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NASA and Space Program

11/18/2015 12:40 PM

My 13 year old son asked me a question yesterday that kind of got me thinking a little about the satellites and the Space program. He asked, "How secure are the satellites from hackers?". I know nothing of the type of programming that goes into the communications of these satellites from NASA. Can anyone shed any light into this?

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#1

Re: NASA and space program

11/18/2015 1:40 PM

By hacking I assume you mean unauthorized use...most communications satellites just bounce signals...

"Unless you have millions of dollars and a team of engineers, you have no hope of taking over commercial or governmental satellites. You may have encountered boasts from hackers that they move satellites around and toy with their transmissions. If so, they were lying. In reality, communications satellites are too well guarded. They receive their commands through dedicated radio transmission systems, and the antennas these transmissions require are huge and expensive. This is because it is important to focus the satellite control beam tightly, and it takes large antennas to do this."

http://www.eutelsat.com/en/support/earth-stations.html

http://www.eutelsat.com/files/contributed/support/pdf/FAQ_CID_Satellite%20RF%20Interference_nsr_clean.pdf

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#2

Re: NASA and space program

11/18/2015 1:41 PM

Not very secure would be my answer. But I've been out of that business since 1990.

Satellite communication systems are rife with security flaws ...

Security researchers have found that many satellite communication systems have vulnerabilities and design flaws that can let remote attackers intercept, manipulate, block and in some cases take full control of critical communications.

Satellite Communications Wide Open To Hackers

Satellite hack raises security questions - CNET

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#3
In reply to #2

Re: NASA and space program

11/18/2015 2:10 PM

"And, the security levels make it extremely difficult, if not impossible, to hack into the system."

http://www.cnet.com/news/satellite-hack-raises-security-questions/

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#4
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Re: NASA and space program

11/18/2015 3:42 PM

Tsk tsk........................Shirley you jest.

All the information beamed up to and down from satellites comes from and goes directly into servers and copper/fiber optic circuits that are easy enough to hack.

And if you don't think the technology to beam and hijack signals from these stations does not exist, keep your eyes closed or you'll get them full of sand.

Easy? Maybe not. Doable? Absolutely!

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#11
In reply to #4

Re: NASA and space program

11/18/2015 7:37 PM

So you're saying it could be done, but has never been done? or that you think it has been done, but have no proof? or you have proof it has been done?(ie; a satellite owner that says so)...

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#12
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Re: NASA and space program

11/18/2015 7:47 PM

I'm saying that it could be done. I have no way of saying if it has, or has not, been done.

I think it may very well have been done, and of course I would have no proof of it.

Do you really think, for even a second, that the CIA/NSA/FBI/Army/Navy/Marine/Air Force/Coast Guard/Boy Scouts/Direct TV/Dish Network would advertise that they had been hacked????

ROFLMAO

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#13
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Re: NASA and space program

11/18/2015 8:06 PM

Very convenient....

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#15
In reply to #13

Re: NASA and space program

11/18/2015 8:19 PM

Hacks of OPM databases compromised 22.1 million people ...

[Officials: Hackers had access to security data for a year]

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#23
In reply to #13

Re: NASA and space program

11/19/2015 3:20 PM

Great Post!

I noticed there is a site on the internet advertising for voluntary DNA samples for the purpose of identifying the volunteer's ancestry and "roots".

I understand this and other similar methods are working well for the FBI, NSA, local law enforcement agencies, and Home Security in locating matches for previously unidentified DNA samples taken from unsolved crime scenes.

Who woulda thunk it?

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#20
In reply to #11

Re: NASA and space program

11/19/2015 9:46 AM

It has been done.Long time ago.

Remember Captain Midnight?

Link:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Captain_Midnight_broadcast_signal_intrusion

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#21
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Re: NASA and space program

11/19/2015 9:56 AM

The real danger,I believe would be in the hacking of the position controls that keep the satellite in the correct position.

A deliberate activation could send them out of orbit or into the atmosphere,and exhaust all of their fuel so a correction could not be made.

This would only require a very small amount of data to be compromised.

If an old dumb redneck can think of it,then there are many others much more capable of carrying it out.

A chain is only as strong as it's weakest link.

I hope someone has addressed this weakness.

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#5

Re: NASA and space program

11/18/2015 3:44 PM

...and the TITANIC was "unsinkable" too...just think geosynchronous Titantics.

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#6

Re: NASA and space program

11/18/2015 4:31 PM

I don't think the question should be if it is possible to hack a satellite's control system, certainly it is possible. I don't even think the ease or difficulty of doing this should be a concern. I think the question should be is it possible to hack a satellite and not be noticed. This I believe is impossible. A loss of communication via satellite will quickly trigger system alarms in many places.

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#7
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Re: NASA and space program

11/18/2015 5:05 PM

My admittedly personal interpretation of the question is can the data be hacked.

