Previous in Forum: Head Light Problem   Next in Forum: Assistance with GPS Speed Solution
Close
Close
Close
27 comments
Rating: Comments: Nested
Commentator

Join Date: Aug 2013
Posts: 93

6.6KV AC Current Measurement

09/25/2015 6:21 AM

Kindly let me know if I can fit a regular LV 800/5 current transformer into a 6.6KV AC circuit for the purpose of measuring an esimated 400A current flowing through the conductors. In other words, can a low voltage CT(current transformer) be used for a medium voltage current measurement ?. What is the diffence between an LV and a MV CT. ?. All these questions are related as one (If you are kind and qualified to answer). Thank you

__________________
Yea, Machines we are,you are one of us.Or aint you
Register to Reply
Interested in this topic? By joining CR4 you can "subscribe" to
this discussion and receive notification when new comments are added.

"Almost" Good Answers:

Check out these comments that don't yet have enough votes to be "official" good answers and, if you agree with them, vote them!
Guru
United Kingdom - Member - Indeterminate Engineering Fields - Control Engineering - New Member

Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: In the bothy, 7 chains down the line from Dodman's Lane level crossing, in the nation formerly known as Great Britain. Kettle's on.
Posts: 32175
Good Answers: 839
#1

Re: 6.6KV AC Current measurement

09/25/2015 6:31 AM

Wrong question. Its fitting is one thing. What is wanted is some indication whether it would survive the experience once energised. On the basis of the information stated, it sounds a highly risky thing to do, so it would be best to select the correct equipment in the first place rather than install the wrong thing and regret it later.

Equipment and facility damage is one thing. Killing someone is something else.

__________________
"Did you get my e-mail?" - "The biggest problem in communication is the illusion that it has taken place" - George Bernard Shaw, 1856
Register to Reply
Commentator

Join Date: Aug 2013
Posts: 93
#2
In reply to #1

Re: 6.6KV AC Current measurement

09/25/2015 6:57 AM

I'm afraid your answer is highly inhibitive. I need technical detail of what is "right" not mere saying it. I am aware of the safety concerns that is why I am asking first before I do. Let me know the difference between an LV and a MV current transformer. I don't intend to get angry by your inhibitive response. Cheers

__________________
Yea, Machines we are,you are one of us.Or aint you
Register to Reply Off Topic (Score 6)
Guru
United Kingdom - Member - Indeterminate Engineering Fields - Control Engineering - New Member

Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: In the bothy, 7 chains down the line from Dodman's Lane level crossing, in the nation formerly known as Great Britain. Kettle's on.
Posts: 32175
Good Answers: 839
#3
In reply to #2

Re: 6.6KV AC Current measurement

09/25/2015 7:17 AM

As any further remarks would be superfluous, the invitation is declined.

<unsubscribes>

__________________
"Did you get my e-mail?" - "The biggest problem in communication is the illusion that it has taken place" - George Bernard Shaw, 1856
Register to Reply
Commentator

Join Date: Aug 2013
Posts: 93
#4
In reply to #3

Re: 6.6KV AC Current measurement

09/25/2015 7:42 AM

Don't address me like a monkey. I am not. If you have nothing to share with me, keep your noise in silence.

__________________
Yea, Machines we are,you are one of us.Or aint you
Register to Reply Off Topic (Score 6)
Guru
Engineering Fields - Power Engineering - New Member

Join Date: May 2007
Location: NYC metropolitan area.
Posts: 3230
Good Answers: 444
#5

Re: 6.6KV AC Current Measurement

09/25/2015 9:20 AM

What is "right" is for you is to not attempt this work, or worse, direct anyone else to do it for you. Your question indicates a total lack of understanding of the dangers to property and life that you are facing, therefore no one here should attempt to assist you and this thread should be closed.

For the most part the posters here have enough ethics to not put you in danger, so your best bet is to find another forum where no one cares if you kill yourself. Better a thousand times cautious than one time dead.

__________________
“Tell me and I forget. Teach me and I remember. Involve me and I learn.” Ben Franklin.
Register to Reply
Commentator

Join Date: Aug 2013
Posts: 93
#6
In reply to #5

Re: 6.6KV AC Current Measurement

09/25/2015 9:53 AM

It's either you too don't understand what I'm talking about or you decided to play with my sincerity. Your comment is not technical at all. Your comment is political and I'm not a politician. Don't sound like you care so much for my welfare when you are busy defending your position. I know damn well what I want and if I die getting it, those physically sharing in this quest for the success of this measurement while I was alive will not make the moves a dead man made(and one of those moves was coming online here for "free consultancy"). You guys make me laugh like I'm asking for a password or something. Do you guys really feel I'm a monkey or what. ??? Perhaps I did not speak your terms. For your information, China doesn't speak English in engineering technics unless political diplomacy. Thanks for saying nothing

__________________
Yea, Machines we are,you are one of us.Or aint you
Register to Reply Off Topic (Score 6)
Guru

Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Eastern Arizona mountains on Route 666 about a mile from God's country
Posts: 1676
Good Answers: 122
#7

Re: 6.6KV AC Current Measurement

09/25/2015 10:06 AM

"can a low voltage CT(current transformer) be used for a medium voltage current measurement ?" NO.

