Previous in Forum: Perkins Generator 220HE   Next in Forum: Interposing Current Transformer
Close
Close
Close
8 comments
Rating: Comments: Nested
Active Contributor

Join Date: Jul 2013
Posts: 13

Power System Stability

09/09/2013 4:20 AM

Assume a synchronous generator is feeding a synchronous motor through a transmission line Xl. The power transfer from generator to motor depends on the angular separation of the rotors of the two machines.This angular separation depends on three components. One of the components is the angular differences between terminals of stator and motor which says angle of the stator field of the generator leads that of the motor. How is that possible? The angle of the rotor of the generator leads the stator field of the generator and the angle of the rotor of the motor lags the stator revolving field of the motor. Then how does the angle of the stator field of generator leads the stator field of motor?

Register to Reply
Interested in this topic? By joining CR4 you can "subscribe" to
this discussion and receive notification when new comments are added.

Good Answers:

These comments received enough positive votes to make them "good answers".
Guru
Technical Fields - Technical Writing - New Member Engineering Fields - Piping Design Engineering - New Member

Join Date: May 2009
Location: Richland, WA, USA
Posts: 21017
Good Answers: 795
#1

Re: Power system stability

09/09/2013 4:53 AM

"The angle of the rotor of the generator leads the stator field of the generator"

Are you sure?

__________________
In vino veritas; in cervisia carmen; in aqua E. coli.
Register to Reply Off Topic (Score 5)
Guru
Engineering Fields - Electrical Engineering - Been there, done that. Engineering Fields - Control Engineering - New Member

Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: Long Island NY
Posts: 15600
Good Answers: 981
#2

Re: Power system stability

09/09/2013 7:30 AM

I recommend that you review the Steinmetz equivalent circuit for induction motors. This principle still leads to new research.

__________________
"Don't disturb my circles." translation of Archimedes last words
Register to Reply
Guru
Engineering Fields - Power Engineering - New Member

Join Date: May 2007
Location: NYC metropolitan area.
Posts: 3230
Good Answers: 444
#3

Re: Power System Stability

09/09/2013 9:30 AM

There's nothing wrong with your homework statement, it describes how power is transferred from a synchronous generator to a synchronous motor. There are two things missing though, an understanding of the sign convention regarding power entering and leaving a generator buss, and whether your motor is over or under excited.

It's time for you to review your "Basic Electric Machines"course notes, concentrating on the Power Angle topic, where you will find the basic power flow equations.

Hint: Real power always flows from the machine with the higher power angle to the one(s) with the lower angle(s), Reactive power always flows from the machine with the higher terminal voltage to the machine(s) with the lower terminal voltage(s).

__________________
“Tell me and I forget. Teach me and I remember. Involve me and I learn.” Ben Franklin.
Register to Reply
2
Guru

Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: About 4000 miles from the center of the earth (+/-100 mi)
Posts: 9910
Good Answers: 1141
#4

Re: Power System Stability

09/10/2013 7:32 AM

I think of it as the generator rotor field pulling the generator stator field around. Likewise the motor stator field pulls the motor rotor field around. If you have two magnets side by side and you twist one a small angle, there is a torque imparted to the other that depends on the angle.

Register to Reply Good Answer (Score 2)
Active Contributor

Join Date: Aug 2013
Posts: 12
#5

Re: Power System Stability

09/10/2013 12:36 PM

akp: Check out the book by Edward Huges entitled "Electrical Technology", fourth edition, chapter 17, " Characteristics of Synchronous Generators and Motors". The rotor magnetic field and the stator rotating magnetic field interact in such a way so as to cause the rotor to lock to the rotating magnetic field of the stator (synchronous speed) and run in synchronous speed, when the machine has reached nearly full speed.

Register to Reply
Commentator
United States - US - Statue of Liberty - How's it going?

Join Date: Oct 2012
Location: USA
Posts: 95
Good Answers: 4
#6
In reply to #5

Re: Power System Stability

09/11/2013 4:15 PM

triniboy, I agree with all of your statements except "run in synchronous speed, ... nearly full speed" Synchronous motors ARE "locked in" at full speed which is the same as synchronous speed. If there is any slip (after the start cycle) the circuit protection device usually/should trip. By the way, that is a very good reference book. I don't intend to nitpick but it may be slightly confusing for some.

__________________
If you can't explain it simply, you don't understand it well enough. AE
Register to Reply
Guru
Engineering Fields - Electrical Engineering - Been there, done that. Engineering Fields - Control Engineering - New Member

Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: Long Island NY
Posts: 15600
Good Answers: 981
#7
In reply to #6

Re: Power System Stability

09/11/2013 6:50 PM

No. (I wish CR4 had a face palm smiley.)

Here is the torque curve for various induction motors.

This came from this site. You should notice that if there is no slip between rotor and and stator then there is no torque produced, at all. The rotor bearings alone produce some drag that must be overcome so torque must be produced. Now depending on the drag of the load the motor is driving the slip will be even more.

__________________
"Don't disturb my circles." translation of Archimedes last words
Register to Reply Score 1 for Off Topic
Guru

Join Date: Oct 2012
Location: 100 miles North from the World Center
Posts: 879
Good Answers: 42
#8

Re: Power System Stability

09/15/2013 9:00 AM

I agree with Rixter. I think since the stator current in generator armature it is the induced current in turn its magnetic field, with the rotor magnetic field, will produce a "reaction "torque which opposes to the rotor effort to go forward. How big is the current so big is the stator magnetic field lag. In the synchronous motor the stator current is the leader and pull the rotor on and so how big will be the rotor load so big is the rotor lag.

__________________
Julius
Register to Reply
Register to Reply 8 comments

Good Answers:

These comments received enough positive votes to make them "good answers".
Copy to Clipboard

Users who posted comments:

7anoter4 (1); nvirciglio (1); RAMConsult (1); redfred (2); Rixter (1); Tornado (1); triniboy (1)

Previous in Forum: Perkins Generator 220HE   Next in Forum: Interposing Current Transformer

Advertisement