Previous in Forum: Vectran Fiber Sample   Next in Forum: Chromium-Plated Steel
Close
Close
Close
15 comments
Commentator

Join Date: May 2008
Location: The only place where hell can really freeze over.....Michigan
Posts: 63
Good Answers: 3

Stainless Steel vs. Carbon Steel

01/19/2010 1:47 PM

I have been given the glorious task of performing a cost reduction study on a current part that is made from stainless steel (303 and 440). I have been asked to reduce the cost by making it from carbon steel rather than stainless. I have already determined that there might not actually be a reduction in costs, due to the additional coating that will have to be applied to keep the carbon steel from corroding. Anyway, my question really has to do with the strength of the materials.

What is an equivalent carbon steel to replace both 303 and 440 stainless steels?

Thanks for you input, and yes i will do the research on my own to verify your suggestions, but i really need a place to start. Thanks for the help.

Register to Reply
Interested in this topic? By joining CR4 you can "subscribe" to
this discussion and receive notification when new comments are added.

Comments rated to be Good Answers:

These comments received enough positive ratings to make them "good answers".

Comments rated to be "almost" Good Answers:

Check out these comments that don't yet have enough votes to be "official" good answers and, if you agree with them, rate them!
2
Guru
Hobbies - CNC - New Member Hobbies - DIY Welding - New Member Engineering Fields - Electromechanical Engineering - New Member

Join Date: Aug 2007
Posts: 22777
Good Answers: 411
#1

Re: Stainless Steel vs Carbon Steel

01/19/2010 1:55 PM

other things may be the availabillity, and the phyiscal property aspects such as corrosion resistance, ductilbilty,.... and such

p911

__________________
“ When people get what they want, they are often surprised when they get what they deserve " - James Wood
Register to Reply Good Answer (Score 2)
Guru

Join Date: Oct 2008
Posts: 42296
Good Answers: 1662
#2

Re: Stainless Steel vs Carbon Steel

01/19/2010 3:16 PM

You can find all the information you desire at: www.matweb.com

Register to Reply Score 1 for Good Answer
Guru
Brazil - Member - New Member Engineering Fields - Mechanical Engineering - New Member Hobbies - RC Aircraft - New Member Hobbies - Target Shooting - New Member Hobbies - Automotive Performance - Hey there... interested in exchanging information about car performance? Hobbies - DIY Welding - New Member

Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Porto Alegre - RS - Brazil 30deg01'39.73"S 51deg13'43.45"W
Posts: 831
Good Answers: 28
#3

Re: Stainless Steel vs Carbon Steel

01/19/2010 3:47 PM

303 is austenitic, low hardness, low strengh. 440 is ferritic, a little more robust mechanically, but not that much. Do you have access to the expected mecahnical loads information? Regarding your specific question, any low carbon cold rolled steel would suffice. About additional coating... have you considered electrostatic painting? Really low cost and easy to do, if you have the needed space. Or even conventional painting could be fine- if geometry is not that much intrincate.

__________________
Humm... suspicious you are...
Register to Reply
Guru

Join Date: Oct 2008
Posts: 42296
Good Answers: 1662
#4

Re: Stainless Steel vs. Carbon Steel

01/19/2010 6:08 PM

This also depends on the part. A washer is far easier to make than a gear.

Environment may influence surface finish.

Hello......................

Are you there????????????????????

Register to Reply
Power-User

Join Date: May 2007
Posts: 225
Good Answers: 4
#5

Re: Stainless Steel vs. Carbon Steel

01/20/2010 2:54 AM

corrosion resistance and fabrication, welding, are two important factors to be evaluated...the strength is just one factor to be considered..

S

corrosion & rust prevention

Register to Reply Score 1 for Good Answer
Commentator

Join Date: May 2008
Location: The only place where hell can really freeze over.....Michigan
Posts: 63
Good Answers: 3
#6

Re: Stainless Steel vs. Carbon Steel

01/20/2010 7:10 AM

I recieved some quotes back late yesterday and the cost of the parts didnt change as much as expected. One part actually increased in cost. No either the machining source quoted it wrong the first time, or the material cost diffrence wasnt as much as expected. When i told my boss this he asked me why his truck is made from carbon steel and painted rather than stainless steel. If stainless steel is the same cost as carbon steel, then he wants a stainless steel truck!!! They quoted 4140 and 12L14 as replacements for the stainless steel. I have had other vendors suggest 4340 and O1 tool steel. All just as expensive as the stainless steel. Sounds like what i will need to do is go on www.matweb.com and dig somemore into the strengths of materials.

Register to Reply
Power-User

Join Date: May 2008
Posts: 381
#7
In reply to #6

Re: Stainless Steel vs. Carbon Steel

01/20/2010 9:02 AM

I think your boss is completely wright.-

Register to Reply
Commentator

Join Date: May 2008
Location: The only place where hell can really freeze over.....Michigan
Posts: 63
Good Answers: 3
#8
In reply to #7

Re: Stainless Steel vs. Carbon Steel

01/20/2010 9:13 AM

OH Sure......take his side

Register to Reply
Guru

Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Western Pennsylvania, USA
Posts: 762
Good Answers: 9
#9
In reply to #6

Re: Stainless Steel vs. Carbon Steel

01/20/2010 10:33 AM

Well, forming SS is a bit different than CS.

