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Parking Lots

05/15/2013 11:20 PM

Working with underground parking, I started to think of other parking situations. For example: Some electrical system to show a parking lot lay out and where one might find a parking space. Another one: What are the odds of finding a space in a large parking lot. A lot of time can be wasted looking for a space and then giving up and going to another lot. After all, one sees signs showing how fast one is going, and there is always the stop lights.

Sure, this is not easy. I equals E/R. All kinds of circuits. Parallel, etc. I got a C in an electrical engineering course a long time ago. Now I am into reading books by James Fenimore Cooper or Sir Walter Scott. They are old books and are falling apart. There is always a summary by going to Google after I give a good try to read my ancient books.

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#1

Re: heidi

05/15/2013 11:35 PM

这里是智能停车场系统由一些工程专业的学生
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_EGuFhqmSIs

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#2

Re: heidi

05/15/2013 11:37 PM

Count your parking spaces available. Count how many cars enter and leave the parking lot. Put a sign out that parking is or is not availble according to the counter!

or

design so many car spaces that its never going to be full ergo there will always be space to park in.

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#3

Re: heidi

05/16/2013 12:07 AM

These systems exist, and are very expensive to install in existing structures.

Mostly, they aren't worth it.

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#4

Re: heidi

05/16/2013 12:18 AM

If the signs say there is more than one space left, most of the people will drive around looking for the one closest to the entrance.

The other drivers will be looking for double spots, far away from the entrance, so they can straddle the line to get big clearance on both sides of their car.

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#5

Re: Parking Lots

05/16/2013 10:48 AM

Chicago has electric signs on the interstate telling how many parking spaces are empty.

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#6
In reply to #5

Re: Parking Lots

05/16/2013 3:35 PM

Same here in New Zealand. It is dead easy now-days with electronic ticketing which means electronic counting of total spaces available - cars entering + cars leaving = free spaces.

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#7

Re: Parking Lots

05/16/2013 6:28 PM

Can not complain about this information. I will have to read all of this quite a few times. Thanks

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#8

Re: Parking Lots

05/17/2013 1:43 AM

Bank teller queue systems, that do not issue a number often printed on a small sheet of paper, typically have an arrow/teller number display at the start of the queue with guidance on where to go for service.

Same thing could apply to parking lots, but maybe with software that promotes the 'more empty areas of the lot according to an appropriate algorithm' so you don't get disappointed if you are beaten to the 'one vacant lot'. Similarly, if travelling to the 'best chance' area, and you see an immediate opportunity to park, then park there. The display and algorithm still works.

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#9

Re: Parking Lots

05/17/2013 5:17 AM

In Germany you can find a perfect solution in many car parks: Empty lots are detected using overhead ultrasonic sensors. in the sensor housing there are also inserted dual color LEDs. Red for taken slot, green for free slot. Furthermore there is a trafic light type guidance system to direct you to the empty lot near you also showing the number of empty lots in this row... The LEDs are clearly visible when you enter the the row of parking lots. And for me it works fine nearly every time.

Why only nearly? There are these fat, excessive mass SUVs with definitely inconsiderate drivers which will need at least 30% of the parking lot next to their car. And the detector does not recognize this so you are guided to an unusable space. An optimization of the system would be possible by detecting this fact and charge the owner for "double space occupancy" twice the price. Might be this could help that this a-social habit vanishs. But it would really thinking how to implement.

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#10
In reply to #9

Re: Parking Lots

05/17/2013 6:17 AM

Weighing the vehicles on entry would be a good start, particularly if there was a barrier entry to collect a parking entry ticket with time etc. (Lots of 'entry's there ... sorry about that).

If automatic supermarkets can link the weight and barcode/product ID and then compare with what is then transferred to the dispatch area, then paying for vehicle parking by time and weight, (and height if so equipped at the entry point so setting the payment rate), should be a breeze. And then maybe there would be less SUV's crowding out the bays.

With the above, you could take satisfaction that your classic VW Kombi bus fitted with helium balloons is going to give you cheap parking, particularly if you have the sunroof variety and lots of windows to confuse the snooping electronics.

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#17
In reply to #9

Re: Parking Lots

05/17/2013 8:00 PM

The parking garage at Baltimore-Washington airport (BWI) has this exact system. They call it "Smart Park".

http://www.bwiairport.com/en/parking/information-rates/hourly-garage

When you pick up your ticket at the entrance, an electronic sign tells you how many open spaces are on each level. When you get to your desired level, each row has a numeric LED indicating how many free spaces are in the row, and when you look down the row, you look for a green LED to show you the open spaces. Occupied spaces are indicated with a red LED. It is very efficient, it helps prevent a lot of driving around looking for space and reduces traffic to the bare minimum.

All larger parking garages should have some variation of this navigation system.

In the immortal words of Tony the Tiger, "It's G - r - r - r - e - a - t !!"

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#11

Re: Parking Lots

05/17/2013 7:51 AM

It seems to me you could have an array of normally closed sensors, each sensor located in the center of each parking spot in a row. An empty spot would open a series circuit indicating an empty spot. It sounds like a good idea.

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#12

Re: Parking Lots

05/17/2013 8:35 AM

Actually it is all very easy....when you drive into the parking lot, onto the big pallet in the loading dock. Get out of your car, and insert your debit card into the appropriate slot to pay for your spot, and get the token. The lot takes over from there. The loading dock is a pallet which is then automatically shunts the pallet with your car on it to shelving built for the purpose. No walking through scary dark parking lots, no smelly pools of "whateva", no muggers lurking around the corner, no urine filled elevators...its the way of the future. Just go back to the well lit loading dock, insert your token, and your car is delivered right to your hand.

