Previous in Forum: Vacuum Circuit Breaker Trips on First Start, Without Any Indication   Next in Forum: Directional Power Element
Close
Close
Close
28 comments
Rate Comments: Nested
Anonymous Poster #1

Different Current at Same Phase

06/21/2015 3:17 AM

gentelmen

we have 4*3*630mm pvc/xlp cable

each phase have two cable carry more than other two " around double "

each cable RST within one plastic pipe under ground

re-tight all connection bolts, still same , cable temperature is high

i need the reason and what the solution

cable 1cable 2cable 3cable 4
ph # 1250765415925
ph # 2450865490730
ph # 3350790365700
Reply
Interested in this topic? By joining CR4 you can "subscribe" to
this discussion and receive notification when new comments are added.

Good Answers:

These comments received enough positive votes to make them "good answers".

"Almost" Good Answers:

Check out these comments that don't yet have enough votes to be "official" good answers and, if you agree with them, vote them!
Guru
United States - Member - New Member

Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: In the pool because it is too hot.
Posts: 3054
Good Answers: 141
#1

Re: different current at same phase

06/21/2015 5:05 AM

You might have copper in the cables.

That copper might carry current and the current might heat up your cable.

The difference in currents points to unequal loads or the distribution of your load over the cables.

Are the begin- and end points of the phase connected together?

Have the cables the same length?

How hot is hot for you?

630 mm are short cables, you have something to add?

__________________
Plenty of room here
Reply
Member

Join Date: Jun 2015
Posts: 7
#2
In reply to #1

Re: different current at same phase

06/21/2015 6:12 AM

all cable same length

this connection from substation breaker to load main breaker

this means the four cable have direct connection

temperature very hot at connection point reach 70 c " at cable lug "

40 c after one meter from connection point

cable length 100 meter

Reply
Guru

Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: About 4000 miles from the center of the earth (+/-100 mi)
Posts: 9910
Good Answers: 1141
#3
In reply to #2

Re: different current at same phase

06/21/2015 6:55 AM

Your problem is where it is getting hot. Make sure your terminations are clean and tight.

Reply
Member

Join Date: Jun 2015
Posts: 7
#4
In reply to #3

Re: different current at same phase

06/21/2015 7:06 AM

problem with cables whose high current or low current ?

Reply
2
Guru

Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: About 4000 miles from the center of the earth (+/-100 mi)
Posts: 9910
Good Answers: 1141
#11
In reply to #4

Re: different current at same phase

06/21/2015 9:08 PM

If your question is why each of the four cables on a single phase have different currents, it is because the resistances are different. The voltage from one end to the other is identical for the four cables. Current = Voltage / Resistance. If the cables are the same size, the difference is most likely at the terminations. The one with the lowest current has the highest resistance. That is where your problem is.

Reply Good Answer (Score 2)
Guru

Join Date: Mar 2012
Location: Out of your mind! Not in sight!
Posts: 4424
Good Answers: 108
#5

Re: different current at same phase

06/21/2015 7:10 AM

Each phase have two cable

Not sure this is as per code but seems you have one cable carry more so it gets hotter than the other one.

Maybe the concept of two cables per phase is wrong and you better go with one that can take the full load.

__________________
Common Sense Dictates
Reply
Member

Join Date: Jun 2015
Posts: 7
#6
In reply to #5

Re: different current at same phase

06/21/2015 7:43 AM

each phase have four cables

this is other record after we decrease the load

no way to use one cable , we are using 4*3*630 MM+2N630+G

cable 1cable 2cable 3cable 4
ph # 1630530314330
ph # 2580695320190
ph # 3600655225220
Reply
Guru
United Kingdom - Member - Indeterminate Engineering Fields - Control Engineering - New Member

Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: In the bothy, 7 chains down the line from Dodman's Lane level crossing, in the nation formerly known as Great Britain. Kettle's on.
Posts: 32175
Good Answers: 839
#22
In reply to #6

Re: different current at same phase

06/22/2015 1:19 PM

Then there is something wrong with cable 1 phase 2, cable 2 phase 1, cable 3 phase 3 and cable 4 phase 2. Surprisingly perhaps, they cannot be seen from here.

__________________
"Did you get my e-mail?" - "The biggest problem in communication is the illusion that it has taken place" - George Bernard Shaw, 1856
Reply
Guru
Engineering Fields - Electrical Engineering - Been there, done that. Engineering Fields - Control Engineering - New Member

Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: Long Island NY
Posts: 15600
Good Answers: 981
#7

Re: different current at same phase

06/21/2015 9:36 AM

I'm not certain of your configuration from the language you've used so I must make some WAG what might be your concern or even if you have a true problem. If these cables are not wired in a trefoil configuration then some of the heating may be induction heating of the ferrous supporting material around these cables.

