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Reciprocating Air Compressor with Bull Power

06/22/2011 4:12 AM

Dear CR4,

In line with renewable energy pursuits I, as a consultant have discussed and finalised with the Head Research, of an Agricultural Univ for deploying, oxen as prime mover power to run a huge Reciprocating Farm model Aircompressor.Though slow ,like the good old water wheel, it, in my humble view, can do the job.For eg., 10 to 20 bulls within their caged periferal yokes will rotate a huge steel-laced wooden gear wheel . A crank- wheel can download that rotation(2 rpm??!!) into its own 200 rpm for stroking a single cyliner, crude,reciprocating compressor of james whatt brand .

Can anyone, keeping the 'earth-saving -engineering - spirit' in mind, help to t e c h n i c a l l y review this concept and respond.If it all it is tangible, the funding will be initiated,certainlly.

Please ..therefore be earnest and to the point, while giving the clues.We need to explore the comtemporay practices to evaluate the commercial viabilty of the project.

Now a days, none is cultivating land so much, and we have natural solar energy as green grass,and what we need is a will to develop a simple bull as solar converter, for which someone else other than mechanical engineers, are highly motivated! for e.g., the self sustnable Food Security Armies are looking for options.

A Bull can be made to work for 10 years before eaten up, the food security boys argue.

So much less oil &gas pollution, and a natural environment cum earning for the poor of world !!

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#1

Re: RECIPROCATING AIR COMPRESSOR WITH BULL POWER

06/22/2011 4:45 AM

Hi,

The first question that will be asked is, what is the bore and stroke (displacement) of the compressor and what pressure do you need (hope) to generate? That will give an indication of how many "Bull power" (Horsepower) you need.

Best of luck with your project

John

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#2

Re: Reciprocating Air Compressor with Bull Power

06/22/2011 9:00 AM

What is the target requirement? (Water pump? Machine tools?)

How much (volume @ pressure) compressed air is required over what time period?

Cost to acquire the animals? Cost of food for each bull/oxen per day? What are the veterinary costs per year? Cost of employees to care for the animals (e.g., hitch/unhitch the oxen to the machinery, feed & water them, etc.)?

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#8
In reply to #2

Re: Reciprocating Air Compressor with Bull Power

06/22/2011 6:58 PM

Farm Impliments like pnematic spade .1 HP, small pneumatic tiller 1 HP,pnematic Augur1HP.We may need to OFFSET a demand of say 5 HP to start with

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#10
In reply to #8

Re: Reciprocating Air Compressor with Bull Power

06/22/2011 9:14 PM

Well, this turned out to be an interesting subject. I found a couple of good papers on the two technologies (pnuematic power and animal power).
While looking up a reference for equating horsepower to compressed air volume, I found, "Compressed Air Energy Efficiency" [PDF]. Some relevant quotes:

  • "It takes about 8 hp of electrical energy to produce 1-hp-worth of work with compressed air."
  • "As a good approximation, typical compressor produces:
    4 cubic foot per minute (CFM) per 1 motor hp (horsepower)"
  • "Approximately 90% of the energy to produce and distribute compressed air is lost."

As for oxen, the paper, "Animal-Driven Shaft Power Revisited" :

  • "Oxen can generally generate sustained draft force equal to about 1/8th of their body weight at about 2.0 to 2.9 km/h and about 1/10th at higher speeds of about 4.0 km/h. They can maintain this level of work for about 3 to 6 hours per day in the tropics."
  • "In teaming animals to gain additional force, getting them to pull together introduces inefficiencies of at least 7.5% for two animals, 15% for three, 22% for four, 30% for five and 37% for six."

The study has real-world examples of animal powered equipment, such as a grist mill. The best estimate, using pairs of oxen in four hour shifts is approx 1.0 HP continuous.

Overall, I don't see animal power as a good choice for generating compressed air.

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#13
In reply to #10

Re: Reciprocating Air Compressor with Bull Power

06/22/2011 10:24 PM

So 1 bp (bullpower) ≈ 0.5 hp. Ain't the metric system lovely?

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#20
In reply to #10

Re: Reciprocating Air Compressor with Bull Power

06/25/2011 1:06 AM

Thank you very much sir...Thanks indeed, for your kind guidance.I have forwarded the literature to our small team. Thanks once again.We will meet at CR4 later if need be..

