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Pump and Weir Type Carburetor Won't Suck Gas

08/19/2016 12:54 AM

I have an old Briggs and Stratton engine model 130202 that was made in 1975 i believe . It features a pump and weir carburetor and becase it is older, does not have a bulb you can pump to start gas flow. If there is gas in the second reservoir of the tank it will pump and run out of that but will not suck gas out of the main tank and into the resivoir. The screen on the end of the line appears to be clean. Any thoughts on what could cause it to not pump?

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#1

Re: Pump and Weir Type Carburetor wont suck gas

08/19/2016 1:08 AM

The rings could be worn out or the carburetor may need cleaning...Has the motor ever been rebuilt....? 41 years old....

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#2
In reply to #1

Re: Pump and Weir Type Carburetor wont suck gas

08/19/2016 1:14 AM

"The rings could be worn out or the carburetor may need cleaning...Has the motor ever been rebuilt....? 41 years old…."

I cleaned the carburetor but have not checked the rings extensivly. It was on the property when i bought it about 20 years ago and i have never serviced it or anything but i do not nkow what had been done to it previously. It has been sitting outside the whole time. I was able to get it to start and run but only off the gas in the second resivoir.

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#4
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Re: Pump and Weir Type Carburetor wont suck gas

08/19/2016 4:21 AM

Have you checked the pump valves? Some types I remember had discs which could be turned over to give a new lease of life.

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#9
In reply to #4

Re: Pump and Weir Type Carburetor wont suck gas

08/19/2016 1:24 PM

I will check! thanks for the advice

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#3

Re: Pump and Weir Type Carburetor wont suck gas

08/19/2016 1:31 AM

Even a tiny leak in the fuel suction line can make the pump ineffective.

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#5

Re: Pump and Weir Type Carburetor wont suck gas

08/19/2016 11:19 AM

THe most common problem with those types of carburetors is the tiny rectangular diaphragm gets a pinhole in it or it becomes hard or the spring breaks thus not pumping fuel properly.

The next most common thing is the the dip tube that it sucks fuel up from the bottom of the tank gets a crack in it near the top preventing it from being able to suck fuel up. After that the passages for the main and idle jets can become plugged preventing fuel from being able to be drawn into the carburetor.

Will it run if you pour a bit of fuel in the intake? Or will it draw fuel in if you block the intake off completely with your hand while trying to start it?

Will it run if the tank is filled completely to the top?

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#8
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Re: Pump and Weir Type Carburetor wont suck gas

08/19/2016 1:23 PM

It will run off fuel i have poured into the intake but i have not tried filling the tank completely

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#6

Re: Pump and Weir Type Carburetor wont suck gas

08/19/2016 11:47 AM

If you check some of the small engine repair parts sites, or maybe even Sears, you may be able to get a complete carburetor kit and that is highly recommended. Or even install a new carburetor. One last trick is this fluid called "Starbrite" in a light blue plastic bottle at most automotive retailers, especially O'Reilly. It will help break up any varnish deposits that may have screens plugged, but judging by the age of the engine, this carburetor was never intended for use with gasohol fuels. The old generation of materials will embrittle and crack, rendering them useless.

Another thing: since fuel is making it up to the upper reservoir somehow, it could be the fuel flow needle valves are fouled with varnish. Try the fluid I mentioned above, and I do approve this message.

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#7

Re: Pump and Weir Type Carburetor wont suck gas

08/19/2016 12:39 PM

Here is a repair guide.

http://outdoorpowerinfo.com/repairs/briggs_pulsa-jet_horiz_fixed.asp

If it has set that long not running the diaphram that makes up the pump is at the least hard as a rock. If not cracked and broken.

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#10
In reply to #7

Re: Pump and Weir Type Carburetor wont suck gas

08/19/2016 3:07 PM

I just took apart the carburetor to find that the diaphram was comepletly intact and still very flexible. It suprised me but now what

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#11
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Re: Pump and Weir Type Carburetor wont suck gas

08/19/2016 4:02 PM

Get a bottle of Starbrite and cross your fingers. Also remove the needles and clean them and the tiny orifices (jets) and then maybe you can gas to flow. Or you be stuck looking for pinholes in vacuum side stuff for a while, or get a new carb.

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#12
In reply to #10

Re: Pump and Weir Type Carburetor wont suck gas

08/19/2016 10:03 PM

Wow, it's been a while since I worked on one of those. You say the engine runs when gas is in the well, so the problem is not plugged jets or metering passages. Here's a link to how the Pulsa-Jet jet works. Your problem is in the first few steps.

I think there were several different variations of the pulsa-jet, but they all used the same basics. In order for the pump to work there has to be a check valve (at least one) to keep the fuel going out of the tank and not back-and-forth. I think some of them had a check valve in the long pick-up tube, but if yours has the 2 D-shaped flappers like the pictures, yours does not. Here are some things to check:

* Can you blow (mouth pressure, not 100#) through the long pick-up tube (If yours has a check valve, you should be able to blow through it but not suck) from the large end? With the diaphragm off, you should be able to blow through the inlet check valve seat.

