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Chinese Say They're Building 'Impossible' Space Drive

Posted September 24, 2008 11:51 AM

From WIRED:

Chinese researchers claim they've confirmed the theory behind an "impossible" space drive, and are proceeding to build a demonstration version. If they're right, this might transform the economics of satellites, open up new possibilities for space exploration - and give the Chinese a decisive military advantage in space. To say that the "Emdrive" (short for "electromagnetic drive") concept is controversial would be an understatement. According to Roger Shawyer, the British scientist who developed the concept, the drive converts electrical energy into thrust via microwaves, without violating any laws of physics. Many other researchers believe otherwise. An article about the Emdrive in New Scientist magazine drew a massive volley of criticism. Scientists not only argued that Shawyer's work was blatantly impossible, and and that his reasoning was flawed. They also said the article should never have been published "It is well known that Roger Shawyer's 'electromagnetic relativity drive' violates the law of conservation of momentum, making it simply the latest in a long line of 'perpetuum mobiles' that have been proposed and disproved for centuries," wrote John Costella, an Australian physicist. "His analysis is rubbish and his 'drive' impossible."

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#1

Re: Chinese Say They're Building 'Impossible' Space Drive

09/24/2008 12:00 PM

Bully for them!

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#2

Re: Chinese Say They're Building 'Impossible' Space Drive

09/24/2008 3:34 PM

The Wikipedia article reads like a lot of the over-unity power generation scams / hopelessly wrong backyard projects. Same claims, same ignoring of laws, same small measurements easily misinterpreted, etc.

Why am I reminded of the water-to-fuel-using-microwaves scam.

I hope microwaves are not the new scam buzzword, they are so much more dangerous than fridge magnets. High voltage magnetrons and microwaves, a double whammy to remove the unskilled backyard inventor/inspired scammer from the gene pool.

Something to keep an eye on thou.

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#3
In reply to #2

Re: Chinese Say They're Building 'Impossible' Space Drive

09/24/2008 3:38 PM

I hope microwaves are not the new scam buzzword, they are so much more dangerous than fridge magnets. High voltage magnetrons and microwaves, a double whammy to remove the unskilled backyard inventor/inspired scammer from the gene pool.

You make it sound like a bad thing.

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#4

Re: Chinese Say They're Building 'Impossible' Space Drive

09/25/2008 10:32 AM

I am all for the development of the improbability drive that is used in the "hitchers guide to the galaxy".

The simplest solution for satellite launch is to drop a very large rubber band from the ISS, load the satellite into the chute and let her rip.

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#6
In reply to #4

Re: Chinese Say They're Building 'Impossible' Space Drive

09/25/2008 3:41 PM

I am all for the development of the improbability drive that is used in the "hitchers guide to the galaxy".

<Sigh> What CANT you solve with a nice hot cup of tea!

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#7
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Re: Chinese Say They're Building 'Impossible' Space Drive

09/25/2008 3:52 PM

I truly think that Mr Adams got it right!

Human beings, who are almost unique in having the ability to learn from the experience of others, are also remarkable for their apparent disinclination to do so.
-Douglas Adams

Don't Panic! (and don't lose you towel!)

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#8
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Re: Chinese Say They're Building 'Impossible' Space Drive

09/25/2008 4:22 PM

Don't forget your towel!

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#5

Re: Chinese Say They're Building 'Impossible' Space Drive

09/25/2008 12:18 PM

Somehow it seems unlikely that "experimental error" could create forces sufficient to launch satellites, and the Chinese are not ignorant. There may well be more than snake oil at work here... Could be a large outbreak of the "not invented here" syndrome erupting.

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#12
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Re: Chinese Say They're Building 'Impossible' Space Drive

09/26/2008 2:47 PM

I haven't read anything in the original post that indicates they're going to use it as a booster to get a payload into space. However, once in space, why couldn't this device provide propulsion? I see no obvious breakage of the law of conservation of momentum here... Unless I'm missing something really huge.

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#13
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Re: Chinese Say They're Building 'Impossible' Space Drive

09/26/2008 4:30 PM

And if you are, then they are too - it would have to be SO huge, it simply escapes observation...like how an elephant must appear to a flea...

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#9

Re: Chinese Say They're Building 'Impossible' Space Drive

09/25/2008 6:24 PM

Sometimes i wonder if we people are sometimes 'too smart' for our own good. I'm not sure about the past, but did anyone stop and think that some laws were made after the experiment? ie make a formula to explain what was observed? Who cares if some laws are broken? That's what they are there for. If it works, lets explain later.

The problem these days is that you need plenty of financial support and no one will back an idea without some 'proof'. If you are self funded, I say, go for it.

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#10
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Re: Chinese Say They're Building 'Impossible' Space Drive

09/26/2008 12:21 AM

Nope laws were made to be broken:

If you ignore them long enough you can come up with something that has not been done before. Someone once said that the human ability to do things beyond mere physical limitations was what set us apart from the norm. Our minds are tools of marvelous ability, why should you place a limit on them?

Have you ever seen what happens to a society where the laws are all followed? Those people need leaders, and badly. And so sadly is their fate without one. The self deciding self directed person gets a chain thrown around them to make them keep the same pace as the others. How boring.

What about inovaters?

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#11

Re: Chinese Say They're Building 'Impossible' Space Drive

09/26/2008 12:58 PM

Maybe we'll learn as much from this as the LHC.

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#14

Re: Chinese Say They're Building 'Impossible' Space Drive

09/28/2008 1:20 AM

The proof will be if it works. HHO has been proven not to work. I'll let them try it first. Now this may be something which was foisted on some scientifically ignorant Party politicians. If so may they waste their time and money.

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