Artist in Need of Solar Theory: Search for Poor Mans Laser

Anything is <...theoretically possible...>.

• The model-making fraternity is currently being provided with a plethora of construction kits in laser-cut plywood and medium-density fibreboard. So it's equally possible with <...paper...>.

Correct, anything is "Theoretically possible" Im searching for what the theoretical possibilities are. I've worked with an Epilog Lasering Machine, They are quite large and expensive. Nor hand held.

https://www.ebay.com/itm/Focusable-High-Power-450nm-2-5W-Blue-Laser-Module-TTL-Carving-Burn-Gift-Goggles/264327687435?_trkparms=aid%3D1110006%26algo%3DHOMESPLICE.SIM%26ao%3D1%26asc%3D20131231084308%26meid%3D71a816a430f842ac85c993e5bfe7f9c4%26pid%3D100010%26rk%3D5%26rkt%3D12%26sd%3D264204042848%26itm%3D264327687435%26pmt%3D1%26noa%3D1%26pg%3D2047675%26algv%3DDefaultOrganic&_trksid=p2047675.c100010.m2109

https://www.gearbest.com/laser-engraving-machine/pp_009391499975.html?wid=1433363#goodsDetail

I bought a $30 rechargable hand held green laser point on Amazon that can burn paper. Nothing theoretical about it.

A lot of inexpensive high power green lasers are actually high power infrared lasers driving a frequency doubling crystal, and a lot of the output power is invisible infrared leakage. A danger is that safety glasses may filter out green light but allow passage of invisible infrared.

https://www.rp-photonics.com/frequency_doubling.html

"The low-cost availability of infrared (IR) diode laser modules of up to 1000 mW (1 watt) output has created a generation of IR-pumped, frequency doubled, green, blue, and violet diode-pumped solid-state laser pointers with visible power up to 300 mW. Because the invisible IR component in the beams of these visible lasers is difficult to filter out, and also because filtering it contributes extra heat which is difficult to dissipate in a small pocket "laser pointer" package, it is often left as a beam component in cheaper high-power pointers. This invisible IR component causes a degree of extra potential hazard in these devices when pointed at nearby objects and people."

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Laser_pointer

I read the poster's name as "MSDSMSDS".

I am not sure how many people have permanently "altered" their vision through concentrated light sources.

I remember a discussion we had at work once, about a colleague's laser pointer and how some thought it not very bright. However, when you can see it clearly on the ground in full daylight that sends a very clear message, you wouldn't stare at the sun so don't look at a laser. The same applies to any concentrated light source, including using magnifying glass, the reflected light can be very bright.

Thank you all but...Let me re-phrase. I’m not looking for a Laser. I’m looking to replicate a magnifying glass Focusing sunlight to burn paper, but* without the sun. How that would be “theoretically possible”

You could take a powerful white light source and magnify it down to a point, then through a series of optics, transmit that focused light into a fiber optic cable...Then run the fiber optic into a pen like writing instrument...

https://aip.scitation.org/doi/abs/10.1063/1.3658295

No matter what you call it, it's still concentrated light...and no matter how you achieve it, it's still the same thing....the only difference perhaps being the spectrum of light used...and a laser is the cheapest way to get that...other than a magnifying glass...

What type of art are you looking to produce? Like freehand drawing? structured graphic? You want a computer interface or no tech filter? or are you just looking for a new idea? Something different? Monotone portraits? Some idea of the goal might help in identifying the vehicle...perhaps you could show us some of your work...?

Thank you for the help and intrigue. Free Hand, to be able to reproduce these in a controlled environment.

That's great! This is actually an art form called pyrography...here are some video's...

https://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=burning+images+by+hand+onto+paper

Burning tools....

budget....

https://www.amazon.com/Best-Sellers-Arts-Crafts-Sewing-Wood-Burning-Tools/zgbs/arts-crafts/262717011

as good as it gets...

https://treelineusa.com/pyrography-and-woodburning-tools/#:~:text=Many%20woodburners%20(aka%20pyrographers)%20start,pyrography%20kits%20on%20the%20market.