I am worried about the current handling capacity of this cable and what your distant loads are drawing. Unless these cables are suspended in air then you have exceeded the recommend maximum current with all phases of cable 2 & 4. If they are in air then only cable 4 phase #1 is close to the maximum.

As for the current balance, only your load sets the currents drawn. No amount of cabling or contact conditioning can change that.

__________________
"Don't disturb my circles." translation of Archimedes last words
Reply
Guru

Join Date: Oct 2008
Posts: 42355
Good Answers: 1693
#8

Re: different current at same phase

06/21/2015 10:06 AM

1. You have a problem you do not understand.

2. You have not provided sufficient information to allow people half a world away to adequately troubleshoot the problem for you.

3. Using the "I have an undefined problem, please correct it for me" approach will never cause the problem to fix itself.

4. Hire a local, qualified electrician to come to your facility and troubleshoot and repair the problems with your circuit installation. Granted, this approach is not free of cost.

It is better to light the candle of qualified help than it is to struggle in the darkness of helplessness.

Reply
Guru

Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: South of Minot North Dakota
Posts: 8376
Good Answers: 775
#9

Re: different current at same phase

06/21/2015 11:17 AM

I have a pretty good suspicion of what is causing it but since you posted anonymously I will have to keep my thoughts to myself.

No name no answers from me.

Reply
Guru

Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Surrey BC Canada
Posts: 1571
Good Answers: 42
#12
In reply to #9

Re: different current at same phase

06/21/2015 10:48 PM

Is mohamed123 theOP?

Reply
Guru
United Kingdom - Member - Indeterminate Engineering Fields - Control Engineering - New Member

Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: In the bothy, 7 chains down the line from Dodman's Lane level crossing, in the nation formerly known as Great Britain. Kettle's on.
Posts: 32175
Good Answers: 839
#23
In reply to #12

Re: different current at same phase

06/22/2015 2:17 PM

It doesn't look like Stinky Pete...

__________________
"Did you get my e-mail?" - "The biggest problem in communication is the illusion that it has taken place" - George Bernard Shaw, 1856
Reply
3
Guru

Join Date: Oct 2012
Location: 100 miles North from the World Center
Posts: 879
Good Answers: 42
#10

Re: different current at same phase

06/21/2015 3:30 PM

The mutual induction between parallel cables on all three phases could produce a large

unbalance between conductors of the same phase currents for a certain configuration.

The correct configuration -in single row close each to other- has to be: ABCCBAABCCBA

See[for instance]:

http://jmst.ntou.edu.tw/marine/18-2/290-297.pdf

http://www.cired.net/publications/cired2007/pdfs/CIRED2007_0275_paper.pdf

IEC 60287-1-3 Electric cables-Calculation of the current rating. Current sharing between parallel single-core cables and calculation of circulating current losses

Electric Power Research Institute EPRI EL-5036-V4 Appendix A

__________________
Julius
Reply Good Answer (Score 3)
Guru
Engineering Fields - Mechanical Engineering - New Member

Join Date: May 2008
Location: CHENNAI, TAMIL NADU, INDIA.
Posts: 1851
Good Answers: 65
#13

Re: Different Current at Same Phase

06/22/2015 2:51 AM

You have stated 4 Nos. of Cables. From your posting it is not clear whether 2 cables are bunched together and connected to R,Y, B OR eachcable Red color is connected to R Phase, Yellow colour is connected to Y phase and Blue color is connected to B phase.

If you have bunched the cable and connected, it will cause over-heating and un-balanced current. Pl. clarify so that suggestion can be made.

DHAYANANDHAN.S

Reply Score 1 for Good Answer
Member

Join Date: Jun 2015
Posts: 7
#14
In reply to #13

Re: Different Current at Same Phase

06/22/2015 3:07 AM

each cable Red color is connected to R Phase, Yellow colour is connected to Y phase and Blue color is connected to B phase.

4 _CABLE *3_ PHASE *630 MM

Reply
Guru
United Kingdom - Member - Indeterminate Engineering Fields - Control Engineering - New Member

Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: In the bothy, 7 chains down the line from Dodman's Lane level crossing, in the nation formerly known as Great Britain. Kettle's on.
Posts: 32175
Good Answers: 839
#24
In reply to #14

Re: Different Current at Same Phase

06/22/2015 2:19 PM

630mm is a very short cable.

Would that be 630mm2 cross sectional area instead, please?

