Engineering News Blog

Engineering News

Latest news of interest to engineers. Sourced from GlobalSpec's Engineering News

Previous in Blog: How Well Does Scotch Age in Zero Gravity? A Distiller Launches Some to Find Out   Next in Blog: NASA to Fly Atomic Clock to Improve Space Navigation
Close
Close
Close
14 comments
Rate Comments: Nested

This Internet Provider Pledges to Put Your Privacy First. Always.

Posted April 11, 2012 8:28 AM

From CNET News:

Step aside, AT&T and Verizon. A new privacy-protecting Internet service and telephone provider still in the planning stages could become the ACLU's dream and the FBI's worst nightmare.

Read the whole article

Reply

Interested in this topic? By joining CR4 you can "subscribe" to
this discussion and receive notification when new comments are added.
Guru
Hobbies - Fishing - New Member

Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Raleigh, NC USA
Posts: 13529
Good Answers: 468
#1

Re: This Internet Provider Pledges to Put Your Privacy First. Always.

04/11/2012 9:23 AM

It's a shame that the government is incapable of not overstepping their authority and scaring people into taking these measures. If they simply operated within the law and got lawful warrants based on probable cause to go after the bad guys, none of this would be necessary.

Unfortunately, when the government decides that they can supersede both the law of the land and the Constitution, citizens must do what they can to thwart them.

Bravo!!!!

__________________
Those who would give up essential Liberty, to purchase a little temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety. Ben Franklin
Reply
Guru
Hobbies - CNC - New Member Hobbies - DIY Welding - New Member Engineering Fields - Electromechanical Engineering - New Member

Join Date: Aug 2007
Posts: 23647
Good Answers: 420
#2

Re: This Internet Provider Pledges to Put Your Privacy First. Always.

04/11/2012 12:59 PM

This dream will be crush before it gets out of the gates.

First by creating government regulations that will bury this renegade.

__________________
“ When people get what they want, they are often surprised when they get what they deserve " - James Wood
Reply
Guru
Hobbies - Fishing - New Member

Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Raleigh, NC USA
Posts: 13529
Good Answers: 468
#3
In reply to #2

Re: This Internet Provider Pledges to Put Your Privacy First. Always.

04/11/2012 2:26 PM

Yep. I would imagine that they can pull a provision out of the patriot act to stop him in his tracks.

__________________
Those who would give up essential Liberty, to purchase a little temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety. Ben Franklin
Reply
Guru
Hobbies - CNC - New Member Hobbies - DIY Welding - New Member Engineering Fields - Electromechanical Engineering - New Member

Join Date: Aug 2007
Posts: 23647
Good Answers: 420
#4
In reply to #3

Re: This Internet Provider Pledges to Put Your Privacy First. Always.

04/11/2012 2:42 PM

or,.........is there a possible tax that can be imposed.

__________________
“ When people get what they want, they are often surprised when they get what they deserve " - James Wood
Reply
Guru

Join Date: May 2007
Location: Geelong, Australia
Posts: 1084
Good Answers: 54
#5

Re: This Internet Provider Pledges to Put Your Privacy First. Always.

04/12/2012 12:19 AM

I've often thought you Yanks are lucky to have organisations like the ACLU who are prepared to defend your rights.

__________________
If there's something you don't understand...Then a wizard did it. As heard on "The Simpsons".
Reply
Guru
Hobbies - Fishing - New Member

Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Raleigh, NC USA
Posts: 13529
Good Answers: 468
#6
In reply to #5

Re: This Internet Provider Pledges to Put Your Privacy First. Always.

04/12/2012 6:40 AM

Sometimes.

__________________
Those who would give up essential Liberty, to purchase a little temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety. Ben Franklin
Reply
Guru
Hobbies - CNC - New Member Hobbies - DIY Welding - New Member Engineering Fields - Electromechanical Engineering - New Member

Join Date: Aug 2007
Posts: 23647
Good Answers: 420
#7
In reply to #5

Re: This Internet Provider Pledges to Put Your Privacy First. Always.

04/12/2012 7:52 AM

ACLU can cross the line of not knowing the difference between rights and entitlements.

