ceramic tile and moisture

Most older slab built houses do not have a proper vapour barrier. The ceramic is not causing the problem, however, the trapped excess moisture will increase the soil gasses. The soil gasses will pass directly through the slab and ceramic tiles. This will cause serious health problems.

Recommend you use an active sub-slab de-pressurization system, used to clear radon gas as described on the bottom of this link

Will these soil gasses make the tile stink and other things in the home? The smell is noticed when I open the doors. The home is 14 years old. Should it have a moisture or vapor barrier?

Yes these soil gasses can make everything stink. The soil gases originate from decaying biomass, mold, etc., as well as any chemical reactions of all the minerals and the water.

Even though your slab is hard it is very porous to gasses and moisture.

Today the standard is to have everything sealed, vapour barrier, etc., as well as proper drainage around the house. This should prevent moisture from getting under the house. Once it is trapped, It must be ventilated out, or your health will be compromised.

I do not know what the building code in your area was 14 years ago.

I live in Oklahoma. Who do you contact to have soil tested or get help?

This company, Standard Testing and Engineering Company, should be able to help solve your problem.

There is also possibility that mold is present under the tile, and the grout is not as waterproof as the tile itself. One good indicator of mold is the color of the grout, unless it was black to start with. Is it discolored?

It is discolored somewhat but is 10 years old or more. We have lived here for 9 years and I can not say it has changed. I have been scrubbing the grout and sealed it last week,

What is "unusual rain"?

We live in a real dry area of the state of Oklahoma. Last spring we received unusual amount of rainfall that people have not seen in years. It rained through June which is usually bone dry.

Hello iowa1010,

whether the tiling is indoors or out, if the tiles are bedded on Portland cement, or a mixture of sand and cement, as usually used on a kitchen floor there should be no worries about any moisture and therefore smell. Even if you are talking of dirty or sewer 'water', the usual 20mm thick kitchen type tile bedded as above can be wiped and disinfected, and will be as good as new, that is provided there is no break in the 'pointing', or as you may know the 'grouting' between the tiles or between tiles and a wall. Even if you find a broken pointing line, the use of a small pointed chisel can be used to chip the pointing away until you find a 'sound' or good portion. Renew the bit removed and point it smooth and all will be fine.

However, if you are talking about thin bathroom type tiles, you can remove them, soak them in plain water, and you will then be able to scrape-off the adhesive. leave the tiles to dry, ideally in a warm place for a few days. In the mean time clean the wall and if the plaster is wet and has had dirty or sewer water on it, remove to just above the damage and re-plaster. I would recommend leaving any re-tiling with the thin bathroom type tiles be put on hold until the concrete base and the wall is completely dry. Sometimes, if the water just makes the wall wet, and is clean, you can leave the plaster to dry. You may find a 'bloom' after the plaster dries. Wipe the off with DRY cloth. The 'bloom is a natural product and is actually salts coming out of the plaster as it dries. Of course you will not be able to see this if the wall is painted with water based paint. But you will see if the wall is wet, even if it is painted. In which case as the plaster dries the bloom may push the paint off. This is not important at all. Just use a fine grade sandpaper to remove the flaky or dusty paint. They you can replace the tiles using waterproof grouting and waterproof tile cement.

If the only damage is what appears to be mould, and the wall seems dry behind the wall tiles, scrape the thin grouting off the surface only, down to clean grout, and regrout with waterproof grout.

I am a builder and though it has taken a lot of space here, is is really very strait forward and obvious to do. And, is exactly what I have done and would do.

Hope this helps.

jfmfit

Another possible source of smell could be storm rain flooding sewers, backing them up and bringing foul water and its contents into or under your house......I hope that is not the case for you.

Without reading any of the previous responses, yes, that moisture can foster growth of mold - mildew - fungus and these can have distinct bad odors. Not just that they smell bad, they do, but also bad for your health. Some produce spores that you might be allergic to. Some produce chemical compounds (the smells are part of this) that are unhealthful when inhaled. Often this will require professional treatment.

who do you contact to see if this is the problem?

Hello iowa1010,

I am not putting anyone down, but you seem to be focusing your questions on post # 10. Who had not read any of the posts and is therefore trying to tell you something with no ref' to any of your replies. In short he does not know what he is talking about, and seems to be basing his assumptions on mould growing indoors, and its smell. Mould outdoors usually does not smell and is kept in check by the sun and rain washes it off. If however, there is mould on the concrete slab.......on the concrete itself, a scrub with Bleach will kill it and any other growth like moss.

You say you moved there is it 9 or 11 years ago? Unless it was an industrial site, or a rubbish dump, you should not be worried about any 'soil gases' that have been mentioned in other posts. Ordinary soil sub-base foundation is completely natural and does not smell..................... If you are worried about Radon, which is given off from Granite, you can search for a radon Map of the Country and, bring things down to where you live. I would have thought any Agents 'search' of the area around your home as is done before any Serveyer before you bought it, would have said if it is a Radon area. A good portion of the UK, which is where I live, has a base foundation of Radon. My sister lives in Cornwall and, Cornwall and Devon are well known Radon areas. When she was looking for a house all the house details were given to her, including the fact it was a known Radon area.