What is the diffence between an LV and a MV CT. ?. LV is less than 600V. MV is 600-13.8KV. This is a critical insulation safety rating on electrical equipment.

The CT voltage rating must comply with/match the voltage present in the circuit.

If you install a CT that is not rated for the application the CT will fail causing equipment damage, personnel injury and/or death.

Never install any device into an electrical circuit that is operating at a voltage level higher than the device rating.

__________________
They said; "Brain size?" I heard; "Train size?" so I said: "I'll take a small one, thank you."
Register to Reply Score 1 for Good Answer
Commentator

Join Date: Aug 2013
Posts: 93
#8
In reply to #7

Re: 6.6KV AC Current Measurement

09/25/2015 10:23 AM

Thank you and sorry for my initial outburst. I technically agree with you now 100%. My lack of experience is the factor(s) which will affect the LV CT inserted in a MV circuit(intending 6.6'KV). Let me know if MV current measuring devices are rated as the LV CTs I'm so used to(ie 400/5. 800/1 etc). Let me know what the MV instruments manufacturer(s) alter in LV designs to make them work in MVs. I don't intend to bore you with my askings but your kind response in sharing your experience is all I look up to. I intend to witness a 6.6KV motor spin test conducted with a temporal current measuring device indicating its no load starting and running Amperes. And I intend to improvise this measurement safely

__________________
Yea, Machines we are,you are one of us.Or aint you
Register to Reply
Guru

Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Eastern Arizona mountains on Route 666 about a mile from God's country
Posts: 1676
Good Answers: 122
#9
In reply to #8

Re: 6.6KV AC Current Measurement

09/25/2015 11:00 AM

The CT voltage rating is determined by the type of coating utilized for insulating the wire used for CT winding(s) and the critical physical spacing/size of the CT components.

If you are going to be executing 6.6KV motor testing I strongly suggest you use a clamp-on current measuring device to ensure personnel safety and prevent equipment damage.

These can be rented from various suppliers from/through internet websites.

Use of an exposed in-line CT anywhere near personnel traffic is a recipe for disaster.

CT's are not usually modified after being manufactured due to high cost and high risk of CT failure.

If you do decide to use an in-line CT please make sure the area is barricaded and well labeled to prevent anyone and everyone from being within 10 feet of the CT when energized.

CAUTION! DO NOT EVER OPEN-CIRCUIT THE CT SECONDARY CIRCUIT.

Doing so will cause the voltage level at the CT terminals to exceed safe operable limits and there will be arcing and/or catastrophic failure which in turn can result in an arc flash incident. These arc flash incidents are deadly.

Good luck and stay safe.

__________________
They said; "Brain size?" I heard; "Train size?" so I said: "I'll take a small one, thank you."
Register to Reply
Commentator

Join Date: Aug 2013
Posts: 93
#12
In reply to #9

Re: 6.6KV AC Current Measurement

09/25/2015 11:30 AM

Thanks for your true kind response "SHOCKHISCAN" I was able to capture "insulation" and "spacing" from you. Thanks again for warning me about opening the secondary CT circuit. I will heed your warning. I shall intend to measure the current by an "O.E.M" CT inserted in the load conductor(without any physical touch), I shall also ensure the secondary terminals are closed(and perhaps earthed too?) - shall then attach a fluke(376) clamp on meter to the secondary closed conductor and check the current as the circuit is energized. My pending issues now will be the OEM CT calibration(s) and the ability of the handheld fluke meter to pick-up the transformed secondary current. The area I'm using is remote and restricted from human traffic. As of the clamp-on measuring device you suggested, I will be happy to lay my hands on any but I doubt availability of such "logistic" favouring my time/location.I don't know what an OEM MV CT will physically look like, but I shall enter the electrical scrap market and search. What do you advice master SHOKHISCAN ?