__________________
"Did you get my e-mail?" - "The biggest problem in communication is the illusion that it has taken place" - George Bernard Shaw, 1856
Reply
Guru

Join Date: Mar 2012
Location: Out of your mind! Not in sight!
Posts: 4424
Good Answers: 108
#25
In reply to #24

Re: Different Current at Same Phase

06/22/2015 9:55 PM

Cable length 100m as per post above!

Its like pulling teeth!

__________________
Common Sense Dictates
Reply
Member

Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 7
#28
In reply to #13

Re: Different Current at Same Phase

08/04/2015 1:25 PM

Sir,

Now 3 runs of cable from drive to Motor 240sqmm of 200mtr distance.

it is Delta connection,R,Y,B OF Each cable bunched.

heat is like that after 1 to 2 month terminalas got heat up.

Reply
Associate

Join Date: Jul 2011
Posts: 48
Good Answers: 1
#15

Re: Different Current at Same Phase

06/22/2015 3:19 AM

As has been said, you must ensure the cables are grouped RYB

If you have them laid RRR YYY BBB NNN then you will get this problem, we have seen this many times when testing switchboards, as you have said the current in some cables can be double and that is only over a very short length of ~ 5M

Reply Score 1 for Good Answer
Member

Join Date: Jun 2015
Posts: 7
#16
In reply to #15

Re: Different Current at Same Phase

06/22/2015 3:33 AM

and that is only over a very short length of ~ 5M
did you means if RRR YYY BBB sequence happened on short area, causing this problem ?sure this actually occured on my case where on the connection ends at both side all cables mixed in around 4 ~ 5 meter
kindly ensure

Reply
Associate

Join Date: Jul 2011
Posts: 48
Good Answers: 1
#19
In reply to #16

Re: Different Current at Same Phase

06/22/2015 4:06 AM

Yes

It was a test assembly and the lab were not carefull where they dropped the cables from the bars, it was easier for them to run RRR YYY BBB, to the transformer, but it caused lots of problems.

You need to ensure the cables are bunched very quickly after the connection to the assembly and remain in RYB RYB RYB format along their length

Reply Score 1 for Good Answer
Member

Join Date: Jun 2015
Posts: 7
#18
In reply to #15

Re: Different Current at Same Phase

06/22/2015 3:54 AM

Dear 3PhaseDesign-Craig
did you means if RRR YYY BBB NNN sequence happened on short area, causing this problem ? .
sure this actually occured on my case where on the connection ends at both side all cables mixed in around 4 ~ 5 meter
kindly ensure

Reply
Power-User
United Kingdom - Member - New Member

Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: Torquay England
Posts: 202
Good Answers: 4
#17

Re: Different Current at Same Phase

06/22/2015 3:40 AM

cross phase induction ?

__________________
Torque is not cheap
Reply
Guru

Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Phnom Penh
Posts: 4019
Good Answers: 102
#20

Re: Different Current at Same Phase

06/22/2015 5:25 AM

Al or Cu?

__________________
Difficulty is not an obstacle it is merely an attribute.
Reply
Member

Join Date: Jun 2015
Posts: 7
#21
In reply to #20

Re: Different Current at Same Phase

06/22/2015 5:38 AM

cu
insulation : XLPE/PVC

Reply
Member

Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 7
#27
In reply to #20

Re: Different Current at Same Phase

08/04/2015 1:13 PM

Al cable

Reply
Guru

Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Eastern Arizona mountains on Route 666 about a mile from God's country
Posts: 1676
Good Answers: 122
#26

Re: Different Current at Same Phase

06/23/2015 9:32 AM

Are you using a separate cable for each phase installed in individual conduits?

If so, the heating is most likely being caused by the magnetic flux interaction between the conductors.

All three phase conductors must be installed in the same conduit in order for the magnetic flux to cancel out.

__________________
They said; "Brain size?" I heard; "Train size?" so I said: "I'll take a small one, thank you."
Reply
Reply to Forum Thread 28 comments

Good Answers:

These comments received enough positive votes to make them "good answers".

"Almost" Good Answers:

Check out these comments that don't yet have enough votes to be "official" good answers and, if you agree with them, vote them!
Copy to Clipboard

Users who posted comments:

3PhaseDesign-Craig (2); 7anoter4 (1); DEVARAJ (2); dhayanandhan (1); dvmdsc (1); GW (1); IdeaSmith (2); lyn (1); merc600sec (1); mohammed123 (7); PWSlack (3); redfred (1); Rixter (2); SHOCKHISCAN (1); tcmtech (1); Wal (1)

Previous in Forum: Vacuum Circuit Breaker Trips on First Start, Without Any Indication   Next in Forum: Directional Power Element

Advertisement