Installing an Operating System without a CD

well we're back to the beginning then, some sector[s] had gone bad corrupting my XP install, I had been keeping everything on a external HDD for some months anyway.

I may purchase a new HDD for this notebook at some point in the future...

any hints on reading the file?

I just had a look at the network & can access the extHDD which is connected to the vista machine, I don't know if I can do cool things like save to it yet...

already ahead of where I was running xp in that respect.

I need to find some open cell foam to stuff in the hole where the cd/dvd used to be, as this box runs much cooler with out it

To read the external hard drive, in "Places", select the hard drive you are trying to read, and it will ask for your password to access it. At this point, you should be able to read it no matter what operating system formatted it. At least, this works in a "dual boot" mode. The external HDD needs to be plugged in before you boot, I believe...You should also be able to copy files to the external hard drive as well...

the exHDD is on a different computer

my question is how did you come to the conclusion about this HDD from looking at the [fstab]files I pasted up?

shouldn't I be able to identify & isolate the bad sectors?

I came to the conclusion from the fact that you only have two partitions on the hard drive, one being the swap partition, which is not being checked. The only other devices in fstab are not bootable partitions (if I remember rightly, you have connections through your motherboard chip set for two CD drives and a floppy drive- does not mean they are available, only that the motherboard is ready to deal with them). If the disk-checking progrma returns with error code 4, that means there are sectors on the primary partition it could not repair. Actually, this should have shown up when you first loaded the operating system- I don't know why it did not- or maybe it did, and isolated those sectors so that the software was written to only good sectors. Seems you have a functional installation...

My experience with hard disks is, when bad sectors start showing up, it is time to replace it.

I need to do some research about more sophisticated disk cleanup software, that can maybe isolate bad sectors. But, as I said, once they start showing up, it isn't long before the entire disk is doomed...

I started to update to the next version & it finally crashed hard enough it wouldn't boot

Pulled the HDD & did a new install on the PC

but this time I didn't do the restart & update on the pc

I reinstalled the HDD in the notebook & am back online & running through the 1st 160 updates

no errors at start up

figuring out how to isolate the bad sectors is probably a good plan

Much earlier in the thread I gave you detailed info about using the HDD manufacturers tools to accomplish this and now that you have internet access.

First thing to do is download the HDD makers Testing Utility and test the drive for any faults.

This should be included in the makers manual or on their Web Site for your particular model.

Then use their tools to recover the sectors capiche?

Bumping all the info back to this end of the thread

HDD = Hitachi travelstar

model C25N080ATMR04-0

P/N 08k0635

ata ide 80g

I just went back through the entire thread, I didn't see any of those kind of links

I'm trying to recover or isolate the bad sectors?

I new I was in trouble when Google returned a reference to this thread as the fifth hit for the Hitachi Hard Drive!

I have found nothing so far in the Linux literature about recovering bad sectors, or repairing the hard disk, which does not mean it doesn't exist- I just haven't found it.

Hitachi offers "Drive Fitness Test, Version 4.16" on their web site, http://www.hitachigst.com/hdd/support/download.htm, which claims to be able to "* Low-level format utility (Use option: Erase Disk). - Note: this utility overwrites customer data to allow repair of bad sectors." However, "You may create the media under Windows (using the Windows OS version) or Linux (using the binary image), but you must start your system with the DOS-bootable diskette to run DFT."

Since we don't have a floppy disk drive, this looks to be undoable...

Maybe spend $30.00? http://www.dposoft.net/?referrer=adwords

Or replace the hard drive with a newer, better model for $100 or less...

bwire may know of other options that could possibly help with this...

still working

better this install, got stuck with about 40 updates to go & I restarted

no freezing at start up

now I'm stuck in update limbo, can't finish the 1/2 done updates, can't get any new ones package manager still works

I suppose I could try the hitachi on a stick

just brought a scan/repair program from source forge on board

http://sourceforge.net/search/?type_of_search=soft&words=hdd+repair

Did you create a partition for the new install? If you did just boot into to 8.04 and try again

I did a fresh install

I tried to partition the hdd in 1/2 but it kept failing, no matter what format I tried to use

any suggestions for repair tools?

Working on it...

http://blogs.zdnet.com/storage/?p=822&tag=content;col2

Take the hdd out again an put in Vista machine. Do an unconditional reformat then download and run this http://www.cgsecurity.org/wiki/TestDisk

nope won't do that....

I'll do whatever to the PC...

trying to figure out what Kernal version I'm running

To find out what kernel you are using, go to "System", "Administration", "System Monitor". There should be a tab in the pop-up window labeled "System", which will tell you the version and kernel version you are using. Also a lot of other neat information about your system that may or may not mean anything to you at this point...

Better to create 10GB and designate as "C" drive but leave empty. Create another partition "D" about 15GB and put system there. This way "C" will occupy the area of the disc where bad sectors will likely form; on the edge. What partitioning tool using?

