Can a Software Problem Ruin a Laptop?

It certainly sounds like its unfit for purpose, and you should demand a refund or replacement with an equivalent model...

Did I see that you were in the UK? most large companies will replace or repair at their option, a refund is possible especially if you bought it on-line and recently, where the 'distance selling of goods' act is in force.

NO.... don't let them tell you the software is at fault - that's just hogwash.... It sounds like it has a problem which they can't understand...

Could be the BIOS? but as that's supplied with the machine its up to them to sort out!!

John.

Hello Joe.Bath

Insist firmly on a full refund.

<"......."re-seated the power supply".......">

What a lot of rot.

They have no idea what the trouble is, are just guessing, and hope you will go away.

If an incompetent technician cannot locate and repair the fault, the excuse is always "Software Conflicts", but you should accept nothing less than a total refund, plus costs of getting the laptop to/from them, if necessary.

Kind Regards....

Like John and Sparky have said, send this piece of **** back to base. It doesn't' do what you paid for. It would be interesting to know what the problem is, but leave that one to them. Apart from demanding back your money, which it sounds like you have every right to do, take some solace in the fact that we can all learn a little from your bad trip with this one. Under UK law you could certainly get the cash back, possibly even from a credit card company if you purchased that way, and there's no dire time imperative. Keep all transaction receipts, and make a note of all phone calls.

It is just not right!

Ask for a full refund of all costs incurred.

Just as a little extra perhaps a few CR4 contributors could write emails of complaint to the supplier to make them aware of the damage to their reputation this problem is causing.

BAB

Great idea!

Pretty happy with ACER, I have my 4th ACER laptop in 10 or 12 years. I put a lot of miles / vibration on. ACER #2 had a sometimes problem which required reseating the hard drive, sometimes after being thru -30F days. It went back for repair a couple times, the two I have now have been OK. One about three months ago started doing what you described as the shutdown without reason. So maybe Microsoft changed something that has started a conflict ? I run Win XP Pro on both laptops, still have the old timers and they run yet also.

Sometimes the unknown shutdown occurs at night when my anti-virus softwares do auto runs, maybe they are interacting, had up to 5 anti-virus softwares at the same time, but they started eliminating each other.

Thanks. However, I am not talking about "shutting down" I am talking about totally "breaking down". All power goes. There is no way to start the computer. Is this possibly a software problem? I am never heard of anything like it. Especially with the history of this machine!

The fact that the motherboard was replaced would indicate that the only code resident on the machine at that point was the code that was loaded by the manufacturer / seller. Assuming you haven't loaded any code since the "repair" there is absolutely no way that this is a software problem. If it was the software could be reloaded and the problem fixed.

It sounds much more like a power supply problem. They owe you a refund.

Replacing a motherboard does not change any code other than the OS ROM. All the programs and data, good, bad, or indifferent, remain on the hard drive. The symptoms described indicate a problem in the power regulation/control system - definitely a hardware problem that should be solved by Acer or its subsidiaries.

I agree with the others here. A faulty software could not destroy a laptop. Make it operate in a strange manner? Yes. Make it crash? Yes. Make it just really difficult? Yes. But render it completely useless? No way. Just re-image the machine and start again.

"Re-seated a power supply" and "replaced a motherboard." Wow, I understand the motive, but apparently it did nothing. I will modify a term that is popular stateside and say "Shade Tree Computer Technicians" are at fault here. We use that term to describe auto "mechanics" who just keep replacing parts until the automobile is repaired or the customer is financially ruined-usually both.

Demand your rights here, and the best of luck to you.

Best Regards,

Ing. Robert Forbus

I think we have to get a little more specific here. Running end-user software can not hurt a computer, lap top or otherwise. Applying new BIOS (which is software) incorrectly or degrading the CMOS can damage a system.

That's not the case here. "They reseated the power supply and replaced the mother board. This happened 3 times."