__________________
“ When people get what they want, they are often surprised when they get what they deserve " - James Wood
Reply
Guru
Hobbies - Fishing - New Member

Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Raleigh, NC USA
Posts: 13529
Good Answers: 468
#8
In reply to #7

Re: This Internet Provider Pledges to Put Your Privacy First. Always.

04/12/2012 7:58 AM

or Constitutional rights from made up civil rights..................they routinely both blur, and cross the lines.

__________________
Those who would give up essential Liberty, to purchase a little temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety. Ben Franklin
Reply
Guru
Hobbies - CNC - New Member Hobbies - DIY Welding - New Member Engineering Fields - Electromechanical Engineering - New Member

Join Date: Aug 2007
Posts: 23647
Good Answers: 420
#9
In reply to #8

Re: This Internet Provider Pledges to Put Your Privacy First. Always.

04/12/2012 9:12 AM

yah, what he said.

__________________
“ When people get what they want, they are often surprised when they get what they deserve " - James Wood
Reply
Anonymous Poster #1
#10

Re: This Internet Provider Pledges to Put Your Privacy First. Always.

04/12/2012 5:50 PM

Oh, my. Every time I read about some entity (and it isn't just the governmental agencies) trying to access semi-private communications of large numbers of people just by saying it is necessary (by whose definition?) I run the gamut of emotions from angry to depressed to curiosity.

I hope Merrill succeeds. And I do hope there is legal contention. Americans need to see whether it really is government BY and FOR the people by how cases such as this would potentially be get decided. Court cases like this would be help determine that.

As an aside, one can feel lament over the limited ability to sue the government. Because one thing that could have been brought to court, as unconstitutional, a long, long time ago is the deterioration of the Sixth Amendment -- especially the part about a "fair, and SPEEDY trial..." A very common way for big entities to start any legal proceedings against a smaller one, is the time delay like the one mentioned in the article. Six years for a case to be brought to court!? That's speedy?? There are many other cases that have taken longer. Some people die before their case ever gets a hearing. The stress alone could kill one or severely damage one's health. Money and time put larger entities at a very distinct advantage vs. smaller one. (Note that in Strunk v. United States, that the defendant -- a corporation, for instance -- is the one protected from delays in having a case heard. And most likely, is the one who would create these delays in the first place as a tactic to it "die on the vine.")

Count me in as one who thinks it isn't being radical to rethink the wording of the Constitution, et. al. (And adding or altering ideas, too.) I'm going to go out on a limb here, but I think the complex mess all "this" has turned in to would have been a disappointment to all who hammered out the basics of the Constitution. They tried to keep it as simple and basic as possible. That does lead to potential problems when trying to apply the ideals set forth there to the many varieties of human experience. But did it really have to get to the sordid mess we have now? Are we "A Nation of Sheep?" (Note the publication date of April 1961.)

Lifetime appointment of any government official flies in the face of representative government and democracy by the mechanism of ballots. (Supreme Court judges, for instance. ) I think there should be a provision in the Constitution, whereby any ruling by the Supreme Court could be subjected the supreme will of the people, via a nationwide proposition or referendum. It might even make for good reality TV. It could be called, "Ruling With the Stars," or "So You Think You Can Judge?"

Cynical, yes. But there needs to be some remedy for the craziness we all see happen every day and think, "How much more absurd can this get?"

Stare Decisis? Revisiting the history of law(s) with the goal of rewording or reworking how they are written, to take into the account all the rulings that had to be made, (and how many would be judged absurd, by both a long backward and forward view) would be a step in the right direction for keeping things from getting out of hand.

How many citizens have ever read "1984?" And would they connect the dots with today's world? (How could they not??) And if they did, by law, there is little they could do about it. (So many laws have been cleverly crafted to allow immunity and lack of accountability, as well as allow for "custom" behavior that often circumvents the touted purpose of the law.) That is the truly scary and depressing part.

Reply
Guru
Hobbies - Fishing - New Member

Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Raleigh, NC USA
Posts: 13529
Good Answers: 468
#11
In reply to #10

Re: This Internet Provider Pledges to Put Your Privacy First. Always.