__________________
Yea, Machines we are,you are one of us.Or aint you
Register to Reply
Commentator

Join Date: Aug 2013
Posts: 93
#25
In reply to #9

Re: 6.6KV AC Current Measurement

09/26/2015 1:10 PM

Thank you SHOCKHISCAN, the ct is rated for 12/28/75 kv, there is an issued warning same as yours regarding secondary open circuit fatal high volts. The unit is as heavy as a block. I shall take the rest from here. God bless you

__________________
Yea, Machines we are,you are one of us.Or aint you
Register to Reply
Guru
Engineering Fields - Power Engineering - New Member

Join Date: May 2007
Location: NYC metropolitan area.
Posts: 3230
Good Answers: 444
#11
In reply to #8

Re: 6.6KV AC Current Measurement

09/25/2015 11:18 AM

I am not a politician anymore than you are an electrical engineer, but I have personally witnessed the result of "improvisation" when it comes to electrical equipment, its operation, and its measurement. I also don't care where you come from or what your position is, I am just trying to protect you and your coworkers from your naivete.

Electricity is an equal opportunity killer, it provides no warnings, strikes at will, and rarely affords a second chance. If you have the stomach for it then you should view these very graphic images of what happens when you fail to heed the advice of those who deal with it on a daily basis.

Many of these are low voltage burns, as evidenced by the lack of charring; medium and high voltage burns involve instant charring due to the enormous energy involved. One more point of reference, the voltage of the execution device known as the "electric chair" is 2,000Volts, and you want to play with 6,600??? Best of luck to you, you are going to need it.

__________________
“Tell me and I forget. Teach me and I remember. Involve me and I learn.” Ben Franklin.
Register to Reply
Commentator

Join Date: Aug 2013
Posts: 93
#13
In reply to #11

Re: 6.6KV AC Current Measurement

09/25/2015 11:48 AM

Thank you "RAMConsult" for attempting to make me beg for your experience and intellectual mercy. You are sitting on the throne of electrical engineering consultancy today because thousands before you toiled and died to bring you the information you refuse to freely share. I'm not "naivete" of paying your consultancy if you can fly into my location and executute common MV current measurement for a junior fellow in the year 2015. This is not stone age. We are thinking about the closest star to our solar system, we are thinking about machines that can effectively replace the physical works of men and you are there trying to type fear disguised as warning to someone who is trying to redo what has been already done a billion times. If you can't share, you stay off empty words. Thanks for telling me 2000volts kills. Is that a new information? -f I need it, I go to google. I don't understand why some people don't want to move with time

__________________
Yea, Machines we are,you are one of us.Or aint you
Register to Reply Score 2 for Off Topic
Guru
Engineering Fields - Power Engineering - New Member

Join Date: May 2007
Location: NYC metropolitan area.
Posts: 3230
Good Answers: 444
#16
In reply to #13

Re: 6.6KV AC Current Measurement

09/25/2015 12:21 PM

You are correct, I refuse to share knowledge that will potentially harm you, especially since you have demonstrated that you readily accept the information that will.

There are none so deaf as those that refuse to hear, nor as blind as those who refuse to see. <unsubscribes>

__________________
“Tell me and I forget. Teach me and I remember. Involve me and I learn.” Ben Franklin.
Register to Reply
Guru

Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Stoke-on-Trent, UK
Posts: 4496
Good Answers: 137
#10
In reply to #7

Re: 6.6KV AC Current Measurement

09/25/2015 11:04 AM

I'm not an electrical engineer, so for my education - how does a CT know the voltage of the line it's installed on? I assume it has a coil surrounding the cable being measured, but without any electrical connection to the cable. If high voltage is an issue, can't the CT be installed on the neutral side? As far as I'm aware, the voltage induced in the CT depends only on the (AC) current in the measured cable.

__________________
Give masochists a fair crack of the whip
Register to Reply
Commentator

Join Date: Aug 2013
Posts: 93
#14
In reply to #10

Re: 6.6KV AC Current Measurement

09/25/2015 11:57 AM

Thank you "Codemaster" this is exactly my assumption until I noticed that the LV CTs in my posession are apart from current ratios RATED in volts too. I juat learnt here too that INSULATION and SPACING of its internal windings plays a crucial safety and pragmatic role. So, we may assume that LV CTs will not work in MV circuits, berhaps they will arc-off.

__________________
Yea, Machines we are,you are one of us.Or aint you
Register to Reply
Guru

Join Date: Oct 2008
Posts: 42355
Good Answers: 1693
#15
In reply to #14

Re: 6.6KV AC Current Measurement

09/25/2015 12:09 PM

You should hire a COMPETENT engineer before you or, sadly, some poor fool who has to work for you experiences this:

Register to Reply
Commentator

Join Date: Aug 2013
Posts: 93
#17
In reply to #15

Re: 6.6KV AC Current Measurement

09/25/2015 12:45 PM

Quite funny I can say. I don't intend anybody's harm. And if I may ask, who is a "competent engineer" ? And what makes a "poor fool"...I bet you may not want to answer

__________________
Yea, Machines we are,you are one of us.Or aint you
Register to Reply Score 2 for Off Topic
Guru

Join Date: Oct 2008
Posts: 42355
Good Answers: 1693
#18
In reply to #17

Re: 6.6KV AC Current Measurement

09/25/2015 1:17 PM

My answer is that you defiantly belong in one or the other of these categories, and we all already know that you are not a competent engineer, just by reading your question.

