Ceiling Fan Help

First, is there an electrical junction box that is wired and able to have a fan connected to it?

Ideally you should mount the box to a ceiling joist or a framed-out box between joists. I'm not sure I'd mount an electrical junction box to piping, especially water or gas piping.

As far as covering the box, you can buy decorative "medallions" to cover over the fan housing and uncovered junction box.

Check out the Do-It-Yourself Network's web site. They have many expert help forums. http://diynetwork.com/

I have used an adjustable metal brace that I could install between joists. There is a good picture of on on this Home Depot link, which also gives a step-by-step procedure. Just to give you another prospective, here is the Lowe's link. Many times when I do something I am unfamiliar with, I refer to multiple installation guides, just so I am more comforable with the project. As far as dealing with pipes, I leave them alone. Since it sounds like your hole is too big, you will need to purchase a medallion, purchase a bigger ceiling fan base or patch the drywall. Good Luck!

I'm sorry for appearing rude, but if you have no clue as to how to wire up something as simple as a ceiling fan, you have no business trying to do it yourself.

ELECTRICITY IS DANGEROUS AND CAN CAUSE FIRES!!!

Fire damage will be a lot more expensive than a qualified electrician!

Besides, there is NO WAY that any advice you can get on-line, here or anywhere, can be valid. We cannot see what you have already, what you are trying to do etc. Such is the danger of homeowners trying to go cheap by using the internet.For buying music, a TV or small appliance, OK, but for wiring your house, NO WAY!!!

I agree with your views one hundred percent.Electrical job is to be done by only a licenced Electrical person .One who does not have basic knowledge should not touch it .It is illegal and dangerous.More than damages the person can die of electrocution. So no advices for such threads.Consult a licenced electrician.

Get off the soap box! It isn't the electrical end of things he is stuck with - it's the challenge of mounting and supporting the fan when there is nothing conventional in the ceiling. If he calls in a "professional" he'll either get a further botch of the house wiring or a demand the whole house be rewired.

The extendable leg boxes as shown in the home depot link in the post above work well. I've used one by a major electrical supplier here in the U.S. which threaded the arms out into the joists and was remarkably strong. It can be a challenge threading the new support box up into the ceiling with the obstructions you mentioned, but if you make your hole bigger and plan to make a repair of the plaster and perhaps use a psuedoplaster medalion to cover it all you'll likely have an easier go of it.

Good point.

ASS-U-ME.

I made the assumption, and assumed that there was an understanding of basic electricity. I have been able to learn about a new topic, through reading simple thorough instructions like listed on some of the DIY websites and get myself more than comfortable enough to impliment. Although, I do reference good sources prior to getting into something that can be dangerous. Again, another assumption that others do the same, and think before doing.

Although, hiring an electrician is not always what its cracked up to be.

But come on, BASIC electricity for home wiring is not that difficult to grasp. If the instructions are followed, there should be no issue, unless there are special circumstances within the wiring of the house, for example, the spagetti in his ceiling does not match what's in the instructions...

Just one thing to add here.

Make sure you turn the power off!!

But yes basic home electrical wiring is not difficult.

Typically white on white. Black on black. green or bare on ground.

But as I said above.

Make sure you turn the power off!!

By the way I really like your emotes where do you get those??

And if your house wiring is like in my grand old pile of an 1870's house - silk wrapped copper with no green wire in site - make sure you use a solid ground clamp to one of those pipes you found in the ceiling - check and confirm you have a good ground.

Too right on the old wiring. Make sure the circuit is grounded and make sure you know which side of the circuit is hot. Be sure that is the switched side of the circuit. You might get some colored electrical tape to label the wires so there isn't any confusion. You should buy a voltmeter or continuity tester and learn to use it.

Beyond the electrical questions it seems that you've been left with something that isn't code. If you aren't in the mood to rip it all out and put in the proper stuff then the mounting of the fan really becomes a matter of improvisation. Just make sure the electrical connections are very secure - like wire nuts with electrical tape wrapping the wire and the wire nut, for example. Then screw the fan into any good support lumber that's in the ceiling. Make sure you have a good ground. It won't be code but it will hold up just fine.

In deference to the "follow the code" crowd, the code does exist for a good reason - to prevent fires and to do things in a standard way so the next guy working on the circuit knows what to expect. Yeah, there are bad electricians out there, but if you're not comfortable with anything that's being discussed in these threads you should really get help. Maybe an EE or ET friend can help Or check what the electrician is saying. But it's really cheap insurance to get help. A fire is a bad risk. The aggravation of getting this done right is worth the effort.

Grounding is another "art". A piece of a metal pipe in building that possible is connected to another piece buried in the ground do not guarantee safety. If they have bad "current path" it could cause a fire or electric shock. This is what I think you meant advising "to have a good ground."

And here probably self-study of basic electricity won't work.

What about "ground vs neutral" in the home service?

You are right. - and even having a good ground doesn't guarantee safety - it just ensures that if there's a short there's somewhere for the current to go other than through someone touching electrical hardware.