I would have to say g part

to

CW cool Alt/Ctrl/Del in windows equivelent

got the terminal version from the unbuntu forum

uname -a

probably going to bed, but I'll try the tool from B in the morning

I ran the disk analysis & got much more normal results on this install than yesterdays

I've done 6 installs

everyone has different weird problems.

I tried different partition schemes pre install

I'm convinced the computer is good & am gonna break down & buy a new HDD

any suggestions for favorite sources?

I don't do Ebay

CW any suggestions for how to set up a multi boot on my 8.04 box

I hear there's gonna be 10.04LTS soon...

1- If you want multi-boot with a Windows sector, need to load Windows first. Linux doesn't care which order you load, but Windows does.

2- If you just want multiple versions of Linux to check out, then just follow the instructions provided with the LiveCD. Very simple, at least since 8.04.

3- Buy a CD/DVD drive as well. You will eventually want that capability with the computer. External should work.

4. I would stay with either 9.04 or 9.10- the 10.04 is going to need some time to stabilize. 8.04 and 9.04 still have about 3 years of support left in them. Actually, until just recently, I was still using 7.10, even though there was no longer any support available- I would still be using it, but I wanted to put CAELinux on that machine (CAELinux is built on 8.04). After a while, when you have the computer doing everything you want it to do, support is less than important. There is no real advantage to going with the latest release. The same with Windows- if XP does everything you want it to do, why bother with upgrading? Of course, with Windows, there is a greater concern over Internet security (which may, in the future, become a problem with Linux, as Linux becomes more popular). The bad guys are looking for greatest market penetration, just like the rest of us.

5- I avoid buying ANYTHING on the Internet, if at all possible. But I have the impression you do not have a local computer store. Stay with Hitachi if you can, and go for as much capacity as you can afford that will still fit inside the case. Go cheap on the CD/DVD drive- less of an issue if that dies.

6- I suspect your "different weird problems" derive from the fact that the hard drive is dying, but I can't be sure of that analysis without hands-on experimentation...You are most likely correct that the rest of the computer is OK. The only other component I would be concerned with would be the memory- Ubuntu provides a memory check utility on the LiveCD/LiveUSB that can be used to check the state of the memory.

7- If funds are available after the new HD and CD/DVD drives, add memory. I have yet to encounter a situation where I had too much memory...

my old pc has a cd/dvd that works fine,

so I'm able burn back up or new distros

I was hoping to be able to do an install straight off the net onto the partition I already have ready on my pc to test run some newer versions.

I don't have the problem of not having an operating system on the pc, so it doesn't have to boot from the media

I'm probably making it harder than it is

The laptop is on the shelf again until I spend some money

the local shops think a HDD is worth $150

when I make a trip to the big city [1 hr away] I can go to best buy I think I saw stuff in the $70 range. I've always had good online experiences with amazon. I figured Bwire will have some input about on line stuff....

Now, I am a bit confused. I thought we were still dealing with the laptop- is it the desktop you are trying to set up as dual boot?

I am very nervous about doing anything direct off the net, but I am a bit old-fashioned. I am afraid too much can go wrong, and losing control of the process may create more problems than I care to deal with...

I currently have two computers set up with dual boot- one with Ubuntu 8.04 (actually, CAELinux, which is a special build of Ubuntu 8.04) combined with Windows XP. This is mostly the wife's computer. She was adamantly opposed to going to Ubuntu in the beginning, but now never dips down in to Windows. One of the things I like about that particular setup is that when she logs on, the computer is in Spanish, and when I log on, the computer is in English. I never figured out how to do that in Windows. She still calls on me to help with the computer, and sometimes, I have to log on in my English world to read the instructions, then go back to her Spanish world to accomplish her task- she refuses to read the instructions on her own...

My other computer is set up with Ubuntu 9.04 32-bit and 9.10 64-bit for experimental purposes. 9.04 seems a lot more stable than 9.10, but part of my assessment may be due to the difference between 32-bit and 64-bit- 32-bit is a lot more stable in ANY operating system. The 9.10 has settled down quite a bit, and I am using it more and more. (The 8.04 I have running on the desktop is 64-bit, and no problems at all). All three systems demand frequent updates, though. How necessary are these? I don't know. I ran 7.04 for quite some time (two or three years) without support and had no problems. The only reason I upgraded to 8.04 was to get the CAE finite elements package...

Where I live, getting the *.iso file for an install takes hours. To install directly, with the possibility of a power failure or whatever, scares me.

$70 sounds about right for a hard drive. But, what is the trip to the big city going to set you back? Maybe $150 isn't so expensive...

bwire is probably more knowledgeable than I am when it comes to doing net-based stuff...

I gained quite a bit of knowledge & confidence dealing with the laptop. I'm gonna put that to the side until I get a new HDD for it. We go to the city once a month to entertain my mother in law for part of a day. I have come up with a decent scheme for sharing Firefox in one window with my google account, gmail, bookmarks. IE in another with my wife's stuff, usually do a restart once a day.

