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Pairing Bluetooth

01/10/2023 4:21 AM

I have 3 mobile ticket machines (Tixiom) for collecting bus fares. Each machine is in a separate bus and each is paired with a credit card machine (Sumup) via Bluetooth. When we are in the depot doing our checks we do a dummy ticket sale and often find the pairing is not with the closest Sumup. Recently we had a Sumup close to the ticket machine but the ticket machine found a Sumup in another bus about 5 metres away!

My question is can the units be too close when pairing?

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#1

Re: Pairing Bluetooth

01/10/2023 5:13 AM

Have the machined been inadvertently crossed over into the wrong buses?

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#2

Re: Pairing Bluetooth

01/10/2023 5:20 AM

The 3 units have been paired, label identified and put into different busses. Each time we want to print a ticket the ticket machine searched for a Sumup card reader before asking for the credit card. Sometimes it can not find it. I am wondering if the units are too close and not allowing signal propogation.

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#3
In reply to #2

Re: Pairing Bluetooth

01/10/2023 9:25 AM

..."Also, if the Bluetooth devices are in close proximity to a Wi-Fi transmitting device (router), this can cause interference and other performance issues. As with any RF device, as you get closer, the signal strength intensifies."....

..."Many Wi-Fi routers transmit on multiple channels simultaneously, and if there are excessive Wi-Fi signals in close proximity taking up most of the spectrum, your Bluetooth devices may not have any open spectrum to frequency hop to. This is a common cause of Bluetooth interference. Moving your Bluetooth devices away from Wi-Fi signals will help maximize the performance. Additionally, it is recommended to configure your Wi-Fi devices to allow for sharing the limited spectrum for all your wireless devices."...

https://www.audio-technica.com/en-us/support/audio-solutions-question-of-the-week-what-causes-bluetooth-interference/#:~:text=Also%2C%20if%20the%20Bluetooth%20devices,closer%2C%20the%20signal%20strength%20intensifies.

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#4

Re: Pairing Bluetooth

01/10/2023 12:55 PM

The units are in buses parked in the middle of nowhere and there is no Wi-Fi connection. Sometimes the ticket machine does not find the Sumup and when it goes to find another unit, the ticket machine finds the Sumup which it did not find initially.

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#5
In reply to #4

Re: Pairing Bluetooth

01/10/2023 1:38 PM
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#8
In reply to #5

Re: Pairing Bluetooth

01/13/2023 7:11 AM

There it is - a phone number. Problem solved!

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#10
In reply to #8

Re: Pairing Bluetooth

01/13/2023 9:49 AM

We don't know that the problem has been solved at all....It's likely the op has gained some insight as to how the system operates...he might just be having connection problems, it could be any number of things hindering smooth operation...

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#13
In reply to #10

Re: Pairing Bluetooth

01/14/2023 4:54 PM

I would question whether the bluetooth connection is even necessary, the buses should be uploading to the cloud and the other device should be downloading from the cloud...If the devices are using a dial-up connection, there would be a delay probably, and that's with a good connection....if you are in an area with weak cellular signal then this problem would be understandable...even if the wifi is satellite based this could still be the case...it seems to me a configuration review is needed...What we have here is a failure to communicate....

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#14
In reply to #13

Re: Pairing Bluetooth

01/14/2023 5:13 PM

Bluetooth connectivity I believe is, and should only takes place between paired devices, which means that iCloud is probably not possible.

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#15
In reply to #14

Re: Pairing Bluetooth

01/14/2023 6:20 PM

This system is cloud based architecture, not icloud...

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#16
In reply to #15

Re: Pairing Bluetooth

01/14/2023 9:57 PM

I don't have any idea how the cloud system architecture got to do with a low power communication protocol, like the Bluetooth that requires the pairing of 2 devices only..

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#17
In reply to #16

Re: Pairing Bluetooth

01/15/2023 1:12 AM

see #3

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#21
In reply to #17

Re: Pairing Bluetooth

01/15/2023 9:40 AM

Yes I can understand that Bluetooth signal can at times be found riding along with a WiFi to extend the signal hopping range capability which is also dependent upon on the latest Bluetooth version being used.

I can appreciate if the WiFi is the WWW internet connection equivalent type?

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#22
In reply to #21

Re: Pairing Bluetooth

01/15/2023 3:36 PM
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#23
In reply to #22

Re: Pairing Bluetooth

01/15/2023 4:01 PM

...". Ad hoc mode refers to devices communicating directly with each other, without communicating with an access point.

A service set is the set of all the devices associated with a particular Wi-Fi network. Devices in a service set need not be on the same wavebands or channels. A service set can be local, independent, extended, mesh, or a combination.