An efficient route for disposing of stray current also helps ensure the location of the problem get hot enough to start a fire.

If you really want to do it "RIGHT" - gut the house and start from scratch, use CSA standards for your wiring because they are better than most others for domestic wiring...

You made good notes.

By the way what is CSA?

I know USA National Electric Code, VDE+DIN, IEEE

CSA - Canadian Standards Association

An old standard joke on Canadian TV was a mock news report of Buffalo NY showing fire department activity... I was shocked when I saw Buffalo TV and saw their news reports were just like the Canadian spoofs!

Little details like minimum #12 wire size, alternate outlets on different circuits and so on can make a big difference.

Well said.

IF you didnt have a good answer why did you even bother answeing my question and the question i posted had nothing to do with the wiring it was a mounting question not a wiring question.

IF you didnt have a good answer why did you even bother answeing my question and the question i posted had nothing to do with the wiring it was a mounting question not a wiring question.

The problem with hiring someone is you will never learn to do it yourself if you don't try it. I'm not suggesting going in totally ignorant and just lining stuff up but you should be able to get it figured out between your common sense, some internet instructions, and the instruction manual for the fan. As everyone else has said, turn off your power. No, that doesn't mean tape on the light switch to the room with OFF written on it. Turn off the breaker and find a way to make it so you are the only person that can turn it back on (lock the breaker box closed). Remember that ad with the guy fishing around in the garbage disposal for something and his wife goes to turn on the lights? Don't be that guy, otherwise, good luck and enjoy.

The pipes you're referring to are gas pipes for gas lighting. I'm sure your house may be that old. First you need to determine if this piping is still live with gas. The old box is designed to mount to the gas pipe the pipe size was 3/8". The wiring may be knob & tube coming thru an insulated bushing in the back of the box. You need whats call a hickey 3/8" to 1/2" to screw on to the gas pipe. The hickey will allow you to take a 3" round "pan cake" box with a 1/2" knock out in the back and with a 1/2" chase bushing you can screw the box to the pipe. You may have to find away to support fan mount to some structural wood member to make sure the fan rotation at any speed won't shake the mounting loose. The other way is to take a round surface Wiremold box. Screw it to the ceiling via the ceiling joist and with toggle bolt to the lathe and hope that works.

I've done these before...sometimes it "ain't E-Z"

Thanks for your reply i actually did what you said i purchased a flat pancake box and mounted it to the pipe that was there because it was threaded and the wires where coming in the insulated pipes , i didn't know about a hickey is there another name for that because i try to do a search and it wont come up ,i have the fan mounted all i need is a medallion now thanks for your reply

If you want to use for grounding or other application living gas piping, most of local rules require Gas Company approval!

The gas company where I live will approve anything for a $20 fee..

The folks at Home Depot or Lowe's will be happy to sell you a fan mount specifically for your purpose. Ask about the wiring while you are there. If you are installing an old used fan that someone gave you then ask before wiring. If you bought a mew fan there should be complete instructions in the box. Follow the instructions carefully.

It is really simple just get good advice from someone who knows how to show you.

That's what I really love about California! The people at Home Depot and Lowes there probably do know and will be helpful!

As for those of us less fortunate - places like Lowes and Home Depot usually have a large section of excellent, well illustrated, detailed how to do just about anything books. Very useful if you have uncertainties and in case your Lowe's and Home Depots are like mine - primarily staffed by knuckle dragging, surly, bite your head off, part time, minimum wage, no benefits unfortunates.

You are right even here in CA, but those surly, Knuckle draggers, as you call them can usually come up with the answer to something as simple as this. If I were installing an electrical panel or rewiring a structure I would certainly consult someone more knowledgeable. Sorry for the un-helpful response I'll try to do better next time.

No!! You are right - there are places and I've seen this in California where somehow these places can actually have credible, experienced, service minded personnel! It's really worth a shot. There might even be one in your neighborhood...

Each piece of information costs.

Here, in CR4, at least we get them almost (your time +) free and what so more important:

in v. nice companion and pretty fast.

But You need do navigate thru many of CR4 treads to construct your own filter (to select what you need and confirm it -words of Pres. Ronald Reagan and tovarishch Josef Stalin).

Our com-padres here also fetching a lot of good humo(uk)r

Too many engineers gave their view. In my country we have 100% ceiling fans in every room and corners. Buy a Hook welded on a straignt plate 1"x6". make 2 holes, fit the hook on to the ceiling with rawal bolts. cut out a rubber strip from a cycle tube, roll it on the hook till you get 1' diameter.Fit the ceiling fan, it will have a "Y" at the end with 2 holes. fit a bolt thru and presto - your ceiling fan is installed.

You took out a bulb, its wire is there, connect it to the ceiling fan wire and now your light switch operates the fan.

Don't listen to me if your local laws do not allow.

(for rubber strips we have rubber roller 1'dia with a hole on which we fit the "Y" of the celing fan.)

Sorry read 1' as 1"(inch)