Sounds more like a fault in the connection between the built-in screen and the motherboard. I would demand a new system. Lightly mark the back of the screen in one of the corners so you know you've got a new screen. Also copy down all serial numbers: hard disk, Dvd combo drive and memory.

If it's still coming back DOA, get in touch with a consumer advocacy agency (Better Business Bureau, etc.) and make some noise.

Please keep us posted.

Orpheuse

I think I'd be inclined to try to get Acer to resolve this:-

http://www.acer.co.uk/public/page11.do?sp=page11&UserCtxParam=0&GroupCtxParam=0&dctx1=17&CountryISOCtxParam=UK&LanguageISOCtxParam=en&ctx3=-1&ctx4=United+Kingdom&crc=3268984370

If they can't apply pressure to their reseller I'd hope that they would want to support you themselves.

LOL Randall, that's a funny page....

Its the first time I've seen a map with North to the right of the map as opposed to straight up to the top!!!

John. (Maybe that's why they can't tell their ar*e from their elbow?)

Well Chaps and Chapesses

Interesting developments. Natasha from easycomputers phoned to say "don't accept the computer when it arrives". She wants me to send it back to her directly so that she can organise a full refund once she has a replacement laptop supplied by Acer.

One problem with this is that they delivered to the wrong address!

And not only that. There is another problem. Being that I was not at the wrong address (since I am at the address from which they collected it a couple of days ago and to which Natasha knew it had to be returned), went against everything they promised and LEFT IT WITH A NEIGHBOUR THAT I DO NOT KNOW!! This is a £1000 laptop we're talking about. As it happens, it's not worth more than the cost of the individual bits in it, but that's hardly the point.

At least easycomputers are being consistent from start to finish - consistently inefficient.

And then there is the second bit of good news (although it simply thickens the plot).

I had a phonecall from an Angela at Acer Computers saying that a senior manager had instructed her to contact me on the phone to arrange the return of the laptop so she could give me a full refund.

Left hand not knowing what right hand is doing?

Anyway, I think that the comments and assistance you have given has had some effect (on both links I created for this problem - one as a general question about law and bad products/service, and the other on the more specific question of whether a software problem can cause total failure of a laptop.

I will keep you all informed of the progress and just want to thank you for th brilliant support and advice that you have given.

Power to the people. Long live CR4!

Joe

Sounding good (in parts any way) keep us informed eh?

John.

I will be delighted to keep you informed. So pleased that people are willing to help in situations like this.

Thanks again.

Joe

I had exactly this problem with Dell when they first came out with their laptop series, right down to Dell shipping my laptop to Massachuesetts while I was living in Florida and where the machine originated.

I have never bought another Dell product since, and that was 20 years ago, even though Dell has improved it's organization significantly since then.

Don't feel too bad. Most of us have had an experience like this at least once in our life time.

Stay calm: I know how hard that is when they are playing with your money. Solve the problems step by step - this will keep you from going into overwhelm and melting down with ire.

When YOU pick up the laptop from the neighbor you don't know, bring a small cake to say thank you.

Deal with one and only one person at Acer - as you said in your post, the right hand doesn't know what the left hand is doing so make it simple for them to get you your money back.

Sorry for your aggrivation. Keep us posted.

Orpheuse

That's good advice about getting hold of one person. Nine time out of ten, if you can reach one person and get the message across the problem will get sorted. A little bit of polite chat can do the trick. I have a Dell which works fine, but feeling fiendish one day I pushed the thing. It was a software fault and entirely my own doing. Somehow I screwed it so bad that the factory reset sequence wouldn't even work. I hadn't purchased the installation discs, but a short chat with a nice woman at Del and hey-presto ; I got a box full of all the discs to get it back up and running.

The point you mentioned earlier about marking the screen was another good one. I read of a report not long ago that was similar to this case. The unlucky customer was getting completely different (and still faulty) goods returned. As you say, it's worth making sure you can recognize all the parts, not just the ones with serial numbers.

