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Warning, Speedsters: You Can't Fool Quantum Radar

Posted December 17, 2012 7:26 AM

From New Scientist - Online news:

A technique borrowed from quantum cryptography could make it impossible to spoof military and police radar systems

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#1

Re: Warning, Speedsters: You Can't Fool Quantum Radar

12/17/2012 8:13 AM

Ahh, but luckily, this material came along just in time:

http://cr4.globalspec.com/blogentry/21744/Quantum-Stealth-Material-Designed-to-Make-Target-Invisible

Quantum stealth beats quantum radar - if the cops can't see you, they don't know where to aim their radar.

We need one more quantum thing to have a proper game of quantum-scissors/quantum-paper/quantum-rock.

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#2
In reply to #1

Re: Warning, Speedsters: You Can't Fool Quantum Radar

12/17/2012 9:02 AM

Quantum Detectors?

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#3

Re: Warning, Speedsters: You Can't Fool Quantum Radar

12/17/2012 12:28 PM

Spoofing radar with an active system is simply illegal in the US under federal law.

Yes, I know you can buy them, but using one is still illegal.

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#10
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Re: Warning, Speedsters: You Can't Fool Quantum Radar

12/17/2012 10:20 PM

Speeding is also illegal.

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#11
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Re: Warning, Speedsters: You Can't Fool Quantum Radar

12/18/2012 6:45 AM

True, but one is a federal offense and the other is a simple traffic violation. There is a big difference between being arrested and getting a simple citation.

You could get a $10,000 fine or up to 1 year imprisonment, or both, for the first offense for the willful interference of police radar versus a $100 ticket. That assumes you are not doing some way excessive speed. Even then, it is hard to compete with section 501 of the 1934 Communications Act with a speeding fine.

Second jamming offense becomes a felony with up to two years imprisonment.

Makes the traffic ticket look like the tip for a good dinner.

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#15
In reply to #11

Re: Warning, Speedsters: You Can't Fool Quantum Radar

12/18/2012 1:51 PM

So I guess we are in agreement that a 'go, no-go' test doesn't lend itself well to the determination of 'right or wrong'.

That there are acceptable behaviors that are illegal....

....which suggests that the government's prohibition of something doesn't determine the morality or acceptability of an act, but is merely an additional 'cost' consideration in the evaluation.

Or, are we not of like mind on this?

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#18
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Re: Warning, Speedsters: You Can't Fool Quantum Radar

12/18/2012 3:36 PM

Excellent point!

I do believe that morality does not equal legality.

You can have bad laws just as you can have bad behavior.

I think some people simply use the law as their moral compass, but in the case of a bad law there is no right way to do a wrong thing.

Further complicating the picture is that some times a law may not be a good law under certain circumstances. Legislators try to cover those instances, but you can't catch them all. That is why we have judges to interpret the intent of the law.

An example of this is the law that restricts the use of some radio waves for transmission. However, under an emergency anyone is free to transmit on whatever frequency they need. The sticky part becomes what constitutes an emergency.

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#4

Re: Warning, Speedsters: You Can't Fool Quantum Radar

12/17/2012 6:56 PM

Harnf.... it's so much easier just to observe the speed limit. (+ no more than 10 kmh in Canada).

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#5
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Re: Warning, Speedsters: You Can't Fool Quantum Radar

12/17/2012 7:28 PM

Works every time I try it, too!

Florida gives you 10 mph, sometimes more. Police look for unsafe driving, not so much speed by itself.

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#6
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Re: Warning, Speedsters: You Can't Fool Quantum Radar

12/17/2012 7:37 PM

The law here is pretty explicit.. there are penalties based on how many km over the limit, and they start at 10 kmh above the limit... Everyone drives 10 kmh above the limit unless they are creeping over a sheet of ice, as happens occasionally, or nosing through impenetrable fog with zero vis, or ploughing through snow or such in a way that makes the 'limit' more applicable for safety reasons. In effect, there is no legal penalty unless you are 10 kmh above the limit. It is well known and observed as such.

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#7
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Re: Warning, Speedsters: You Can't Fool Quantum Radar

12/17/2012 8:24 PM

No "dangerous driving" charge in the event you are within the speed limit but have not slowed down due to poor driving conditions (snow, heavy rain, fog, etc)?

