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Short Circuit Calculations

05/21/2008 7:32 AM

What's the role of short circuit level in calculation of cable sizing and selection of power cables and by which method short circuit current is calculated.

Can anybody help me please in this regard

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Guru
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#1

Re: Short Circuit Calculations

05/21/2008 8:02 AM

It is to ensure that the cable can withstand without damage the momentary pulse of heat that is dissipated prior to the circuit protective device disconnecting the short circuit current.

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#2
In reply to #1

Re: Short Circuit Calculations

05/21/2008 8:31 AM

FOR MINIMUM SIZE CABLE SELECTION, WHTHER SHORT CIRCUIT LEVEL OF BUSBAR IS CONSIDERED OR THE TOTAL LOAD OF THE SYSTEM?

IS THERE ANYBODY TO CLEAR MY CONFUSION?

THANX

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Guru
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#3
In reply to #2

Re: Short Circuit Calculations

05/21/2008 7:41 PM

Hello naleghari271@hotmail.com

PWSlack actually answered your Question, in the above Posted reply.

Please remember that the use of CAPITALS in an Internet Forum, is the same as shouting at the reader, and is considered to be not good manners.

Now, as to your Question....

Your choice of cable is related to the total load expected, with the requirement that the cable must be able to withstand the (PSC = Prospective Short Circuit) current at the point of electrical supply.

The Electrical Engineer of the Electrical Distribution Authority (The Electrical Supplier) is normally able to advise the PSC at your cable connecting point, where you connect to the electrical supply.

Example: There would be no point in having an installation with a rated load of 2MVA, a Switchboard/Busbar rated PSC of 30MVA, and a supply cable with rated PSC of 5MVA, if the Supply point rated PSC was 10MVA, because if there was a major fault at the switchboard busbars, the supply cable would explode, if the supply point OCB/ACB or fuses failed to disconnect in time.

Does that assist you?

Please advise further

Kind Regards....

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#4
In reply to #3

Re: Short Circuit Calculations

05/22/2008 12:50 AM

Thanks for your detailed reply.

Is the Prospective Short Circuit Current, total load of the system conected to the busbar/switchgear or its the short circuit level of the busbar/switchgear.

Example. Short circuit Level of busbar is 70 KA and total load connected to the busbar, is 5 MW. For minimum cable size slection, which figure should i consider, whether 70 KA, or Current related to 5 MW in the following formula for minimum cable size selection.

I=224A(ln(.........).

Which value of I should I consider to calculate A.

Thanx

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Guru
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#5
In reply to #4

Re: Short Circuit Calculations

05/22/2008 3:32 AM

Hello again, naleghari271@hotmail.com

You have given some figures in your above reply.

You have omitted to state the Supply Voltage.

Is this a class or homework Question?

Please reply, with

Kind Regards

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#6
In reply to #5

Re: Short Circuit Calculations

05/22/2008 3:37 AM

Its MV switchgear, u can say 6 to 11 kv is ur supply

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Guru
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#7
In reply to #6

Re: Short Circuit Calculations

05/22/2008 4:04 AM

Hello again, naleghari271@hotmail.com

You need to give a fixed Voltage, not a <".....6 to 11 kv is ur supply">

You omitted to answer my question: Is this a Class or Homework Question?

Please reply, with correct answers.

You could also advise your location (Do that in your Profile), because your location may have a bearing on your local Regulations, Insurance Requirements, etc.

Kind Regards....

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#8
In reply to #7

Re: Short Circuit Calculations

05/22/2008 4:50 AM

for MV 6 kv

This is a project of cable reengineering at which i m working

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#19
In reply to #8

Re: Short Circuit Calculations

01/03/2023 9:35 AM

Consult an appropriate Mentor at the facility.

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#9
In reply to #4

Re: Short Circuit Calculations

05/22/2008 4:10 PM

The simple answer is both the maximum normal current and the short-circuit current need to be considered. Obviously the cable and bus work should be sized to handle both (including the mechanical forces generated when if the fault current occurs). Fault current handling capability of any cable screens will also need to be taken into consideration, as will upstream and downstream protection devices that are protecting the cable and buswork (fuses, circuit breakers, fault limiting transformers, etc).

I am a little concerned that you are asking this question. You can obtain more data on cable selection and fault current rating from cable manufacturer's website.

