathematics, imaging technology, printing processes, web, and interactive programming, broadcast media etc.. More often than not a graphic arts degree is a Bachelor of Science, rather than an Arts degree. It's not all drawing pretty pictures as you might think.

Geez, I did not know that Graphic Artists needed someone to stand up for them! I never said that it was non-technical, just that it was not mathematically or lexically (is that a word? ) intense. Man, you must have a thin skin!

My own sister is a successful Graphic Artist, well versed in imaging technology, printing processes, broadcast media, etc. But she would be the first to admit that her spelling is atrocious, her writing abilities are mundane, and her mathematical skills, outside of what is necessary for everyday life, virtually non-existant, despite taking College Algebra and Calculus.

For that matter, she acheived a BFA degree, which, she claimed, was much more intense than the ordinary BA degree, and equivalent to a BS, which her school did not offer in Art. I know that it is not "all drawing pretty pictures", since she rarely does that, but it is still very visually-oriented, and hands-on, wouldn't you agree, "Mousejockey"?

My point was, and remains, if Michele/Sproket truly has "dyslexia" and "dyscalcula", even if in a mild form, perhaps just as a phobia rather than a physiological affliction, Finance might not be a better choice than Science, and other choices might better fit her other skills, presuming she has them.

I am sorry if you were offended by my use of Graphic Arts as one of those choices which required more artistic or hands-on skills. Perhaps you should change your alias to "Mouseketeer" to reflect the closer similarity of your field to the Engineer profession.

Point of clarification:

My guesses -

BA = Bachelor of Arts

BFA = Bachelor of Fine Arts

BS = Bachelor of Sience (or BSc = Bachelor of Science)

Am I anywhere near correct?

JohnDG,

You are correct. These are common US college degrees. Sorry, I sometimes forget this is an international forum and some of you may not be familiar with US terms.

For your amusement, here are alternative definitions of some degrees:

BS - Bull Sh*t

MS - More of the Same

PHD - Piled Higher and Deeper

Michelle,

Have you gotten feedback that serves your needs? If so, are you now a registered user on CR4? I hope so!

I say that I hope you have registered not only because of the questions you ask but of the contribution you can make. While I have enjoyed the humor shared by fellow bloggers, the fact that you posted your question and shared something about yourself (strengths, weaknesses and interests) of value that brings the CR4 community to a much higher level. I have found in my tenure that asking the right question is more difficult than having the right answer.

I know a little bit about dyslexia but I had never heard the term 'dyscalcula' before and now find there is a world of information on the subject! For other readers, please take a peek at: www.dyscalculia.org. I had no idea there was this wealth of information on this topic.

Some bloggers wondered about your current pursuits in finance and whether that was a good choice for you. I wonder about that, too. It may be a good choice for you (the math isn't the same as it is for engineers but it still requires significant rigor). And, the thought that crosses my mind is why you are still interested in science/engineering matters if you have moved to other endeavors. I ask because many science/engineering students don't have a particular focus at this stage of their professional lives(i.e. nanotechnology), as you stated.

So, it seems to me that you have a certain energy level, creativity and, most of all, vision that is extremely welcome to this community and to the science/engineering community at large. I think you will be a refreshing resource to the often staid world of science/engineering. Perhaps you should consider taking design courses where your skills and interests could be real assets, allow you to develop your potential and lead the fulfilling life you clearly see for yourself.

There are a lot of academically brilliant engineers and scientists but I have not seen any data that suggest a correlation between academic brilliance and professional contribution, business success or personal fulfillment. I believe you may have many of the other attributes necessary for an organization to achieve success.

I wish you well and look forward to your contribution here. I hope we can help you and, in turn, know that you are helping us all.

I too hope you have joined us Michelle.

I keep returning to your first statement and thinking that if you love science and all things connected to it, then it would be sad to lose you to finance, or any other field. You clearly communicate well, so you've learned to cope very well with the dyslexia, it seems. If calculations prove challenging, remember that they are often a small part of the real work of science. There are observations to be made, experiments to run, insights to be drawn, concepts to be developed. In my own work, which involves work with structures and aerodynamics, I often calculate things by hand or using a calculator, but for the difficult calculations, I have the computer do it. I've designed a couple of things that have made people say "wow", and in doing so, I could have handed off the calculations to someone else: it wasn't the math that made them say "Wow", it was the concept.