* Wiggle the tube to make sure it's not cracked and make sure it doesn't have a hole in the side of it.

* You mentioned that the diaphragm is flexible, but hold it up to a bright light and make sure it doesn't have even the slightest pin hole. Also, are the 2 check flappers soft and flat? They have to seal against the check valve seats.

* Are the check valve seats clean, flat, no scratches? The inlet seat is in the carb body and the discharge seat is in the diaphragm cover.

* There is a fuel passage in the diaphragm cover. Is it open?

* There is a partition in the diaphragm cover. Does it mate with the carb body with no leaks, no holes or cracks?

* There is a spring and washer with rounded edges on the carb side of the diaphragm. Is it in place and does it protrude 1/8 to 1/4" (that's a guess) from the face of the carb?

* There is a fuel passage from the discharge check valve seat to the fuel well. Can you blow through it to make sure it is open?

* There is a vacuum passage from the diaphragm chamber (carb side of the diaphragm) to the carb throat. If it's plugged, no vacuum pulses to make the pump work. Make sure it's not plugged.

That's about it. If everything seems to check out, replace the diaphragm anyway. Oh, are you doing all your testing with the air cleaner on? I seem to remember some Briggs engines that just about would not start with the air cleaner off, but I could be wrong and it may not have been the Pulsa-Jet engines.

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#20
In reply to #12

Re: Pump and Weir Type Carburetor wont suck gas

08/21/2016 2:15 PM

Ive had the air filter off when messing with it just so i can get a good look at the carburetor and choke but thats an awesome checklist. I will look at all of them and see if i can find the problem. thanks again

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#13
In reply to #10

Re: Pump and Weir Type Carburetor wont suck gas

08/19/2016 10:09 PM

Here's a better site showing just the Pulsa-Jet pump part.

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#14

Re: Pump and Weir Type Carburetor Won't Suck Gas

08/20/2016 12:51 AM

You don't say where you are located, but in America, the biggest problems with engines that sit for a while is ethanol fuel. Until I started using an ethanol free fuel, I was always fighting with carburetors in the spring. The ethanol does weird ting to gaskets and seals in older engines. On a older Briggs, sitting through one winter, there was something that looked like tar in the fuel pump, had to rebuild the carb. No problems after I started using ethanol free gas in all my small engines.

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#19
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Re: Pump and Weir Type Carburetor Won't Suck Gas

08/20/2016 7:24 PM

I disagree with the ethanol blaming.

I've been running E30 or higher in all my engines for years, 1940's JD a tractor to 2016 MTD four stroke trimmer and everything in between, while my brother and dad run the ethanol free stuff and I have found that we all have the exact same problems with fuel systems.

Fuel lines rot out after a year or two, fuel goes sour after a few months and anything that sits for a long time gets plugged up with sticky rotten fuel varnish and crusty crap. E30 or E free they both have the same end results.

Around here I know for sure it's the gasoline blends that are to blame not ethanol the only things that survive it are the old machines that have all metal fuel systems from the tanks through the carburetors but they still get that varnish and crap build up if I don't shut their fuel off and let them run their carburetors dry before parking for winter.

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#15

Re: Pump and Weir Type Carburetor Won't Suck Gas

08/20/2016 2:05 AM

I was able to find a replacement fuel tank and carb as a unit from NAPA. It solved my water rotted fuel tank.

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#16

Re: Pump and Weir Type Carburetor Won't Suck Gas

08/20/2016 4:10 AM

A tiny hole in the tank allowing air in, is probably the problem, or even in the suction pipe, but above the level of the lower tank!, The list is long. Using a bicycle pump and connector, search for small air leaks with soapy water. I usually use washing up liquid mixed with water, about the same strength that a child can use to blow fine bubbles!!

When found, clean the area(s?) around the hole(s?) with say denatured spirits (remove any rust with some abrasive means first), then cut tiny patch of some material, I have used part of an old cotton shirt for example (, but its mostly unimportant what the material is), and using 2 part epoxy, make sure it is fully encased in epoxy! Leaving it in hot sunlight promotes fast hardening.

I have used such small repairs for over 50 years on many things, often cars, none have failed me in any way whatsoever....provided it is on a part that does not flex.....for those, you need something else!

I hope this helps....

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#17

Re: Pump and Weir Type Carburetor Won't Suck Gas

08/20/2016 12:53 PM

Water in the tank? You may have a fuel line with water blocking the flow of fuel.

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#18

Re: Pump and Weir Type Carburetor Won't Suck Gas

08/20/2016 12:56 PM

I have experienced a similar problem and found that fuel lines can close up, restricting the fuel flow. I Suggest you replace the fuel lines.

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#21

Re: Pump and Weir Type Carburetor Won't Suck Gas

08/22/2016 12:10 PM

The fuel pump diaphram gets old and brittle, especially if it sets with no fuel in it. It is on the side of the carb. -- JHF

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