Quite a few years back, my dad had bought some kind of electronic toy for one of the kids. It died and he was about to take it back to the shop, but then he noticed that the distributors were just as near. He took the thing over to them and explained; 5 minutes later he's walking away with a new one. As far as I can recall, it was just the 1 in 10000 that had a fault, so the distributors were more than happy to supply a new one. Probably the best $200 advertising they ever spent.

Incorrect software can ruin electronic chips.

Some rewritable rom or flash memory may have a high but finite number of rewrites available. An incorrect branch or loop can use this in seconds.

I think you should ask Acer what the exact problem is and then ask the software people to check their code.

Hello Pompie

Asking ACER to check their code, just ensures the continuation of the Sales Contract.

What the ex-owner needs, is a total refund.

Kind Regards....

You do have a possibly valid point, but a really long shot!

In seconds, I don't think so. In my experience, rewriting an EEPROM once takes seconds, not nanoseconds like RAM. At something on the order of 100k rewrites, That would take on the order of a day or a few of nothing but continuous rewrites to destroy the unit .

I must admit that the vast majority of my experience is with Macs, and it's conceivable that other computers are different, but I've only done even a second firmware update once (when something screwed up the first attempt), much less multiple times.

I can't even imagine a hacker writing such a destructive loop, because then they could not make any use of your machine or data!

Maybe I am a bit wild with seconds. but that is what they told me.

I was asked to look at the program on a PIC. Two labels were almost identical (save1 and savel) and he used the wrong one in a loop.

I believe EXEBUG did destroy hardware. A CRT by switching the enable / disable crt power fast.

Yes, in a PIC or PLC the program (essentially the operating system extended) is stored in an EEPROM, so that would be possible...

Of course it's possible for a computer to destroy external stuff; I understand that many of the IEDs in Iraq use cellphones (which are essentially computers) for detonation. They certainly use computers to time the explosions when large buildings are being torn down...

I have a feeling that they will never respond because of a simple reason (admittedly conjecture on my part) - viz. they are lying in the first place.

Hello again, Joe.Bath

As an old teacher of mine used to say: "Lying like a flatfish".

Kind Regards....

I'd better get my skates on then and expose their fishy dealings...

Hi Joe.Bath

Your question was ¨is it possible for ¨ and it is. Acer should receive some benefit of the doubt.

But you need to be satisfied . The best would be to take them on where It can hurt the most (customers).

Here in South Africa we have a Customer service website at http:/www.hellopeter.com where customers can complain or praise and the company may answer as well. Try them they seems to operate worldwide.

Power to the People!

Thanks Pompie. I have registered on Hellopeter .com and will await their confirmatory email to leave a comment.

I note that some SA Acer customers have got pretty hot under the collar about Acer's build quality and customer service.

Just a quickie, Pompie. Is it possible, though, for a computer to fail while it is simply turned on without any user interference simply because of a software issue?

Could I be held responsible for this if I have not even added anything to the laptop or even used it since it last was returned to me?

I need plain English explanations of how it's possible, because I am not too knowledgeable about highly technical computer language.

RESULT:

Ladies and Gentlemen....

We have won! £954.85 refunded directly in to my debit card. Total refund.

This is thanks to all of you for your great support and advice. You gave me enough confidence to keep on believing that I was in the right and they were in the wrong.

The refund has come from Easy Computers (laptopsdirect.co.uk) although Acer UK themselves did kindly offer to refund me (but only the value of the laptop itself and not the additional warranty, case, software etc).

So I can confirm that "elbow on the counter diplomacy" works.

It took something like 50 emails, 10 phonecalls and three letters to Acer and/or East Computers, a Computer Magazine Editor and Trading Standards to get it sorted, but it did in the end. And I am delighted that people power is alive and well.

Thanks again and let me know if any of you ever need help with such a problem - I have become slightly longer in the tooth now...

Joe

Woof, woof ! That's fantastic news. I'm delighted for you; it's an absolute pleasure when I read a thread here and see someone has got a 'result'. Excellent ! Happy smiles to ya, and good on the companies involved for coming to their senses.