Low powered welder? A welder has to have the current pass from the electrode to a conductive surface. If the wood were wet enough it might work temporarily, but as soon as the moisture is gone, it would cease.

You can do a "Lichtenburg burn" on wood using high voltages, such as from a neon sign transformer, but it is not a controlled burn pattern of your design, it is a fractal burn based on the internal conductivity of the wood when wet.

Artificial light does not contain sufficient energy to allow you to focus it with a lens to get any appreciable heat for burning wood. The reason a magnifying glass works with sunlight is because it contains about 1500W / sq. meter, as opposed to a150W incandescent bulb being about 15W. So maybe if you started with a 1500W light you could do it, but the heat that would come with that would make it all but impossible for you to work under it.

A laser would actually be the thing to try, with the proper safety precautions, especially for your eyesight.

Thanks. Could you elaborate More specifically on what bulb/ lamp could work with a magnifying glass and why. I have a 1000w stage lamp which couldn’t produce a burn. 1500W halogen? Incandescent? What would you be trying to reproduce At 1500W. The most powerful lamp I know of is the 5K fresnel at 5000W

There is a reason that sunlight can be focused to a point with a magnifying lens. The light from the sun is collimated, that is, the rays from the sun are all parallel (within 1/2 degree). If you are far enough away from your stage lamp for the rays to be reasonable collimated, you will be capturing only a small part of the 1000 watts.

The key to producing a burn is concentrating as much energy in as small an area as possible (energy density). A lens cannot direct the light rays to a point if they are not either parallel or emanating from a point source.

Laser light is highly collimated, and even a few watts of power can be concentrated to a tiny spot to produce a burn.

If you fabricated a 1500w lamp that collimated parallel rays. Would that work?

If you fabricated a 1500w lamp that collimated parallel rays. Would that work?

Yes, it would, but it is easier said than done. First, you need a very small source so that all the light is emerging almost from a point. You need a lens or parabolic mirror to capture as much of that light as possible and reflect or refract it into a parallel beam.

Due to the size of the source and imperfections in the optical system, the beam will not be perfectly collimated. The result is that your magnifying lens will focus the beam into a larger point than if the beam were perfectly collimated and the beam will be expanded enough that your magnifying glass will only capture a small portion of the energy. Compare the expanding beam from a searchlight to the pencil beam from a laser.

Bottom line: The Laser works much better.

Here is some information from a Wikipedia article on generating collimated light:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Collimated_beam

One drawback with using a laser is that you must use eye protection at all times...

https://blog.universalmedicalinc.com/laser-safety-glasses-the-ugly-truth-about-laser-radiation-exposure/

All it takes is a momentary reflection even if the laser is pointed away from the eyes, any shiny or reflective surface, any glass, shiny metal, crystal jewelry...so anytime you are going to use a laser of any kind, you need to put on a pair of safety glasses before you turn the laser on...and keep anybody from entering the room or in any way from coming into the area...It's the reflection that gets ya'....so yes they are dangerous, and best used in a lab setting with adequate warning signs, locked doors, and safety measures in place...

That's a good point. The advantage of using focused sunlight, from a safety standpoint, is that the rays are converging so that the high energy density "burning zone" is pretty well contained. A collimated laser beam can wreak damage or blind someone at a distance or in an unanticipated direction if it encounters a shiny surface.

An old lime light /theater spot light aimed at your magnifying glass should do.

No theoretical about it.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W6FbUiiwutQ

Just skip to later in the clip where it's actually focused, or maybe SE can do his magic and break that out.

Too dangerous to even consider...

just trying to provide an answer.

danger wasn't considered.

I was responding to the #13 JNB post about the laser array that the styro guy built(pictured)....there's no need to take the risk of using a laser when a simple burning tool can achieve better results...an assortment of tips and variable heat make them highly versatile and much more suitable for his purpose...

That pic isn't even focused yet!