I am sure this is taken into consideration, Allegheny Ludlum near me did some stainless cars as a promotion and it was darn expensive to form the curves, even back in the day of promoting the SS.

And perchance, weight makes a bit of difference also.

The pix probably came from Hemmings, I am not sure, but I will give them credit.

Notice the ripples in the 38 Ford and the T-Bird.

Would you want to try ans sell that to Mr and Mrs Motoring Public?

Register to Reply
Member

Join Date: Dec 2009
Posts: 8
Good Answers: 1
#11
In reply to #9

Re: Stainless Steel vs. Carbon Steel

01/20/2010 2:33 PM

I apologize for picking at nits but, that's a '36 Ford, not a '38.

Currently, the price of stainless has fallen and we find ourselves looking at the possibility of 'standardizing' on SS because the combined cost of painting the carbon is about the same. But that's now, and it's atypical. Usually SS is considerably more expensive.

Register to Reply
Guru

Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Western Pennsylvania, USA
Posts: 762
Good Answers: 9
#12
In reply to #11

Re: Stainless Steel vs. Carbon Steel

01/20/2010 3:53 PM

Agreed, typo on my part.

Register to Reply
Power-User

Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Land o' Lincoln
Posts: 124
Good Answers: 7
#13
In reply to #12

Re: Stainless Steel vs. Carbon Steel

01/20/2010 4:05 PM

Let's not forget the infamous DeLorean, a true Stainless Steel production car, unlike the one-off demo's.

__________________
If you can't do it right the first time ... do it wrong, then let the professionals fix it.
Register to Reply Off Topic (Score 5)
Guru

Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Western Pennsylvania, USA
Posts: 762
Good Answers: 9
#14
In reply to #13

Re: Stainless Steel vs. Carbon Steel

01/20/2010 4:11 PM

Thanks for the reminder.

I don't see or hear it mentioned anywhere anymore, except in references to the movie, Back To The Future.

I liked it when I first seen it, but its looks grew away from me.

Register to Reply Off Topic (Score 5)
Power-User

Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Land o' Lincoln
Posts: 124
Good Answers: 7
#15
In reply to #14

Re: Stainless Steel vs. Carbon Steel

01/20/2010 4:25 PM

There are still a few around, and you can find them listed on the internet. I saw one driving around NE Illinois a month or four ago, so they are out there. But, yes, the movie certainly did more for their recognition than John ever could. They were different, and appealing for a while, but couldn't live up to the hype and proved to be too costly to make.

__________________
If you can't do it right the first time ... do it wrong, then let the professionals fix it.
Register to Reply Off Topic (Score 5)
2
Power-User

Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Land o' Lincoln
Posts: 124
Good Answers: 7
#10

Re: Stainless Steel vs. Carbon Steel

01/20/2010 11:45 AM

Regarding your cost issue, a lot depends on what your "part" is, how it is used, and how it is manufactured. Stainless steel is still very much more expensive than carbon steel, so the larger the part the greater will be the relative "material" cost difference. For small parts the relative "material" cost may be small, as well. But material cost is only one part of your total cost. The other is labor cost. If your part requires machining, then labor may be the greater portion of the total cost and the stainless cost versus carbon cost may be only a small portion of the overall cost. Hence, the price charged will be more dependent on the labor portion and the differences will be small between carbon steel and stainless steel. In addition, if special surface preparation and coating is required for the carbon steel, this adds to the labor portion of the costs and brings the carbon part price closer still to the stainless part price.

If, on the other hand, the part is simply "stamped" out of raw material sheet, then the stainless price should be significantly greater than the carbon steel price, if your fabricator priced appropriately.

As for the material choice, that is dependent on the purpose and operating conditions the part will see. Tool steel would not typically be required unless the part is subjected to a lot of loading (pressure, temperature, friction) during use. Allowable stress values for common carbon steels are usually close enough to the stainless values to allow interchangeability, but, again, this is dependent on the operating conditions the "part" will see in use.

__________________
If you can't do it right the first time ... do it wrong, then let the professionals fix it.
Register to Reply Good Answer (Score 2)
Register to Reply 15 comments
Interested in this topic? By joining CR4 you can "subscribe" to
this discussion and receive notification when new comments are added.

Comments rated to be Good Answers:

These comments received enough positive ratings to make them "good answers".

Comments rated to be "almost" Good Answers:

Check out these comments that don't yet have enough votes to be "official" good answers and, if you agree with them, rate them!
Copy to Clipboard

Users who posted comments:

argh1984 (2); bhrescobar (1); Doobster6 (1); ferquiza (1); lyn (2); phoenix911 (1); qaqcpipeman (3); strider6 (1); YesMAM (3)

Previous in Forum: Vectran Fiber Sample   Next in Forum: Chromium-Plated Steel

Advertisement