I haven't been able to figure a similar routine for unbuntu yet, I'm spoiled by the portability of my google toolbar/account, not supported in chrome or opera yet

we use the unbuntu desktop pc to print or if we both need to be online at the same time. I think I would like to dual boot just to have a look at the newer version(s) with out wrecking what I already have going...

I'm pretty close to a good reliable server out of stanford & rarely have outages except in the winter, probably should just play around with the usb stick install I guess

Computer shopper mag recently had an article about replacement laptop HDD's look there; the article will give prices and the source of them.

or if cautious of the net, give the pertinent info of your choice an I'll get one, just send the travelers chek

This is the best deal so far

http://www.bestbuy.com/site/Seagate+-+250GB+Internal+Serial+ATA+Hard+Drive+for+Laptops/9107744.p?skuId=9107744&id=1218030894551

Samsung or Hitachi or Seagate or WD; find you're fancy then choice the source you please.

I like to buy direct from the manufacturer...

The biggest issue isn't the lack of boot-able drives the biggest issue keeping a recovery from occurring is not having the windows O/S which is what runs the HDD repair programs.

sfdisk - Partition table manipulator for Linux

Description

sfdisk has four (main) uses: list the size of a partition, list the partitions on a device, check the partitions on a device, and - very dangerous - repartition a device.

sfdisk doesn't understand GUID Partition Table (GPT) and it is not designed for large partitions

********************

parted(8) - Linux Man page

Name

GNU Parted - a partition manipulation program

Synopsis

parted [options] [device [command [options...]...]]

Description

This manual page documents briefly the parted command. Complete documentation is distributed with the package in GNU Info format; see below.

parted is a disk partitioning and partition resizing program. It allows you to create, destroy, resize, move and copy ext2, ext3, linux-swap, FAT, FAT32, and reiserfs partitions. It can create, resize and move Macintosh HFS partitions, as well as detect jfs, ntfs, ufs, and xfs partitions. It is useful for creating space for new operating systems, reorganising disk usage, and copying data to new hard disks.

I bought a WD 160gb 7200rpm 8mb HDD from amazon for $50,

I was limited by having to buy a PATA form

should be plenty of storage, enough to hold all my music & pictures

which will allow me to have everything Backed up across 3 different HDD's

Using Itunes for the music & Picasa for the pics also allows me to do running backups to DVD's, in other words I can just occasionally add the new files, without having to burn a new set everytime.

If the future holds that you use it as an external remember the cable maximum is 18"

love the new signature

I have a seagate 250gb external, which seems to work fine no matter which OS system it's plugged into. I've been using its as storage on the busted gateway notebook for over a year

it's a usb device too & was the sole keeper of my 12000 mp3's & 8000jpgs until about 2 days ago when I backed up to 20 DVD's

Now that I have a little money to throw at the problem I am

I'm still gonna have to load an OS in through the HDD in about a week when the new one shows up

multiple tries on the old HDD have convinced me the rest of the machine is ok & the HDD needs to be replaced, Almost 2 years ago I had upgraded the RAM to 1gb & about a year ago a new power supply, the CD hasn't worked for almost 3. The battery is only good for around 1 hr, but I always use it plugged in, so no problem...

Once i get it back up & stable I'm gonna upgrade the desktop to a newer version of unbuntu & dual boot the vista machine, I already have a partition set aside. Not gonna take the plunge until I have the rest of the stuff going right, but I'm well on the way

Good idea- do one at a time. When that one is working the way you want it, then move on to the next one...

Once sentence sprung out of your post for me:-

The battery is only good for around 1 hr, but I always use it plugged in, so no problem...

For the future and for anyone else with a laptop, the best way to ruin (and relatively quickly depending upon the intelligence, or lack of it, in the charger circuit) a laptop battery is to leave it in with power connected. I have up to now, not found a manufacturer who REALLY looks after the battery, well why should they, they like to sell more!!

If you live where the mains power is reliable, learn how to drop the battery out when power is available and the battery is charged.

If you are in an area where power drops, learn how to operate the wall socket switch to only charge when say down to 20% and to switch the power off just before the battery is full. Use a kitchen timer to assist.....

I am sure that there MUST be some laptops that do not kill the battery in this way, but believe me, they are few and far between. On my very old Toshie (Pentium 120MHZ, so it must be 12 years old at least with Win95 on it) the battery is still fine....my newer Toshie (Aug 2006) battery is almost 4 years old and still like new.....as it should be!!

Overcharging is bad for every type of battery that there is.....Some batteries do not like being left empty either (Lead Acid), so you need to understand the technology and treat it correctly.....(though some batteries do not like being left fully charged and unused, LIPO for example.....)

how am I supposed to keep the cord from popping out?

the hard crash is ugly.

the screen won't run at regular brightness with out the powersupply

sounds like better software would fix it

I noticed linux had some more options for all this stuff, which I'll spend some time on later...

the wireless net work was working which it never had before.

I have found a lot of things that just work with Linux, but not with Windows, on the same boxes. Wireless, sound, video, the built in camera...the list goes on. Things just WORK with Linux- Windows, one usually has to chase all about the web to find the appropriate drivers...