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#3

Re: Reciprocating Air Compressor with Bull Power

06/22/2011 11:04 AM

If the goal is to power other machines with compressed air, I guess it is doable. Doesn't sound very efficient. Using a system of pulleys and belts might be more efficient if the machines are stationary.

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#9
In reply to #3

Re: Reciprocating Air Compressor with Bull Power

06/22/2011 7:01 PM

Farm impliments as stated .

Compressed Air to drive Maximum 5 hp any time

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#4

Re: Reciprocating Air Compressor with Bull Power

06/22/2011 12:04 PM

Let us hope that the SPCA does not hear of your plan.

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#5
In reply to #4

Re: Reciprocating Air Compressor with Bull Power

06/22/2011 12:38 PM

"A Bull can be made to work for 10 years before eaten up, the food security boys argue."

Can you imagine biting into a hunk of 10 year old bull meat?

I think the SPCA does not operate in this country, where ever it may be.

Are you downstream from Minot?

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#6
In reply to #5

Re: Reciprocating Air Compressor with Bull Power

06/22/2011 12:59 PM

The geography of North Dakota is unusual. The Souris river starts in Saskatchewan Canada, meanders south into ND running through Minot, and then turns north again heading into the Assiniboine river in Canada.

We in Fargo (even though we are in the same Red River drainage) are not directly affected by the rising river... however, the citizens of Minot are reeling from this record flood. At this writing, some 12,000 people are being ordered to vacate their homes by noon today, and an anticipated 3,000 or so are to be evacuated by 6:00 tonight.

tcmtech lives in that part of the world... He can give us more (if he doesn't float away!)

A ten year old bull, no big deal. Where do you think a truck stop gets their steaks from?

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#11
In reply to #6

Re: Reciprocating Air Compressor with Bull Power

06/22/2011 9:20 PM

I am personally not flooded out but a large part of the near by towns are now starting to get to that point. The peak is expected to be around 5 - 7 feet above the top of the dike system we have in Minot.

The dike systems where designed to a 11,000 CFS working capacity which was supposedly not likely to be seen more than once every 100 years or so. 1881 was the biggest recorded flood in the area but now 130 years later, go figure, nature is tossing another one at us at 28,000+ CFS.

City wise Minot is screwed. Nature wins once again. Humans: 0, Nature: 1 more.

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#12
In reply to #11

Re: Reciprocating Air Compressor with Bull Power

06/22/2011 9:34 PM

Thanks for the update. Nature will always win.

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#7

Re: Reciprocating Air Compressor with Bull Power

06/22/2011 4:19 PM

I will be be earnest and to the point, the project is not commercially viable.

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#14

Re: Reciprocating Air Compressor with Bull Power

06/23/2011 7:23 AM

Assuming there will be more than 20 bulls total (you'll need reserves) then you might want to look into collecting the waste products and building a simple bio-generator to produce some methane and use it as an energy source as well. Could make the whole thing a bit more productive...but I don't see this as a feasible project from the standpoint of efficiency. Too many losses in the system. Of course if the bulls are the only energy source available, then good luck.

Will the bulls be pushing/pulling a large wheel around in a circle? What will the ground they tread on be like and how much destruction from the bull's constant foot pressure will it sustain over time? Will there be an issue of weather, either hot or rain that might effect production.

(We keep saying bulls but I think we mean oxen...from the animals point of view there is a BIG difference )

Good luck!

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#15
In reply to #14

Re: Reciprocating Air Compressor with Bull Power

06/23/2011 8:54 AM

"We keep saying bulls but I think we mean oxen..."

Good point, and I believe correct.

An ox (or bullock) is sometimes a former bull with a lot of time on his hands.

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#16
In reply to #14

Re: Reciprocating Air Compressor with Bull Power

06/23/2011 9:01 AM

Hi Tom,

Your comment " I don't see this as a feasible project from the standpoint of efficiency. Too many losses in the system. Of course if the bulls are the only energy source available, then good luck."

My thoughts exactly.

John

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#18
In reply to #16

Re: Reciprocating Air Compressor with Bull Power

06/23/2011 9:12 AM

Jesw55 and Tom, I don't think anyone will disagree this will not be very efficient.

But, if you need compressed air and you have no electricity, no fuel to burn to turn a genny, no water stored sufficiently to make hydro power or a trompe... but you have plenty of oxen, what would you suggest?

Not very efficient, but ya gotta do what ya gotta do. I have not seen anyone comment that it would not work, and it sounds like a reasonable use of available resource.