04/12/2012 6:46 PM

The Constitution was made simple and easy to understand for a reason. It was written for the people, not the Government. A government of the people, for the people, is pretty easy to understand. None of the messes that we're in can be attributed to the Constitution...................all of them can be attributed to the government finding ways around it.

__________________
Those who would give up essential Liberty, to purchase a little temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety. Ben Franklin
Reply
Anonymous Poster #1
#13
In reply to #11

Re: This Internet Provider Pledges to Put Your Privacy First. Always.

04/13/2012 7:23 PM

Yes. I have intended for a long time to read a history of the Supreme Court. I know enough (I think... or may enough to get in trouble) to see that Marbury vs. Madison was somewhat like a power grab -- or "because we say so." (Pertinent statement at link: "As with most aspects of the U.S. Constitution, the meaning of Article III was left open to interpretation.")

Maybe a Supreme Court as we now have was inevitable. But I still think the people should have a mechanism to override all officials -- elected or appointed. Otherwise, it sooner or later, begins to feel like tyranny. (I know. The masses could become like a mob in a frenzy, given the speed of technology and it's ability to have those masses "rush to judgment." That, also, would be tyrannical. Maybe it's a bigger mess than we might imagine!) There needs to be a peaceful way to modify or address tyranny. For most of history that mechanism has been violent. Without it, I tend to agree with Jefferson's sentiment:

"God forbid we should ever be twenty years without such a rebellion. The people cannot be all, and always, well informed. The part which is wrong will be discontented, in proportion to the importance of the facts they misconceive. If they remain quiet under such misconceptions, it is lethargy, the forerunner of death to the public liberty. ... And what country can preserve its liberties, if its rulers are not warned from time to time, that this people preserve the spirit of resistance? Let them take arms. The remedy is to set them right as to the facts, pardon and pacify them. What signify a few lives lost in a century or two? The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time, with the blood of patriots and tyrants. It is its natural manure."

(Letter to William Stephens Smith (13 November 1787), quoted in Padover's Jefferson On Democracy - links are from the original referenced article.)

The founders did their best to come up with a form of government that assumes the worst about human nature and tries to correct for it. I think if they were here to witness how it has turned out, they would want to qualify and modify some of how they framed it. They might be happy with some of it and unhappy with much; or vice versa. But I feel sure they wouldn't try to preserve it as perfect. All human activity is a work in process. It was experimental. The experiment has revealed weakness. Do we ignore them because they were handed down to us "from on high?" I'd rather there be a spirited debate/discussion of those weakness and then "How do we correct them?"

(OT because while it is definitely related to the original post, it isn't specifically about Merrill and his company.)

Reply Off Topic (Score 5)
Guru
Hobbies - Fishing - New Member

Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Raleigh, NC USA
Posts: 13529
Good Answers: 468
#14
In reply to #13

Re: This Internet Provider Pledges to Put Your Privacy First. Always.

04/13/2012 8:08 PM

You're sure a fountain of information.

We do have a way for the government to hear the people. It wouldn't even cost much. The same technology that allows people to vote on idiocy like dancing with the stars, who's the best singer, etc. could easily be utilized to let the government know what we think, on everything they do....................................they are not interested.

It hurts to say that, but I fear it's the truth.

__________________
Those who would give up essential Liberty, to purchase a little temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety. Ben Franklin
Reply
Guru

Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: New York
Posts: 972
Good Answers: 23
#12

Re: This Internet Provider Pledges to Put Your Privacy First. Always.

04/13/2012 8:57 AM

An interesting follow-up:

http://news.cnet.com/8301-31921_3-57413511-281/privacy-protective-isp-raises-over-$43000-in-donations-in-one-day/?part=rss&subj=news&tag=title

__________________
The first law of thermodynamics is you do NOT talk about thermodynamics.
Reply
Reply to Blog Entry 14 comments
Copy to Clipboard

Users who posted comments:

Anonymous Poster (2); ffej (1); kramarat (6); Mizuti (1); phoenix911 (4)

Previous in Blog: How Well Does Scotch Age in Zero Gravity? A Distiller Launches Some to Find Out   Next in Blog: NASA to Fly Atomic Clock to Improve Space Navigation

Advertisement