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Anonymous Poster

Transformer Internal Fault

01/16/2011 1:59 AM

Hi,

As it is said during an internal fault more current flows into it than leaves it and which also forms the basis of differential protection which senses this unbalance and the relay operates however i have doubt regarding this as transformer is a step up/step down equipment and that depends upon the no of turns so suppose if a transformer current transformation ratio i.e pri to sec current is 1/1000 A and due to internal fault suppose 3 A current flows into primary then i believe 3000 A current should flow out of transformer secondary,why any other value,help.

Regards,

Sohan.

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Guru
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#1

Re: Transformer internal fault

01/16/2011 2:30 AM

Eh? How can more <...current flow into it than leave it...>?

This statement doesn't make sense.

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Anonymous Poster
#2
In reply to #1

Re: Transformer internal fault

01/16/2011 2:38 AM

that's what happens in case of internal fault like inter-turn fault and i am also not able to understand that.

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Guru
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#3
In reply to #1

Re: Transformer internal fault

01/16/2011 2:38 AM

Current travels at the speed of light, right? So when it enters the wire, it hasn't yet emerged from the other end? Thus for some few nanoseconds, maybe the OP is right? There are other confusions, though.

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Anonymous Poster
#4
In reply to #3

Re: Transformer internal fault

01/16/2011 2:51 AM

may be,any other thoughts??????

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Guru
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#5
In reply to #4

Re: Transformer internal fault

01/16/2011 3:02 AM

No, that's probably the only thought I have about this.

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Guru
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#6

Re: Transformer internal fault

01/16/2011 3:47 AM

Power in is compared to power out by the use of CT's of different ratios. Have a look at http://electricalandelectronics.org/2009/03/19/differential-protection-in-transformers/

It also explains how the CT's are connected to balance the difference in phase angles.

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Anonymous Poster
#7
In reply to #6

Re: Transformer internal fault

01/16/2011 10:56 AM

thanks for the link ,it provides quite useful information but doesn't quite answer my question exactly,Experts please help,the answer is not in any textbook!

Regards,

Sohan

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Guru
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#8
In reply to #7

Re: Transformer internal fault

01/16/2011 11:46 AM

It won't be in any text book, you're looking for something that doesn't exist.

A step down transformer with no load connected to the secondary. Based on your 1/1000 ratio.

If there is an internal fault on the primary winding which draws 3A, with no fault on the secondary, where is your 3000A going to go? The 3A will just create heat "inside" the transformer.

The operative words are "internal fault"

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Anonymous Poster
#14
In reply to #8

Re: Transformer internal fault

01/18/2011 9:12 AM

the transformer is loaded,i took 1000/1 ratio to just make my question clear.

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#9

Re: Transformer Internal Fault

01/16/2011 11:19 PM

In case of internal faults , only the source and the winding till the point of fault will drive lrage currents. Suppose if two tranforrmers are in parallel and internal fault occurs in one transformer, the other transformer will start feeding the fault location. But usually, in grids, they have directional overcurrent & earth fault protection for Secondary side back up protection. If lrage currents start feeding into transformer in reverse (through secondary sise), it will trip the faulty transformer alone. So in your case the fault current flows depending upon the fault. If the fault location is exact near to transformer sec ( inside diff. protected area), it will draw large current.

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Anonymous Poster
#10

Re: Transformer Internal Fault

01/16/2011 11:50 PM

Hai,

Iam M.Ayyavaru working with HBL Power systems Ltd Hyd.

What you said is right, if any problem in trmr it trips by over load protector, but there is no rule that secondary current must be as per transformer ratio at the time of fault,fault may happened at any winding.1) If fault accrued in pry winding why secondary current increase in this case no chance to increase secondary current.2) If fault accured in secondary winding according to secondary fault current pry current shoot up.I hope your dought may be cleared.

Regards,

M.Ayyavaru.

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Guru

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#11

Re: Transformer Internal Fault

01/17/2011 10:13 AM

As already said: If the fault is internal like shorted windings, the ratio will change accordingly.

Also, the current is flowing internally and does not come out from the secondary terminals. This is in both cases primary or secondary winding faults.

So, there will allways be an excess unbalanced power into the transformer against the output power from the secondary. The Normal internal losses are known and represent a small percentage of the total power input. These are taken into considerarion.

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Power-User

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#12

Re: Transformer Internal Fault

01/17/2011 2:22 PM

Guest - are you an Indian? . . . using Indian terminology?

And the word "doubt" is not a "doubt" but a "question"??

What is your question??? You have a 1000/1 transformer, . . and you are using it as a "current step up transformer" , . . . applying 3 amperes to the secondary and expecting to receive 3,000 amperes????

You must have rocks in your head! You are most likely overloading and saturating the 1000/1 transformer . . . hence - you will not get any output.

Oleh

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Anonymous Poster
#13
In reply to #12

Re: Transformer Internal Fault

01/18/2011 9:09 AM

Yes,i am an indian and proud to be an indian and we don't need to prove anybody our intellectual level,the world already knows that. I have just passed out of college so i have these doubts and anybody of my level would and regarding 1000/1 transformation ratio i used was just for example ,for making my question clear to understand, if you were not able to understand then you are most welcome to come to india ,we will improve your intellectual level .

by the way thanks everybody ,the doubt has been cleared.

Regards,

Sohan

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Power-User

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#15
In reply to #13

Re: Transformer Internal Fault

01/18/2011 10:21 AM

A proud Indian - very good. India needs proud people. You are miss-reading the words that were written. Having >passed out of college< (another fine Indian expression) makes you very proud and arrogant at the same time.

Let me see, . . my first time to India was in January 1979, . . . you were not born . . . Have been to India at least 50 times since then.

Have been trying to improve the >knowledge and intellectual level< of your relatives . . . but the going is rather slow. Will try some more . . .

Oleh

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Anonymous Poster
#16
In reply to #15

Re: Transformer Internal Fault

01/19/2011 8:47 AM

Check the spelling of "miss-read " in the dictionary ,you english scholar....

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