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Power Saved by VFD

01/14/2015 12:12 AM

Hi,

Can any body prove theoretically that VFD saves power over traditional star delta starters.

I have arrived at the relation Power is proportional to frequency

using the relation P=VI & V=IZ (Where Z= Impedance = r*∏*F*L)

So P = (I2 r*∏*L) * F

If we assume Voltage V, Current I, resistance r & Inductance L as constant, & increase the frequency F we increase the Power P & so the synchronous speed of the motor & vis versa.

So how the power saving happens?

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#1

Re: Power saved by VFD

01/14/2015 12:16 AM

Lower speed uses less power.

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#2

Re: Power saved by VFD

01/14/2015 12:27 AM

If you are using the VFD for starting only then the star-delta wastes less power, unless your VFD has a bypass. Seems odd to be concerned with power savings during the starting phase. If you are concerned with power savings during normal operation, then the savings depend on the load characteristics of the driven machine.

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#3

Re: Power saved by VFD

01/14/2015 1:55 AM

Yes. You can. Look at the relationship between torque and angular velocity of the driven load, graph it across the speed range, and apply the principle of Conservation of Energy.

Alternatively, you could bung a wattmeter on the input wires to the vfd.

The choice is yours, really.

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#4

Re: Power saved by VFD

01/14/2015 2:45 AM

Unplug it.

That saves 100%.

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#5

Re: Power saved by VFD

01/14/2015 3:17 AM

The VFD is driving a 50 HP Blower motor of a Paint Booth wherein we need to maintain the air circulation velocity in the booth. If we reduce the speed we loose the specified air circulation velocity inside the booth,

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#7
In reply to #5

Re: Power saved by VFD

01/14/2015 3:42 AM

You should have mentioned that in the first place. A VFD is not particularly well suited to that situation.

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#12
In reply to #5

Re: Power saved by VFD

01/14/2015 8:35 AM

Since the motor is only 50HP and is required to operate at 100% speed, the energy cost savings may not warrant the expense of purchasing a VFD.

The only savings most likely to be realized would be on the utility demand charges if any apply.

Also: Because it is a fan application, very little mechanical wear would be eliminated by using a VFD.

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#6

Re: Power saved by VFD

01/14/2015 3:28 AM

Dear Mr. GirishaCN,

The VFD application/Energy saving is very much predominant and useful where the SPEED VARIATION application is to be adopted. For example - the Centrifugal Pumps, ID Fans, FD Fans and Secondary Air Fans etc. The reasons have been discussed several times in this forum. The reasons are:

1. The Capacity is proportional to Speed "N"

2. The Head (or Pressure) is proportinal to the Squqre of Speed i.e. N^2

3. The Power is proportional to the Cube of Speed i.e. N^3

It can be seen if the speed is doubled, the Head or Pressue will increase 4 times and the Power will increase by 8 times.

For constant speed application, the VFD installation is waste and NOT advisabe for 2 reasons.

1. It is very costly.

2. VFD has a poor starting Torque.

DHAYANANDHAN.S

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#8
In reply to #6

Re: Power saved by VFD

01/14/2015 3:48 AM

Dear sir,

Thank you.

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#9
In reply to #6

Re: Power saved by VFD

01/14/2015 5:16 AM

In centrifugal pumps running at constant speed can't we use VFD although sometimes load varies/fluctuates,will there be energy savings?.

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#10
In reply to #9

Re: Power saved by VFD

01/14/2015 5:33 AM

The terms "constant speed" and "VFD" don't really belong in the same sentence.

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#11

Re: Power Saved by VFD

01/14/2015 8:01 AM

It could be that a VFD was chosen to maintain a constant air flow thru out the life of the filters. It could also provide and alarm for filter change.

Varying the speed of the motor to maintain a set air flow would save energy.

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#13
In reply to #11

Re: Power Saved by VFD

01/14/2015 9:12 AM

To maintain a constant flow of air,do they employ a flowmeter with contacts for sending signals.

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#16
In reply to #13

Re: Power Saved by VFD

01/15/2015 8:36 AM

If current is proportional to load/flow in a centrifugal pump/fan can we do speed control by measuring current although current can increase due to mechanical problems too?.

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#14

Re: Power Saved by VFD

01/14/2015 9:39 PM

Energy savings from using VFDs is one of the most misunderstood, and MISUSED, concepts in our industry.

Plain and simple: you can only save ENERGY using a VFD when it can displace other losses in a system.

The only time that might happen is in CENTRIFUGAL machines, like pumps and fans (and only the CENTRIFUGAL versions of those). Then in that subset, it is also absolutely conditional on the fact that, for whatever reason, it is necessary to VARY the flow through the pump or fan. Not change the flow permanently, but vary the flow on a relatively constant basis. There is a difference. If I want to permanently change the flow of a pump, I trim the impellers. On a fan, I change the pitch of the blades.

