The Physics of Water on Mars

This article may shed some light....

http://witcombe.sbc.edu/water/physicsuniverse.html

Recommended reading:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mars

Water is a very unique molecule. Because of hydrogen bonding water does not have the anticipated phase diagram of a light molecule. A very good in depth analysis of the many phases and triple points of water can be found here.

The phase diagram form there is:

This is not as blurry at the original site. There one can clearly see that a narrow temperature range of 100mbar to about 5mbar will contain liquid water. Now on Mars I would expect freezing to ice Ih will always happen over night. This will reduce losing water to space due to the low vapor pressure of a solid.

Well I understand the reasoning of a lack of liquid water due to Mars' current state. But the comment states that due to the planet's size, it could never have had sufficient atmosphere to have liquid water. I'm of the opinion that it lost most of its atmosphere due to any one of a number of theories. But to say that it's too small to ever have had enough atmosphere... that's where I'm lost.

And I'm prone to trust the astrophysicists at NASA, more than some blogger online that calls the NASA scientists idiots. I just don't follow his reasoning, to make such a bold statement.

Where's our resident CR4 astrophysicist? Jorrie?

GA by the way.

From my observation of NASA, they have been trying to justify a manned trip to mars for years. The meteor found in the arctic, I doubt that it came from mars. This water theory, another ploy, they did that with the moon too. I'm all for non manned remote robotics, like they're doing now.

What I would really like to see, is 100 Hubble type (greatly simplified) telescopes in orbit. Start with 10 and iterate to a low cost "high volume" design.

Hmm. Well, simply put, I don't agree with any of your thoughts on this. I could go in to detail on all your points, but I'll just say it this way.

I'm of the belief that humanity on the surface of Mars is our destiny. We've got some true visionaries working on it. Godspeed!

to put it bluntly, why should i or any other tax payer give a sh#t whether mars has or ever had water or living organisms?

what's the benifit? should'nt we be investing the billions spent on something benifical to mankind? deep sea exploration in particular. the information we garner from the sea may be our only hope of survial on THIS PLANET.

Please, let's not talk about "taxpayers" on CR4. There are other forums that love that stuff.

citizens?

There's water on Mars because the ice caps are melting from global warming. Obviously, we caused it, just like we did here.

What? Global warming on Mars is caused by solar activity?

http://news.nationalgeographic.com/news/2007/02/070228-mars-warming.html

Why are we pouring trillions of dollar down a global warming rathole if the sun is at fault? Obviously, that researcher doesn't understand the politically correct view that we are at fault. No more grant monies for him!

You are delusional.

And, after considerable thought, I think you are also psychotic.

Well now, don't be so harsh. The scientist wouldn't respond to his accusation. I'd say that pretty much proves it

Forrest Gump's "Stuupid is as ................." applies here.

If you remove the OT, he will just be psychic.

HA! Well that was the perfect storm! errmm.. I mean.. tornado.

GA just for clever and lucky.

yep, delustional.

The history of Mars' atmosphere is both complex and quite incomplete. Mars evidently had considerable surface water at various times and a much higher - and wildly varying - atmospheric pressure at various times in its early history. However, once Mars lost its magnetic field, it lost its protection from the solar wind which has since stripped Mars of much of its atmosphere. Mars still has considerable water, much of it locked up in hydrates and other compounds and in the permanent polar ice caps. These are mostly water ice which, if melted, would cover Mars to average estimated depth of about 3 metres. There is also much evidence for subsurface liquid brine deposits which can be seen in and around the sunlit slopes of craters during the Martian summer.

Why would a planet lose its magnetic field?

Cooling. Mars had a molten iron core at one point. Differential rotation produced the magnetic field but, once the core had cooled enough to solidify, the field disappeared, Mars lost its magnetosphere and the rest is history.

Yes ice will sublimate under the right conditions here on Earth. Out on other planets/ moons and space in general, that appears to be a different story. The moon Europa has a ice crust with possible water underneath it. Comets are referred to as dirty ice/ snow balls. These objects have been around for billions of years, yet they still have water/ice/snow, etc. The Martian polar caps are a mixture of water ice and frozen CO2.

The above information is a result of research and space probes. As for their luxury lifestyles. That may be hold true for a senior tenured professor, but most scientist's (graduates, masters, PH D's and post Doc's) that I know spend most of their time looking for funding and live a lot worse than you think.

We need to do research in all fields, other wise we would just be banging rocks together, living in cold dark caves. OK more likely a basic agrarian society.

The Martian polar ice caps contain huge amounts of water ice. It is estimated that the volume of water locked up in the Martian polar ice could cover the entire planet to an average depth of over 3 metres.

During the Martian winter (like Earth, Mars has seasons, and for the same reason: Mars' spin axis is tilted at 25.19 deg. [Earth: 23.44 deg], the surface temperature drops to the point where carbon dioxide condenses directly out of the atmosphere onto the polar (water) ice.

Come spring, when temps start back up, the frozen CO2 undergoes rapid sublimation which results in strong carbon dioxide winds blowing outward from the ice cap. These winds often reach speeds in excess of 400 km/h and can kick up huge dust storms which are seen to engulf the entire planet at times, sometimes for days.

The mean temperature on Mars is -63C. It can sometimes melt, briefly, but it will always freeze soon after. We may even have detected that occurring:
In addition, the pressure is so low that when it does get warm enough to melt, much of it will turn into gas rather than liquid. On earth, there is considerable air pressure helping water remain liquid. In the near-vacuum of the Martian atmosphere, the range of liquid water is even narrower. And once in gas form, some of it leaks off into space before it freezes, further reducing the amount of water available on the surface.