Each service set has an associated identifier, a 32-byte service set identifier (SSID), which identifies the network. The SSID is configured within the devices that are part of the network.

A basic service set (BSS) is a group of stations that share the same wireless channel, SSID, and other settings that have wirelessly connected, usually to the same access point.[34]: 3.6  Each BSS is identified by a MAC address called the BSSID."....

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#18
In reply to #13

Re: Pairing Bluetooth

01/15/2023 8:38 AM

WOW ! That brings back memories.Haven't heard that is a long time.Thanks!

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#19
In reply to #13

Re: Pairing Bluetooth

01/15/2023 8:50 AM

Unfortunately we are not in a position to choose the connection between the units as there is also the connection to tracking so that passengers are able to see where the buses are and how long in time they are likely to arrive.

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#12
In reply to #4

Re: Pairing Bluetooth

01/14/2023 10:42 AM

The air environment are full of RF signals and WiFi and Bluetooth are just a tiny portion of them..

The Bluetooth for one happens to share its operating frequency with the WiFi frequencies, which can complicate your Bluetooth connection problem especially when the Bluetooth paired devices are far apart..

Since the distance of the Bluetooth signal is very limited, it can easily be overwhelmed interfered and further be attenuated by the surrounding environment where the device is installed and located..

Which means that the sensitivity and selectivity of your devices need to be considered as well aside from the above mentioned conditions..

Good luck!

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#6

Re: Pairing Bluetooth

01/10/2023 3:17 PM

To Solar Eagle; My grey hair is blurring my technology or lack of. Thank you for the links.

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#7
In reply to #6

Re: Pairing Bluetooth

01/10/2023 7:27 PM

Yes it's a constant struggle, about the time you figure it out they upgrade to a newer system and it starts all over again...that's the nature of the beast...

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#9

Re: Pairing Bluetooth

01/13/2023 8:47 AM

A couple thoughts come to mind...

Maybe the metal frame of the bus is causing dead spots where one or both of the devices are located. Also, perhaps the signal directionality and the orientation is a problem. Can the devices be rotated or moved to see if the situation improves?

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#11
In reply to #9

Re: Pairing Bluetooth

01/14/2023 9:44 AM

I agree.There may be blind spots created by the metal frame of the bus or other objects in certain directions,similar to dead zones directly under cellphone towers.

It is worth trying to rearrange the buses to see if this helps.

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#20

Re: Pairing Bluetooth

01/15/2023 8:52 AM

Do you use a Bluetooth hub?

Your question might be better directed to Sumup at

https://help.sumup.com/en-US/articles/5PxqqqFaTlKkH4ABSYSbv5-sumup-pro-setup-guide

With thousands of users, I am sure this is a common problem for which they have experience and answers.

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#24

Re: Pairing Bluetooth

01/15/2023 4:24 PM

Dear Contributors,

Thank you for your replies with myinitial post. I am a little out of my depth with this as I thought there may be a simple answer. I will try to phone the respective support units of the ticket machine and Sumup tomorrow, Monday, and will come back with my findings. I was not anticipating the Bluetooth connection being far more involved and using Wi-Fi. When I am in the middle of a trading estate with no access to any buildings I gave little thought to external connectivity. The Tixiom is obviously making a "telephone" call to the blue yonder and responding to the Sumup. I thought it was the Tixiom talking directly to the Sumup.

Anyway, I hopefully will gain a better understanding when I speak to both providers.

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#25

Re: Pairing Bluetooth

01/18/2023 5:39 AM
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#26
In reply to #25

Re: Pairing Bluetooth

01/18/2023 6:11 PM

That is a great accomplishment. Many will appreciate that function. I wonder what the top end is. It's a form of modulation. Would it be AM modulation? Would it have sidebands? The modulating power is not mixed or beat with the carrier power.

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#27

Re: Pairing Bluetooth

01/18/2023 7:28 PM

Imagine some possibilities with this film. Let's put it on a 1 megacycle AM broadcast tower. The steady carrier would always have the same power input to antenna. Then we modulate the film with a microphone. What would the receiver see? Would there be any information? Sidebands to beat with? The emission has already left the antenna, and then modulated. Or if the film is not appealing intellectually, then put a tube of film around the antenna. One might slot the tube for directionality. Or paint an antenna for directionality.

And it might be a good idea for all of us.

I put in fiber and whole house wifi about two years ago. Since then the number of strong wifi signals has grown by dozens. It's un-real to see so many that are just as strong as here at the house. We quit trying bluetooth. My wifi alone could cover several households. And apparently everybody else could too. It's a real cluster.

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