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#19
In reply to #18

Re: Reciprocating Air Compressor with Bull Power

06/23/2011 9:53 AM

Hi Doorman,

I think i speak for both of us, to say "we" agree with your thoughts, if Bull power is all you have, then bull power it has to be.

Not seen any info on the compressor bore and stroke , to get some idea of the potential output at the geared up 2 rpm from the bulls.

Unless it's quite a reasonable displacement this could all be a bit academic.

Best regards,

John

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#17

Re: Reciprocating Air Compressor with Bull Power

06/23/2011 9:05 AM

Why not consider centrifugal compressor? It can be geared for required rpm, and will be smooth.

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#21

Re: Reciprocating Air Compressor with Bull Power

07/06/2011 9:05 PM

If you can get a large pressure storage tank in the range of 300-500 gallons and just let them continuously pump up the pressure in it you would be able to use the tools for short bursts like augering fence post holes, etc.

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#22

Re: Reciprocating Air Compressor with Bull Power

07/07/2011 11:05 AM

It seems the efficiency of the system, muscle power to compressed air to useful mechanical work, is a key factor. A great deal of energy is lost when the compressor heats the air (isentropic compression) and the air is cooled before use. Then the expansion of the air in the tool is limited by exhaust being cold.

Suggestion: don't throw away the heat of compression. Store, transmit, and use the compressed air at its highest temperature and/or find uses for temperature differentials. For example, the hot compressed air could be used for space heating heating (drying sheds?) or cooking or boiling water. Cold expanded air (exhaust from an air motor) could be used for refrigeration. If you spray polluted water into the compressor air intake, the compressor output should be a mixture of compressed air and steam. When the mixture is expanded in the air motor, the steam should condense, reheating the air. Thermodynamically, that should be much more efficient than the 12-15% typically seen. The input is ambient temperature air and water, and the output (if the expansion ratio equals the compression ratio) is ambient temperature air and a cloud of distilled, potable, water droplets. The water can be filtered out, providing clean (sterile) drinking water "for free."

Ref: US Patent No. 5,832,728, which has expired and can be used by anyone.

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#23
In reply to #22

Re: Reciprocating Air Compressor with Bull Power

07/07/2011 11:34 AM

Hi esbuck,

I would have thought if you spray "polluted water" into the inlet of a compressor the pollutants will end up causing no end of problems with the compressor internals.

This seems like one of those ideas that sound too good to be true (and most probably is).

John

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#24
In reply to #23

Re: Reciprocating Air Compressor with Bull Power

07/07/2011 11:54 AM

It's easy to filter the sand out. The problem is biological polution, e-coli, amebas, cholera, etc. which cause disease. At steam temperatures, they are killed.

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#25
In reply to #24

Re: Reciprocating Air Compressor with Bull Power

07/07/2011 12:13 PM

Hi esbuck,

What about the dissolved pollutants that will drop out when the water boils.

I've sold compressors off and on for 40 years and this sounds a "weird and wonderful" way to try and wring as much out of compressing air as possible.

Most of the ways people try to recover energy seem to be, more trouble than their worth, but I suppose as energy gets more and more costly and more and more scarce every avenue will need to be investigated.

John

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#26
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Re: Reciprocating Air Compressor with Bull Power

07/07/2011 12:37 PM

Sometimes what is obvious or common sense isn't. Back in 1930, Germans did some experiments with railroad locomotives. All were powered by the same diesel engine (ex-submarine engine). They used a mechanical transmission, not good. They used a hydraulic transmission, also not satisfactory. They used a diesel-electric drive, with a generator and electric motors to drive the wheels. That was pretty good. Then they tried a diesel-pneumatic locomotive. The diesel engine drove a two cylinder compressor which fed to a conventional steam engine chassis. The D-P loco was superior, faster and more fuel efficient than the D-E loco. It appears that the secret -- they tried to keep it a trade secret -- was that they injected water into the compressor and drove the steam engine on a mixture of air and steam. They also, they implied, used heat from the diesel exhaust to heat the air.

Germany had no oil, so the railroads stayed with steam. When, in the US, General Electric, in the business of making electric generators and motors, started making locomotives, they probably never considered using air.

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129CBRider (1); Ace Boeringa (1); balakrishnan Pullat (3); Doorman (4); esbuck (3); jesw55 (5); lyn (3); pantaz (2); pritam (1); tcmtech (1); Tom_Consulting (1); Tornado (1)

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