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#8
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Re: Warning, Speedsters: You Can't Fool Quantum Radar

12/17/2012 9:05 PM

hmm, I think the dangerous driving charge is possible at any speed, even slower than the limit, and logically if not slowing down for lousy weather conditions we are also famous for.

I myself only got a speeding ticket once, it was a perfect day with perfect conditions and no traffic either... still they were waiting around a curve, invisible and primed to make tickets. You'll never see me speed on crappy road conditions, I'm all about staying in one piece. As for usual speeds, one should go with the flow and not disrupt traffic by being too slow or fast - which means speed limit +10 here in any normal condition. The slowers are a hazard because antsy drivers want to pass, even though it's too curvy to do safely.

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#9
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Re: Warning, Speedsters: You Can't Fool Quantum Radar

12/17/2012 9:27 PM

I myself only got a speeding ticket once, it was a perfect day with perfect conditions and no traffic either... still they were waiting around a curve, invisible and primed to make tickets

Same for me, word for word.

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#12
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Re: Warning, Speedsters: You Can't Fool Quantum Radar

12/18/2012 7:12 AM

In Florida the speed fine schedule starts a +6 mph. Just keep it with in 5 and you will be fine. You can usually get away with a little more on the interstates, though. A trooper friend of mine says the Florida Highway Patrol has a saying: "over 9 and your mine"

Be safe out there.

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#13
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Re: Warning, Speedsters: You Can't Fool Quantum Radar

12/18/2012 7:22 AM

The 10 mph is strictly unofficial, but I have passed police cars doing 10 over and not been challenged. However, I tend to be anal about signals and usually pretty sedate with everything but acceleration.

10 is my upper limit unless I need it for a passing situation.

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#16
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Re: Warning, Speedsters: You Can't Fool Quantum Radar

12/18/2012 1:56 PM

I have the very same experience in Florida, AH.

It always causes some sphincter tightening when I inadvertently go by a cop at 10MPH over, but they have never stopped me.

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#14
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Re: Warning, Speedsters: You Can't Fool Quantum Radar

12/18/2012 7:23 AM

Or +19 Km/h, up to about 30 Km/h over on Toronto area highways (when you actually can move that fast on them!) providing you are not actually passing a cruiser driving on the road. Very often the traffic will slow to about 15 km/h over, and you know there is a cop at the head of the pile up.

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#17
In reply to #14

Re: Warning, Speedsters: You Can't Fool Quantum Radar

12/18/2012 3:11 PM

How annoying is it when there is a cop driving in the right hand lane right at or just under the speed limit?

It feels like they are just daring you to run the gauntlet. No doughnut for you, Copper.

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#19
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Re: Warning, Speedsters: You Can't Fool Quantum Radar

12/18/2012 3:39 PM

Worst one I heard was in New Jersey where two troopers drove side by side on an interstate highway at exactly 55 mph. They had traffic backed up for some ungodly distance.

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#20
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Re: Warning, Speedsters: You Can't Fool Quantum Radar

12/18/2012 6:45 PM

Louisiana (if I remember correctly) has been in court for their troopers practice of running up behind someone with out of state tags and tailgating very close, counting on many of the drivers to speed up....at which time the cops pull them over and tickets them for speeding.

ouch. Who is going to believe an out of state visitor with this story (unless it becomes common which apparently it did)...if the out of state driver even comes to court.

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#21
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Re: Warning, Speedsters: You Can't Fool Quantum Radar

12/18/2012 7:27 PM

I usually just get out of their way. You never know if someone really has a real emergency.

Most don't, but you never know.

I remember having to race home (medical emergency) and I went like the wind. Even passed a state trooper thinking - Thank God - they will stop me and assist. NOPE! They just let me go past at a high rate of speed. I did have my 4-way flashers and head lights on.

Everything worked out in the end, it was close.

After that incident I give people the benefit of the doubt when they come charging up on me.

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#22
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Re: Warning, Speedsters: You Can't Fool Quantum Radar

12/18/2012 7:33 PM

I as a rule won't speed up for someone tailgating. I will move to the right hand lane if for some reason I am not already there.

The problem in Louisiana is that the troopers were not necessarily in the passing lane. People shouldn't increase speed when being tailgated, whether by an unmarked cop or not... but many will.

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