Good Luck.

Register to Reply Score 1 for Good Answer
Commentator

Join Date: Aug 2013
Posts: 93
#19
In reply to #18

Re: 6.6KV AC Current Measurement

09/25/2015 3:04 PM

Thank you for your foolish judgment, and who exactly are you refering to as "we", perhaps you don't know how loney your judgment sounds to me. You can brag all you like but I'm certain you don't have answer(s) but a big sense of self importance. Good luck as you massage your sense of self importance

__________________
Yea, Machines we are,you are one of us.Or aint you
Register to Reply Score 1 for Off Topic
Guru

Join Date: Oct 2008
Posts: 42355
Good Answers: 1693
#20
In reply to #19

Re: 6.6KV AC Current Measurement

09/25/2015 3:47 PM

I always carry a mouse in my pocket so the "we" is valid.

We also never argue with fools.

<unsubscribe>

Register to Reply
Commentator

Join Date: Aug 2013
Posts: 93
#21
In reply to #20

Re: 6.6KV AC Current Measurement

09/25/2015 4:17 PM

All your comments are not valid. I wonder what your perspective definition of foolishness is. People like you are exactly the reason certain good things cannot be done because you wish only you could. But the obvious is that everyone expires from life and the world of men never expires with anyone. So, comfort your meaningless wisdom.

__________________
Yea, Machines we are,you are one of us.Or aint you
Register to Reply Score 2 for Off Topic
Guru

Join Date: Oct 2008
Posts: 42355
Good Answers: 1693
#22
In reply to #21

Re: 6.6KV AC Current Measurement

09/25/2015 6:03 PM

He has already left the discussion.

Register to Reply
Guru

Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Stoke-on-Trent, UK
Posts: 4496
Good Answers: 137
#27
In reply to #7

Re: 6.6KV AC Current Measurement

09/30/2015 7:15 AM

Don't suppose you could answer my #10 when you get a minute? I'm still curious.

Also I would assume the CT is designed for the current it's measuring, to give a voltage high enough to read accurately but not dangerous. Is this correct?

__________________
Give masochists a fair crack of the whip
Register to Reply
Guru

Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Commissariat de Police, Nouvions, occupied France, 1942.
Posts: 2599
Good Answers: 77
#23

Re: 6.6KV AC Current Measurement

09/26/2015 12:13 PM

Just stop being so pig-headed. The advice you've received is valid. No-one cares if you don't like it.

__________________
Good moaning!
Register to Reply
Commentator

Join Date: Aug 2013
Posts: 93
#24

Re: 6.6KV AC Current Measurement

09/26/2015 12:59 PM

STROMWANDLER(made in germany) is my partner now, all fake engineers(exception of one very good one who obviously knows him good self). All fake engineers who commented on this thread can go bury their outdated heads in shame. Thanks to the genuine "CR4" "IHS"... Team. God bless

__________________
Yea, Machines we are,you are one of us.Or aint you
Register to Reply Off Topic (Score 3)
Guru
Hobbies - Musician - Engineering Fields - Chemical Engineering - New Member Engineering Fields - Control Engineering - New Member Engineering Fields - Instrumentation Engineering - New Member

Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Moses Lake, WA, USA, Thulcandra - The Silent Planet (C.S. Lewis)
Posts: 4216
Good Answers: 194
#26
In reply to #24

Re: 6.6KV AC Current Measurement

09/27/2015 1:29 AM

I challenge you to think of how your "new employer" (if there really is one) regards your posts here on this forum.

I don't like your attitude. You do have some intelligence going for you, but it doesn't make up for your arrogance and petulance.

Leave now, and never come back!

__________________
"Reason is not automatic. Those who deny it cannot be conquered by it. Do not count on them. Leave them alone." - Ayn Rand
Register to Reply Off Topic (Score 4)
Register to Reply 27 comments

"Almost" Good Answers:

Check out these comments that don't yet have enough votes to be "official" good answers and, if you agree with them, vote them!
Copy to Clipboard

Users who posted comments:

Codemaster (2); Crabtree (1); lyn (4); Mikerho (1); PWSlack (2); RAMConsult (3); SHOCKHISCAN (2); Ukeje (12)

Previous in Forum: Head Light Problem   Next in Forum: Assistance with GPS Speed Solution

Advertisement