I get a little twitchy about posts like this as even if someone gives you the right answer there is no guarantee that the system will be implemented correctly, possibly causing loss of life and property (given everything I know about you so far, which isn't much, I cannot in all good conscience consider you competent to perform this work).

Sorry but the best you are going to get from me is some pointers on what to look at, the rest you really need to learn for yourself. What if someone here gave you the wrong data, would you know?

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#10
In reply to #9

Re: Short Circuit Calculations

05/22/2008 6:40 PM

Hello jack of all trades

I have given you a GA point for your good answer.

It appears the question asker is out of his depth.

He has not bothered to answer my questions properly, and still we do not know location of site, which is quite important from local requirements and Regulations also Insurance reasons.

Kind Regards....

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#11
In reply to #10

Re: Short Circuit Calculations

05/22/2008 8:02 PM

Sizing busbar for current and cables for fault rating seem to be very common questions here.

People can find CR4 but they don't seem to be able to find any of the numerous cable sizing guides on the internet.

??????

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#13
In reply to #4

Re: Short Circuit Calculations

05/23/2008 3:43 PM

The selection of suitable cable for any electrical system is the basic job of electrical engineer and a qualifying requirement for carrying out electrical job as per any safety standards. This type of thread is often seen in CR4 and I feel either the people putting up the thread are with out basic technical knowledge or people want a simple answer to attend an interview question. The proper answer to a cable selection or bus bar selection is so elaborate that it needs a minimum of one week's refresher course. Designing any electrical distribution network and electrical switchboard panel is real technical job and not amateur's job as it involves safety of the people operating the system and equipments. Providing a simple formula or calculated figure is improper as the value depend on various parameters. A basic parameters for selection of cable and factors to be considered are listed below .

  1. The cable should be rated for the correct voltage rating and size of conductor.
  2. The selection of normal current rating will depend on temperature rise on normal conditions. This will depend on :-

(i) The ambient temperature of the location where the cable is laid .

(ii) The type of laying of the cable viz. underground, on cable tray, in air ,in duct etc. each condition has its own de rating factors.

(iii) The type of cable XLPE, PVC, PILC, FRLS etc and material of conductor (Copper, Aluminum). Armored, unarmored

(iv) The type of industry and load chemical, engineering, fixed load , varying load,

(v) The length of cable and depth of lying

(vi) System of back up protection and tripping time delay.

3. Short circuit rating of the conductor

The principle involved here is that the cable selected should withstand the short circuit current with out temperature rise or damage till the time the protective device like fuse ,MCB, MCCB , ACB , OCB, VCB etc. operate to disconnect the faulty system from the mains.

In India we follow the recommendation of IS 3691-1967 Part I, III, III, IV, and V Similar standards are followed in all countries which will provide the required data to select the cable.

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#14
In reply to #13

Re: Short Circuit Calculations

05/23/2008 5:57 PM

Hello V.I.Abraham

From me for your well-explained Post.

Kind Regards....

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#15
In reply to #13

Re: Short Circuit Calculations

05/30/2008 10:27 AM

Very well answered Sir but there is a huge demand of engineers world wide but world is short of experienced knowledgable engineers. These questions are from the people who want to give atlease safe results so that nothing goes wrong. Please help people like these.

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#12

Re: Short Circuit Calculations

05/23/2008 3:09 AM

Short circuit calculation are required to define the size of the cable in order that the maximum temperature which can damage the insulation is not exceeded this temperature is different for XPLE or PVC.

Method of calculation is always the same adding geometrically the impedance from the source up to the S/C point.

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#16

Re: Short Circuit Calculations

07/13/2009 1:15 PM

better consider motor contribution for sc study

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#17

Re: Short Circuit Calculations

05/10/2010 4:43 AM

WHAT IS FORMULA OF FIND OUT OF K.A IN THE BUSBAR,CIRCUIT BREKAR ALSO FORMULA FOR CT VA CALCULATION

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#18
In reply to #17

Re: Short Circuit Calculations

05/14/2010 11:59 AM

Simply stated the three phase sc current is source voltage (ph-n)/source impedance.

ct va is a bit complex depending on a number of factors.

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Anonymous Poster (3); jack of all trades (2); Jans (2); naleghari271@hotmail.com (4); PWSlack (2); Sparkstation (5); V.I.Abraham (1)

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