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THHN/THWN Versus XHHW-2/X

04/27/2017 10:29 AM

I spoke with a local electrician yesterday about installing new conductors for a remodel for an evaporative cooler install. He said that he would use THHN wire. His plan would be to add another circuit breaker to the existing panel box, so the cooler would have it's own dedicated supply. He stated that he would use THHN from the panel to a double gang box, ( currently there is a single gang box in the wall ) using metal emt, then from the double gang box on the wall through emt to a single gang box mounted on the roof. At that point, I would use liquid Tite conduit ( Liquid Tuff type LFMC 1/2 (16) AFC/KAF-TECH FT-1 rated 80c dry / 60c wet ) and 12ga THHN into the cooler.

He made no mention of using XHHW-2 .

I did some online research on the difference between THHN & XHHW-2 and I wonder if the latter is a better choice for conductors. It appears that XHHW-2 outperforms the former, but I could not find a cost comparison chart ( per foot )

According to online, the values for XHHW-2 are higher and it has an increased resistance to ozone.

From what I read ( on insulation resistance THHN 0.85 m- ohm after 12 weeks versus XHHW-2 105,250 m- ohm after 12 weeks )

Can you provide some considerations​ I haven't thought of.

On this application, from the j- box mounted on the roof, to the cooler there will be 3 conductors, 1 ground & 1 neutral . Load will be a single ph 1/3 hp motor & 1/60 hp pump.

Will the resistance leakage have any noticable affect over (est.) 15 yr. span ?

Would there be any advantage gained by going to XHHW-2 versus THHN/W ?

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#1

Re: THHN/THWN Versus XHHW-2/X

04/27/2017 10:38 AM

More than likely the electrician has a ready supply of the much more common THHN, but if you want to pay for advantages that you may not use, then go for the XHHW. Here's an article that describes the electrical/mechanical differences, call a local distributor for the cost differential.

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#2
In reply to #1

Re: THHN/THWN Versus XHHW-2/X

04/27/2017 11:12 AM

Thanks for the reply. I trust members here for good advice.

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#3
In reply to #1

Re: THHN/THWN Versus XHHW-2/X

04/27/2017 11:15 AM

Ram, I clicked on article, it says page not found.

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#5
In reply to #3

Re: THHN/THWN Versus XHHW-2/X

04/27/2017 2:36 PM
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#4

Re: THHN/THWN Versus XHHW-2/X

04/27/2017 2:01 PM

Unless there was a specific reason or mfg recommendation to use anything but THHN I wouldn't consider using anything else.

I think I've run THHN a lot closer to 100% of the time than 99%.

..in emt more often than not. above and below grade inside or out.

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#6

Re: THHN/THWN Versus XHHW-2/X

04/27/2017 3:13 PM

I use THHN nearly all the time, it's the best bang for the buck I've found....I wouldn't use XHHW unless the specifications of the THHN fell short of the application....or unless the customer specified it's use for some/any reason....I use stranded copper over single conductor because it's easy to run, cheap, and holds up well under abuse, now that's a quality choice gained from experience, not a requirement of spec...So I guess what I'm saying is there is a preference according to specification and experience that dictates the right wire to use...overspending for no good reason is not a strategy that works well in business...but premature failure is even worse....

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#7

Re: THHN/THWN Versus XHHW-2/X

04/27/2017 7:54 PM

In my (old) NEC, THHN is described as suitable for dry or damp, but not wet, locations. THWN is usable in wet locations, and chances are that your contractor's THHN is also stamped THWN; if so, it should be okay.

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#8

Re: THHN/THWN Versus XHHW-2/X

04/27/2017 8:05 PM

Thanks everyone for the replies. I want to use the best quality material, if I can get it at or near the same price.

I don't believe in stepping over a dollar to pick up a dime.

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#9

Re: THHN/THWN Versus XHHW-2/X

04/28/2017 1:13 AM

For chiller application, go for the XHHW which is suitable to -40C.

Insulation issues could occur if THHN is too close to the refrigerant lines, or they can be damaged if there is a refrigerant leak, making the repair much more expensive.

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#10
In reply to #9

Re: THHN/THWN Versus XHHW-2/X

04/28/2017 6:29 AM

I wonder what the likely hood of that happening would be? May I also recommend explosion proofs boxes and covers?

..You need to leave something for the insurance adjusters after all.

I'm not saying it couldn't happen.. I'm just not the type who buys extended warranties etc. How many tens of thousands has that saved me over the years I'll never know?

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#11
In reply to #10

Re: THHN/THWN Versus XHHW-2/X

04/28/2017 6:50 AM

Since this is an evaporative ("swamp") cooler, and not a refrigerated chiller, that likelihood is about zilch. Hence the OT.

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#12

Re: THHN/THWN Versus XHHW-2/X

04/29/2017 12:58 AM

I don't usually see XHHW for smaller conductors, THHN should last a long time.

Some suggestions for a long term installation:

#10 stranded Cu, if you are willing to invest in more expensive wire

a piece of rigid, depending on how you are penetrating the roof

a real box on the roof (not white metal)

duct seal to prevent condensation from coming back down the conduit

a service receptacle on roof

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#13
In reply to #12

Re: THHN/THWN Versus XHHW-2/X

05/03/2017 2:40 PM

Good ideas.

1. #10 not really needed as load is usually less then 15 amps. With the exception being 220v line.

2. A real box ( I often use Hubble Electrical Products # 5324-0 )

3. Duct seal ( other than Teflon paste or silicone, I use Design Polymerics DP 1010 Duct Sealant )

4. Service receptacle ( # 5324-0, Hubbell # 3512-8, Halex Co. 28231 )

Generally a single gang box is mounted atop EMT then 12 ga is ran through liquid Tite to Cooler. The service receptacle would be the J-box. In this application.

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