So I think you should do what you love. Maybe team up with a math whiz, or rely more heavily on computers… but stay with what you love.

There is already a tall pile of replies here, and you've probably given up on our long winded posts. But I cannot help myself.

You said something about questioning a pretty well accepted formula, and getting laughed at. In my mind you are already getting more moneys worth of your college $. Those that come to class, soak it in, study FOR THE TEST, take the test, get the grade will get the same peice of paper that you will. The diference in the end is that you will know how and where to ask questions and how to teach yourself for the rest of your life. ASKING WHY is what makes a person a scientist or an engineer, not that damn peice of paper. If you are asking why this is they way it is, it means you are trying to understand the fundamental mechanics of why things are and how they work, instead of memorizing some equation that the prof said you'll need to know for the exam and forget it by next semester.

I don't know much about dyslexia, so will not tell you to change majors or what to take, but in what ever you do ask those questions let the others laugh, you will be the one ahead. If you have the desire, no, the need to understand what supports the stuff they are trying to stick in your head, you are blessed. Take that urge to understand and run with it, learn all you can.

Some notes that you shouldn't forget. Bethoven was deaf, Hellen Keller was blind, and Emma King is dyslexic (I must admit that I had to do a search for the last one.) check out her website if you like: http://www.vega.org.uk/video/programme/89 I read at Wikipedia that dyslexia is used to explain learning disabilities not explained by other factors including, I quote "a lack of intellectual ability" I had the privalige to work with a study abroad student from denmark who worked around dyslexic and spoke broken english. This was in a senior level applied thermodynamics class based on power plant design. His ability on exams and class involvement was confidently in the upper 20% of the class. A very intellegent and creative and innovative person who I would gladly work with agian.

Again, I don't know much about dyslexia (other than what I just researched) and don't know to what degree you are affected by it. So if I said anything that offended or bothered you I sincerely appologize and hope you forgive my ignorance.

Nicely put, Juba!

"Bethoven was deaf, Hellen Keller was blind..."

Beethoven was deaf only later in his career, but he still wrote beautiful and complex symphanies after he lost his hearing.

Helen Keller on the other hand was blinded by a childhood disease when she was 19 months old, which also left her deaf and dumb (unable to talk, not stupid) as well. She was later able to learn sign language and to talk through the perserverence of her teacher, Anne Sullivan, who was herself visually impaired. Her notable achievements included:

• "graduated from Radcliffe magna cum laude, becoming the first deaf and blind person to graduate from a college." Ref: Wikipedia
• Authored 12 books
• Was a public speaker and advocate for people with disabilities as well as other social and political causes.
• Was awarded the Presidential Medal of Freedom, one of the United States' top two highest civilian honors, by President Lyndon B. Johnson .
• Introduced the Akita breed of dogs to the US from Japan.
• Is honored by having her name and likeness on the Alabama State Quarter coin. That would make her only the third real female (after Susan B. Anthony and Sacajewea), not counting various likenesses of Lady Liberty and a female "Indian", to be so honored on a US coin.

So, yes, you go girl! Hard work can overcome many difficulties.

Thank you for the help STL, I just couldn't take time to dig up the details. Work gets in the way of important stuff! There are so many others out there that overcome dificulties and challenges to flourish. I remember reading a book about Hellen Keller in highschool English/Liturature class, I remember Hellen's parents disliking Anne because of her "smoked glasses" I need to go find that book, I think it was an autobiography written in the third person.

The important thing is don't just go for the grade, that won't last past your first job. Go for the learn. I didn't get very many A's in Engineering courses, not becuase I didn't apply myself. It's because I didn't focus on the grade. I focused on identifying what I wanted to learn, what questions I wanted answered and I applied myself to learn and understand the why part of what most of the other students tried to memorize. I would run out of time on many of my exams because I didn't memorize the equations. I would (and still do) use unit ballances to determine what all the steps needed to be to get to the answer. Sort of deriving the equations from the fundamentals as I went along. I learned that if I set up all of the equation(s) with notes explaining what's going on and the steps I went through, but never plugged the numbers in I would often get most of the points (15-19 pts out of 20) depending on the proffesor, and problem. Of course that's if everything I had down was correct. Most of the proffesors graded thier own exams and most would realize that I was not simply memorizing the concepts, but really learned the why. Overall, a college degree really shows that you can learn, and overcome difficulties, and are willing to take on challenges.

A-men to that, brother!