Radon, in my opinion is nothing to worry about. Most of our Royal Family live on Radon areas, because the castles etc need to be built on a solid base and there is little as solid as Granite, which is a Radon producer.

I think you do not need to worry about Radon, most people in huge areas of the UK do not have a choice anyway, so just accept it, or do not realise there area is a Radon producer.

You did not give many details but, if the water from the flood was likely to be 'dirty or from a sewer, there is nothing much you can do to have stopped the flow which may have run into your house. (You do not say if there was intrusion?) If all is back to normal regarding the weather and the outside area around the slab is dry, you can dig a shallow ditch all round the slab, which needs to be only a small spade width, and fill is with aggregate up to normal soil level. Although you cannot see it this will act as a type of flood channel to redirect any normal amount of water round and, not through your property.

Things you can do to stop any intrusion of water is to have any 'air-vents' several feet above the 'water-table'. In the UK you can now buy a type of mini dam which is made from wooden boards which slot into a metal and rubber slide fitted either side of and external door, low window etc. When it floods you slide the usually 4x1 inch boards into the slides. They lock with T & G (tongue and groove) and the pressure of the water itself pushes the boards against the back part of the slides and stops most water from flooding through your home.

I hope this helps and stops any unnecessary worry.

jfmfit

"...post # 10. Who had not read any of the posts and is therefore trying to tell you something with no ref' to any of your replies. In short he does not know what he is talking about, and seems to be basing his assumptions on mould growing indoors..."

I'm not trying to put anyone down either, but I'd like to clarify a few points. First, my comment about not having read any of the previous 9 posts was more by way of apologizing if mine was at all repetitive (which it turned out not to be). Second, as an environmental biologist, I believe I DO know what I'm talking about on this issue. A Clorox scrub would only help with surficial mold, but is unlikely to kill anything growing under the tile.

"...you should not be worried about any 'soil gases' that have been mentioned..."

Here, I concur. Unless it was in fact built on an old trash dump, soil gas ought not be a concern. That definitely includes radon, which, as you noted, forms in granitic rock from decay of radionucleides as daughter species. No part of Oklahoma that I am aware of (and I used to live there) is underlain by granite.

"...if the water from the flood was likely to be 'dirty or from a sewer..."

And again, I think we mostly agree - no flood water can be considered clean. Even if all it flows through is a pasture, all of the cattle grazing, or even deer browsing, in that pasture have left cow flops that will be transported in solution into any spaces in/under the floor. Fertilizer for that mold I mentioned.

"...dig a shallow ditch all round the slab, which needs to be only a small spade width, and fill is with aggregate..."

Concur again, such a French drain will prevent recurrence. But it won't remove the miasmatic stinks the previous flood initiated. Again I say, contact a local service provider, Stanley Steemer, Service Master, Clean Pro, even Merry Maids might be able to help. But if in fact the tile was undercut and has mold growing under it, short of ripping it up, you'll need some professional-strength cleaning happening soon. Some forms of mold (most notorious is a variety of species called 'black mold') can have serious adverse health effects.

If there is no way to get rid of the stink, then ripping up the tile and replacing with something else will not resolve the problem. I have had service master to my home twice. They could not find any moisture in walls. I have laminate flooring that I believe contributes to the problem. We are pulling it up. I just don't want to start tearing thing up if it is a losing battle.

WOW! I am sorry to say that I am officially out of ideas. If what has already been discussed is not the source, I'd have to be there to do anything more. I don't recall you describing what the odor is? Musty/organic like forest floor soil? Acrid/chemical like decomposing adhesives/solvents? Metallic like rusting iron? Similar to a toilet or septic overflow? Apparently it is strong and distinctive (distinktive?) enough or it wouldn't be such a problem.

The smell around parts of my house under trim is musty. The smell in or under tile, water and counters in my kitchen that seems to activate when I open the door is a different smell. It is verrrrry putred(spelling?), sour smell that is distinct. Not like any of your 3 choices. I thought it was like a sewer smell, but our sewer lines are fine and all traps, garbage disposal are sparkling clean. Our vents are fine as well. When my house, which can be drafty, is closed up, I do not smell this smell, only musty odors when I bend down and smell under trim. Opening the door seems to bring the smell out. I have vents on the roof and use vents in kitchen and bathrooms.

Check out the company I mentioned in post #15 . They should be able to diagnose the problem whatever it is.

I called them and they had no answers for me but to go to dr fungus site which does not help at all.

Wow that is extreemly un-professional.

I found these sites

http://www.localmoldremediation.com/Oklahoma

http://www.restorationsos.com/

http://snowbearrestorations.com/mold-mitigation-and-remediation

http://oklahoma_city-ok.yellowusa.com/Fire_and_Water_Damage_Restoration.html

Surely, one of these will be able to help.

Is there a crawl space where something could have gotten in and then died there?

no crawl space

Damnit, boy! It just gets harder...what about squirrels in the attic? Say no attic, and I'll have to start wondering what was buried in the ground before the house was built...

Hello iowa1010,

I forgot to mention there is a simple method to find the 'water table' in your area. That is how high the water is usually not including heavy rains.

If you have a river or lake nearby, that is your water table height. If your house is on a flood-plain the water table could be as little as a few inches below your ground level where the slab sits. But when I have built houses I would always put the house at least a yard above the water table.

If you do not understand please ask.

jfmfit