But if my process requires that I vary the flow in that system, then I must by definition have a means to accomplish that and I must size the motor for providing the MAXIMUM flow rate. Then in a pump system I can add a valve, in a air handling fan system I can add dampers to reduce flow. In both of those cases, the energy required from the motor by the machine (pump or fan) will vary proportionally to the change in the flow rate, even with the valve or dampers. But there are also losses associated with those methods; turbulence, friction, etc.

If instead of those restrictive devices, I change the SPEED of the motor, i.e. with a VFD, then I can take advantage of a law of physics, one of the so called "Affinity Laws", which states that;

In a centrifugal machine, the power REQUIRED by the machine (from the motor), varies at the CUBE of the change in speed of the motor.

So if I reduce the flow by reducing the speed to 50% of full speed, I reduce the ENERGY REQUIRED by the pump or fan by .503, to 12.5%!

Now mind you, a 50% reduction in speed does not directly relate to a 50% reduction in flow, because there are other complexities involved, such as head pressure in pumps and static pressure in air handles. But still, the savings are dramatic when the flow profile spends most of it's time in the 30-90% speed range. Below 30% speed and most centrifugal machines stop working, they don't overcome those complexities mentioned earlier. Above 90% speed and the losses inherent in the VFD start to catch up to the savings, and at 100% speed, the VFD will actually ADD about 3% losses to the system. So you never want to have a VFD running at full speed most or all of the time if you are interested in saving energy. That is also why, if you are not going to VARY the speed, then don't use a VFD, or for that matter, a valve or damper either. Just alter the machine to give you what you want at peak efficiency of the motor.

By the way, changing the speed of a non-centrifugal machine, (not a pump or fan), does not actually save ENERGY. it might save POWER, but power is not energy, it is a COMPONENT of energy. Energy is power consumed over time to produce work. If I slow down a conveyor with a VFD, the motor uses less POWER, but it also MOVES LESS MATERIAL, which means it does less work. So for the same given amount of material to be moved, I may use less power, but the work will take LONGER to accomplish, thus consuming the same ENERGY.

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#15
In reply to #14

Re: Power Saved by VFD

01/14/2015 11:07 PM

Very well put as always Jeff.

There is no doubt that there are many misconceptions in the real world, and many overzealous sales people who believe that a VFD will reduce the power consumed by any motor on any application. "You can prove it by measuring the current into the VFD".

The reality is that you can only reduce power that is being wasted, and the VFD typically adds around 3% additional power losses, so it increases the losses by 3% of rated load.

If you consider modern motors with efficiencies up around 91% to 95%, then the losses in the motor are in the order of 5% - 9% and you add another 3% which is significant in the arena where "you will save power on every motor".

If, and only if, the driven load is operating with a significant loss for part of its operating cycle which can be reduced by slowing the motor without affecting the work done, you can save energy. For constant speed applications, you are best to mechanically modify the system to reduce the losses if possible. Reduce impeller sizes on pumps etc.

Claims about demand charge reduction by the use of VFDs are often incorrect. You need to understand the basis of the demand charge and it is not usually based on an instantaneous peak demand, rather a thermal demand with a 15 minute or 30 minute integral. The short time overload due to starting the machine is very small and has little impact. You still have to transfer the same amount of energy to the driven load to get it to full speed because you need to transfer the kinetic energy of the driven load at full speed.

Very rarely do you hear about the additional losses and costs resulting from the harmonics produced by the VFD. In this region, we are compelled to meet 8%THDi because of the issues these harmonics produce. This adds significant cost to the VFD and another 1 - 3% losses.

The use of a VFD increases (significantly) the losses in the motor and drive system and can only reduce losses in the driven load when the efficiency is improved by slowing it down for periods of the operating cycle.

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#17
In reply to #14

Re: Power Saved by VFD

01/15/2015 8:49 AM

I have been using VFDs in air blower applications, where previously an AC motor was running a blower at constant speed and then a damper used to choke the air flow down. We also have replaced eddy current drives with VFDs. Your local utility may also provide incentives for such conversions, if the cost savings are real.

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#18
In reply to #17

Re: Power Saved by VFD

01/15/2015 9:38 AM

From where do you get the input signal to VFD to adjust speed?.

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#19
In reply to #18

Re: Power Saved by VFD

01/15/2015 11:21 AM

In the applications I am speaking of the speed is set by the machine operator. If more air is required the VFD speed is increased. In the same way that they would have opened a damper in the past.

In your scenario you could look at an air flow meter with a 0-10 VDC output which could be used to adjust the speed of the VFD.

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#20
In reply to #14

Re: Power Saved by VFD

01/18/2015 3:57 AM

Nicely explained.I would like to to know, is there not any method other than speed changing for energy saving using VFD.

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