We know that most satellites (if not all) can be, and are, moved around incrementally.

Hacking the data would be the game changer and you cannot say with ANY certainty that some of them have not already been hacked.

It sometimes takes six months to discover that a system has been hacked.

NOTHING is unhackable, NOTHING!

That is why I do not trust cloud storage for any on my sensitive data.

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#8
In reply to #7

Re: NASA and space program

11/18/2015 6:43 PM

If anything can be hacked, then what do you trust?

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#10
In reply to #8

Re: NASA and space program

11/18/2015 7:01 PM

My Glocks, the coffee can buried in the back yard and my 1TB external hard drive.

Of course, I know I've already been compromised in oh so many ways.

My health insurance and banking accounts have already been hacked. But, the providers told me not to worry because they had signed me up for a whole year's worth of free credit reports, so I could tell when my data had finally hit the black market.

Boy, did that make me feel better.

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#16
In reply to #10

Re: NASA and space program

11/18/2015 11:40 PM

Unfortunately, I would have to agree with Lyn and all of the other posters who said that the satellites CAN be hacked.

Anything designed by one man (or group of men) can be overcome by another if they are willing to devote the required time and resources.

During my first job (about 40 years ago) the project engineering group would spend lunch looking for weaknesses in each engineer's systems; nobody, even the senior engineer designed a foolproof system.

I chose this comment to reply to, since I doubt that Lyn's Glock would be hacked; anything electronic-can be done.

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#18
In reply to #10

Re: NASA and space program

11/19/2015 8:59 AM

Are you saying that you also got a letter from OMB stating your info was compromised?

I was activated after 9/11, as I was somewhat older than most, my SF86 ran to a dozen or so pages. Notified last nite the bank called me that my CC was lifted, Happy Black Friday to someone. The representative assured me that I would not be charged for any unauthorized charges. I kindly told him that just like the electric scooter company that advertised "free scooters", that unless his institution was in the business of printing money, that he and everyone else was gonna pay.

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#19
In reply to #18

Re: NASA and space program

11/19/2015 9:09 AM

No.

My last security check was in 1988.

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#22
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Re: NASA and space program

11/19/2015 12:27 PM

Nearly $200 Billion dollars a year tax on society.

Sorry about your mess.

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#9
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Re: NASA and space program

11/18/2015 6:45 PM

It's going to be really scary when the bad guys start going after the latest comms enabled cars with all their fly by wire controls...

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#24
In reply to #7

Re: NASA and space program

11/19/2015 4:17 PM

I read a blog earlier this week that stated the Pentagon and other military communications were recently hacked but there was not much detail.

You don't suppose?

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#14
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Re: NASA and space program

11/18/2015 8:07 PM

Really what you want is to secure control over the satellite so that it can be remotely shut down at a time of your choosing.

That may be more difficult to detect since it leaves the satellite operating normally until you kill it.

This is something state actors would be more interested in doing. Non-state actors would simply be interested in creating digital anarchy.

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#17

Re: NASA and Space Program

11/19/2015 3:43 AM

Possible, well, yes. Probable? No, really, no.

Two elements in this discussion: Can I crack & hijack the communications systems that the satellites are carrying (payload crack); can I crack & hijack the flight vehicle itself (satellite crack).

Hacking the payload systems is difficult but not impossible, as Lyn points out in post #2 there's a range of known vulnerabilities.... although as yet there's not been an exploit that's been good enough to cause any significant trouble.

Hacking the bird itself is much harder. In addition to the usual security protocols that would exist for a high-security system on the ground you have extraordinarily complicated access issues with (often) bespoke hardware and unique communication protocols. The people /with/ all the codes, protocols and kit manage to lose the ability to communicate on a surprisingly regular basis.

An interesting background into the subject that may well intrigue your son, as it did mine, is the partially successful attempt to resurrect the ISEE-3 satellite. Things have moved on (a lot) so it's not a 101 on satellite hacking but it is a great story.

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#25

Re: NASA and Space Program

11/19/2015 7:02 PM

HiTekRedNeck gives a link that describes a vulnerability of the Hughes Communications DB satellite transceivers. "HBO's engineer tried to regain control by increasing the uplink transmission power from 125 to 2,000 watts. This was unsuccessful, and it was feared that a further power increase would damage the satellite."

So overloading the front with high RF could damage the transceivers. My guess that the satellite itself could be damaged and its ability to station keep would be impaired by a similar attack. Whilst it does not give you control over the satellite, it does deprive others of control.

Some space warfare scenarios have included EMF bursts if your satellite killer missile systems are not effective.

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#26
In reply to #25

Re: NASA and Space Program

11/19/2015 7:17 PM

Back when I worked with "spy" satellites, they were hardened against EMP damage.

Maybe they call EMP, EMF bursts now, I don't know.

We made sure that sensitive "stuff" was protected from EMP damage.

I could tell you how we did it, but then I'd have to kill you.

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