"Parking" Position in Car's Gear Control Function?

Mechanically connected?? Via the torque converter ??

Yes, I thought about that, too. In addition to the fact the gears are always engaged in an automatic trans. like tcmtech said.

Once again, in an effort to keep the explanation simple for a non-driver who may have never driven a car in his life, I was just trying to keep it simple.

"In both positions Park and Neutral car is not in Gear; in Neutral it needs hadbrakes applied while in Park position it is a fool-proof to park with brakes also applied in this postion."

I am supposing the semantics of whether the Park position of the gear selector is a gear or not may be debated, but I think you are correct; in an automobile automatic transmission, neither Neutral nor Park are gears.

[edit] "It is not "in gear" when in park or neutral." Well stated, from #1 ↑

Thanks !

Regards:

< the pawl would shear and the car would roll free. >

May I take it as not in gear?

The same thing will happen if Handbrake was applied while car was in Nuetral in old cars.

And if as some people consider to keep the car in gear while parking and brake engaged the car will drag in gear.

I am going to disagree and not just because I can.

Technically the gear sets in a automatic transmission are permanently in gear so to speak being that they can never be disengaged from one another like a manual transmission can by sliding any gear set into middle position where no driving or driven gear sets are in direct mesh with each other.

In an automatic transmission there are only a series of clutch packs and bands that determine what gearing ratio is being used which when in neutral or park all the clutch packs and bands are at a relaxed position where they do not transfer torque from the input shaft to any other shaft or combinations of gear sets that will ultimately turn the output shaft.

Oh ya? well....

(My wife calls me worse.)

Drat. I got deleted.

Oh well, I half expected it.

Hi Lyn

I would have to agree with you (not in gear)

But definition of in gear could be interped different, yes the sun gears are meshed but clutch packs are not energised in MOST cases (selectamatics work in reverse oil pressure unapplies clutches) there for no drive no connection is it in gear? From the free dictionary in gear means working well is it working well with no motion?

Good answer.....eccept: Only in old "crash boxes" are the gears slided onto each other.

Newer stick-shift boxes has all the gears, running on a bush on the shaft, in constant mesh with each other, accept the revers gear, on some. When a gear is selected, the sinchromesh unit couples the gear to the shaft.

{while we are splitting hairs}

Regards.

< ... or park all the clutch packs and bands are at a relaxed position ... >

Isn't In-gear and Netral concerned with "Clutch" ?[[any new term for its function i.e. engage or disengage the Driving-output from Driven-Input]]?

< set into middle position where no driving or driven gear sets are in direct mesh with each other. >

Clutch's function is to connect two shafts in such a way that move together i.e. ENGAGE [In direct mesh]

Or

release their connection NEUTRAL [middle position]

Say one way or other if the holding pinion is sheared [see another post] will the car be dragged in-gear or out-of-gear?

As if in old cars parked with hand-brakes if parked in-gear or neutral and brakes are sheared:

if in neutral car will run free and

if in-gear ...

As you can see this answer is not so much about the engineering but the semantics.

The answer is one you will not like.

The gearbox is in gear but the wheels will turn freely. In your example with a manual gearbox the wheels would drag. So you can tow an automatic gearbox fitted car in any "gear" except park. The reason is that the 'clutch' is like a water wheel and can be turned in its' housing allowing the wheels to turn. DON'T DO THIS, HOWEVER. see owners manual.

Most automatics are restricted in the distance they may be towed. Check in the car's handbook for the finer details as you said.

I don't know exactly what the problem is, but I expect it to be something to do with either your "waterwheel" or maybe some pump that cannot be turned.

I looked around for reasons on the web, but really only found things that said "DON'T"....

Like here:-

http://uk.answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20071025114125AA9Cb2D

or here:-

http://answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20080926142634AA6YvQr

Bob, many thanks for the explanation, I always wondered why it was so.....

Thanks Bob. I too wondered about towing (or inadvisability of towing) an auto with an automatic transmission. Makes perfect sense with your explanation. GA vote for that, seems to be a very good point in this thread.

From memory (what's that) I seem to recall that 25 to 30 was the minimum speed to push start them. A trick was to push them in neutral and then quickly pull it into the lowest "gear"

So... Sounds to me like neutral is not considered a 'gear'.

Regards.

No. It is OK for me.

I like only to know some details whether according to my view or otherwise.

As it is a technical question and the technology of all manufactures of automobiles may not be same and the drivers also have not deep know-how so a vast variety of replies are expected.

I being basically a technical so on every reply a different question arises to make point clear.

I thank to all whose reply is on-topic and enjoy off-topic replies too!

Nobody has really fully defined exactly what is meant by "in gear" here to my mind, argue if you will.

I personally define it as "gears are meshed", but equally it could be defined as to "whether the motor can drive the wheels or not"......

Certainly, as anyone who drives knows, there is a MAJOR difference between the park and neutral position......Park locks the driven wheels, neutral does not......So I define park as "meshed"......(I am sure that the wheels are locked in several different ways depending upon the manufacturer of transmission.)

Years ago I had a Mitsubishi Galant with a manual 5 gear gearbox AND a park position. It was needed because the clutch, although foot operated, was internally similar to an automatic gearbox and would not hold the car on an incline in gear as there was no fully mechanical link between engine and driven wheels. It was a sealed hydraulic unit, so I have no exact details on how it worked...

As an aside:- Many years ago, a friend of mine bought a clutchless (Manumatic) Hillman Minx, it actually had a clutch, but operated by pushing or pulling on the gearstick using a vacuum as power obtained from the engine....he was being "Flash" and accelerated hard as he drove by in 3nd gear, and accidentally put it into reverse instead of 3rd!!!

The car ground to a shuddering halt and then reversed!!! The reason being this was before seat belts and he could not get his foot off the gas pedal!!! He had "mashed" the gas pedal!!!!!

It is mentioned here how the gearbox worked:-

Hillman Series Minx

Luckily nobody was following him.

I laughed so much that I almost fell down, I could not stop........

I would have marked this post as 50% off topic, but that is simply not possible.....sorry!

Thanks to all adding technical details to understand better the cars we are driving today which may not individually be available even through web.

My thanks does not in the meaning of general English norm "No Thanks".

I think everybody will welcome more posts, no matter what a little information is added.

Regards