Rust Converter

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Curiousinthephilippines Member Join Date: Jun 2009 Posts: 8	Rust Converter 05/12/2010 5:41 AM
	What would cause a gallon of freshly prepared rust converter to bulge? Would the gas be hydrogen? Is this cause by metals in the formula? Which ones?Can something be done to prevent this bulging? Could the bulk of rust converter still be used? thanks!
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PWSlack Guru Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: In the bothy, 7 chains down the line from Dodman's Lane level crossing, in the nation formerly known as Great Britain. Kettle's on. Posts: 32175 Good Answers: 839	#1 Re: rust converter 05/12/2010 5:56 AM
	What are the ingredients of the freshly-prepared rust converter solution? What does the manufacturer's Materials Safety Data Sheet say about what is in it? __________________ "Did you get my e-mail?" - "The biggest problem in communication is the illusion that it has taken place" - George Bernard Shaw, 1856
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PWSlack Guru Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: In the bothy, 7 chains down the line from Dodman's Lane level crossing, in the nation formerly known as Great Britain. Kettle's on. Posts: 32175 Good Answers: 839	#2 Re: rust converter 05/12/2010 6:50 AM
	One of the possibilities is that there was no space in the top of the vessel before the lid was put on, and that the liquid has undergone a rise in temperature at Phillipine latitudes. "Vessel pregnancy" is inevitable under those circumstances. __________________ "Did you get my e-mail?" - "The biggest problem in communication is the illusion that it has taken place" - George Bernard Shaw, 1856
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Mikerho Guru Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: Moses Lake, WA, USA, Thulcandra - The Silent Planet (C.S. Lewis) Posts: 4216 Good Answers: 194	#3 In reply to #2 Re: rust converter 05/12/2010 9:24 AM
	I agree, especially with this quite volatile mix: Acetone 50-60% Dimethyl Ether 15-20% Isobutane 10-15% Propane 3-5% Isopropanol 3-5% Ethylene Glycol 3-5% Oxalic Acid 3-5% Tannic Acid 1-5% I got this from one Rust Converter MSDS. I was surprised to see some of these compounds in the mix, especially isobutane and propane. My guess is that the viscosity needs to be quite low in order to effectively penetrate the rust layer. Anyway, now I know what rust converter is. __________________ "Reason is not automatic. Those who deny it cannot be conquered by it. Do not count on them. Leave them alone." - Ayn Rand
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Doorman Guru Join Date: Apr 2009 Location: Yellowstone Valley, in Big Sky Country Posts: 7425 Good Answers: 295	#4 In reply to #3 Re: rust converter 05/12/2010 11:30 AM
	Mikerho, is the MSDS you found for an aerosol can? Isobutane and propane are common propellants for aerosol spray. __________________ Semper Ubi Sub Ubi
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Mikerho Guru Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: Moses Lake, WA, USA, Thulcandra - The Silent Planet (C.S. Lewis) Posts: 4216 Good Answers: 194	#5 In reply to #4 Re: rust converter 05/12/2010 11:44 AM
	Oh yes! Well that was really stupid! __________________ "Reason is not automatic. Those who deny it cannot be conquered by it. Do not count on them. Leave them alone." - Ayn Rand
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Brave Sir Robin Guru Join Date: May 2007 Location: Annapolis, Maryland Posts: 7940 Good Answers: 458	#8 In reply to #3 Re: rust converter 05/13/2010 10:49 AM
	GA. Thanks for publishing the recipe. Now I can mix my own brew rather than paying the $6 for a spray can down at the local parts store.
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Curiousinthephilippines Member Join Date: Jun 2009 Posts: 8	#6 In reply to #2 Re: rust converter 05/13/2010 2:40 AM
	The rust converter is mostly phosphoric acid with zinc oxide, butyl cellusolve, copper carbonate and nitric acid. Would the bulging be caused by the late reaction of the copper carbonate triggered only by the hot temperature ? or would the bulging be all caused by Zn reacting with the acid (though it is already contained in plastic gallons)?
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LAA_Lucke Guru Join Date: Feb 2010 Posts: 1013 Good Answers: 36	#7 In reply to #6 Re: rust converter 05/13/2010 6:46 AM
	Any mixture, in general, has a shelf life! If you mix such a preparation for rust conversion, you expect it to react with thr rust which is an oxide (yes?). In the mix, there are oxide already! the reaction between the compounds in the mix will eventually take place with time and the help of ambiant temperature-->Heat will be generated once the reactions take place or start to happen and the speed of reaction will increase....Hence the bulging and maybe explosion of the container... Only prepare a mixture prior to usage and use as soon as possible then empty the rest or use it all. Don't keep any in a lidded container.
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