This allows for high density packing of motor cars for as long as you want to store them...ten minutes to ten years. This technology exists and is very common for warehousing applications. I presume it is used for automobiles too but I can't be bothered to google to find out if it is actually being used the way I described. If it isn't, it should be.

A lot more expensive and complex things are stored in warehouses in just such a fashion. Why not cars? Its not even a high tech solution.

Or did you have something else in mind?

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#15
In reply to #12

Re: Parking Lots

05/17/2013 2:24 PM

Replying to Comment by Yusef1:

"when you drive into the parking lot, onto the big pallet in the loading dock. Get out of your car, and insert your debit card into the appropriate slot to pay for your spot, and get the token. The lot takes over from there"

But all the ideas cost too much. Suppose the driver is ASSIGNED a parking space upon entering the facility. Their ticket/stub even is printed with the space id and that is the only place they are allowed to park. A computer should be able to track inventory of "unsold" spaces and be able to make the assignments.

No wiring, no detectors, and the added benefit to some parking lot operators of being able to charge fees to those who are not parked in the assigned spaces. Yeah, I know, it goes against our god-given right to park wherever we damn please.

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#20
In reply to #15

Re: Parking Lots

05/18/2013 8:46 AM

Well, I guess it depends on how important it is to be within a few hundred meters of your car all day. And the cost of the land, the cost of the multi story car park. And the availability and attractiveness of public transit, and a few dozen other factors.

If for instance, I owned, say three multi story car parks in down town Manhattan (or for that matter, Schenectady) , I would try to see what I could do to turn some of that space into condo's, yet still service the demand for parking. Parking would still be the cash cow that it is now, of course. The warehouse solution would pay real benefits, and would be a viable business model.

I had not heard they had done that in Munich....well there you go! I KNEW I never had an original idea! Something so obvious MUST have been done somewhere! Thanks Uli!

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#16
In reply to #12

Re: Parking Lots

05/17/2013 5:49 PM

Hello This good idea is already realized in Munich. This carpark was build in a quarter of the city where due to older buildings car park was not available so the community build the car park below an existing road to rent out spaces to the residents in this area. There are around 250 parking "lots" in this facility. It operates according a "chaotic warehouse". The user parks his car on a platform and the system parks it somewhere in the subterrain multistorey parking area.

The car park access are 4 small garage type little buildings. The user drives the car on a pallet and inserts a smart card giving his ID and the system will write to the smart card the ID of the storage pallet then the car will decend into the storage "cave".

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#13

Re: Parking Lots

05/17/2013 8:42 AM

Indicating the number of spaces available is useful. Such systems are common in UK and in some cases are linked to displays on roads feeding traffic into the town showing which car parks have spaces and how many. The UK systems are usually operated using ticket counting as described above.

They do not help in locating the individual spaces within a car park. To do that you need a sensor for each parking slot and to connect the sensors to a CPU. There are many types of sensors available, ground loops, pressure pads, photocell, capacitative, camera. Each has its own advantages and disadvantages. Cameras provide an additional deterrent against theft of or from the parked cars, but are the most expensive. Pressure pads are cheap but subject to damage. Photocells need regular cleaning and ground loops are expensive to power up.

The cost of wiring all the sensors back to a central point could be reduced by a relatively new piece of technology. Energy harvesting sensors (see www.enocean.com) that use the pressure or motion of the vehicle to generate local power, fitted with a radio link to a local display at the end on each isle showing which spaces in that isle are vacant. This panel linked to one at the entrance to each floor showing which isles have vacancies, and these panels linked to the car park entrance showing the total number of free spaces. Given that such an expensive system would be recovered from the car park useres, would you be prepared to pay higher parking charges for saving a few minutes looking for a free space?

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#14

Re: Parking Lots

05/17/2013 11:43 AM

It's really very simple. I'm sure others have thought of it. A sensor counts the number of cars that enter the lot and counts the number of cars leaving the lot. The entrance is controlled by a gate. If the computer indicates the lot is full, the entrance gate will not open until a car exits the lot.

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#18

Re: Parking Lots

05/17/2013 8:27 PM

Of course as we head to 9 Billion residents on this finite resource, personalised valet parking with a manual car wash and even a vehicle service could be value added services without the grief of interfacing with a gate at the entrance, (plus the urine smelling lift) and a seemingly mindless sign. Yes, the automated cave parking solution is also noted.

And in the spirit of past contributors, forget going somewhere with the parking issues and catch the internet ... or a bus, train, even high speed rail, door to door.

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#19

Re: Parking Lots

05/18/2013 12:54 AM

I can see that there a devil of a lot of good answers. Is it possible to ever combine all these good answers into a standard? Of course I might as well say the impossible. I guess one would have to choose and pick what ever one appeals to him. Perhaps there should some type of encyclopedia to list all of these methods. But how would one arrange them in some kind of system? I certainly don't know.

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#21

Re: Parking Lots

05/19/2013 7:21 PM

Nothing new unfortunately - In Sydney Australia almost all shopping centre parking lots have this technology. I sensor above or below the parking spot to tell the controller circuit if the spot is available. There is bicolour LED above/below the car space...green for available and red for unavailable. This can be seen from a distance in directions.

For multi-storey carpaking lots, we have LED signs to tell you how many spots are available (in real time) on each level as you ascend/descend. On multiple entry carparks, they even indicate how many are available in that section before you even enter.

The disabled parking lots are indicated by blue LED.

While all this sounds great (and it somewhat is), but on popular shopping days/nights (Christmas, Easter, public holidays) - you find that there are 100+ cars all fighting for that one available spot and everyone knows where it is! I do prefer sometimes to just drive around and 'get-lucky' - or stalk those walking towards their car.

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#22

Re: Parking Lots

05/25/2013 11:49 AM

like this

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