Fossil Fuel Subsidies Dwarf Support for Renewables

and that doesn't include what the consumer pays? wtf?

Corporate welfare at it's finest

ever wonder what would happen if there were a free market?

I'm still galled that AIG, an Insurance Company, was bailed out. Leastways from my point of view "we" ought to have all got a Policy if for nothing but burial out of that event.

You gottah figure if some business sector needs subsidies, there is something wrong with it. Course the rule is pay now, or pay later.

Obviously you want to always get use of things, defer payment, since you are going to die, and won't have to worry about it.

Sears goes on somehow. I figure it is because they still sell quality Craftsman tools. I can't remember or do I know of a Hardware Store really needing subsidies. Possibly in the area of weapons hardware they get subsidies for not selling stuff to just anybody?

Let us look at what businesses are not subsidized in order to grasp what real pure markets ought to be based on.

What Hardware Stores went out of business, and why? Can you fail making tools? What knife manufactures have gone out of business?

The True Value & Ace chains are interesting, having merged...

True Value stores are mostly independently owned, but share a common supply chain

& their prices are comparable to the big boxes

What should we get from Goldman/Sachs?

the auto makers are paying back quickly, I sure they got much better terms than a venture capitalist would have given [more than 1/2 of the controlling interest]

I've heard that the Goldman Sachs count payback as tax credits against losses. In other words I've been told that what they are doing is doing write offs and then that write off is applied to the bill.

I've not seen the balance sheets myself. However I am aware that debt is shown on balance sheets as an asset, even if it is not in hand.

Too bad freelance accountants aren't interested in CR4.

Okay, what should we get from Goldman Sachs? I don't know frankly. I suppose if I invested money with them I'd have some right to ask for a percentage of the profits and a limit to their fees. In my own case what happened to money paid into the union coffers was eaten up by fees, causing me to not much trust others to manage any money I couldn't touch.

Organized labor is OK

but unions suck

another case of management making more than their fair share since they touch the money

Goldman Sachs should lose most of the company to investors they ripped off & the taxpayers, who saved a company that is too big to fail. Being lender of last resort, should reap commensurate returns

Considering that renewables production is dwarfed by fossil fuels I expect that most is not all would suffer a quick and painful death without the subsidies.

1) Ethanol - mandated use plus blenders credit - as long as the mandate is there we pay

2) Solar PV - everyone gets to subsidize their neighbors system - would die in one day without incentives, credits

3) Wind - doubt it would last 15 minutes without incentives credits

How they total the subsidies for fossil fuels is totally confusing and subject to 1000 versions.

Best if they drop all subsidies but there would be massive confusion for a while as the markets adjusted and realigned themselves.

GA -- I've noticed that what people call direct subsidies are hardly that at all. To me, a direct subsidy is a check, cash or other financial instrument. Perhaps we could also factor in non-payment of taxes.

But then again, you and I get direct subsidies for having children and buying a house. So to all you snivelers out there, bemoaning the "subsidies" given to x, y, or z, think about that for a minute or two.

Suppose we were to take away those subsidies for procreation (also recreation ) and home ownership? Those certainly cost the country plenty. Then try to tell me that the mineral rights programs don't provide the country with certain economic benefits that home ownership and familes also provide.

Just because there was a reason to subsidize something at one point in time, doesn't mean it should always be so

the subsidy for ethanol has never been about energy, it is about the price of corn.

When the Forest service puts in a road so Louisiana Pacific can log is that a subsidy? what made sense in 1900, may not make sense today

Simple....governments do not get much tax from renewables and bio fuels are not big enough to pay much tax so get your tax from the biggest payers....petrol companies.