Fibre Glass Repair (On a Lotus Europa Body)

Could you use some plastic metal (or similar) to fill the cracks, and then heat the original resin (And add more) to reinforce the new joints?

Thank you.

Sounds right. Can't uncook an egg.

So the next step is to do it the old fashion way. Now, I am thinking, and what I read Googled is the bad areas are "ground" away not thru the glass but let's say half way thru the glass to allow "new" glass to be layed. If this is correct, is there a tool, say a Dremel-ish tool that could only go so deep, yet easily grind away the glass?

Again thinking, is there a better (ie easier to work with, stronger better) material suited for glass repair? For example, say carbon fiber cloth be better, less prone to future cracking? I don't know off hand the cost of carbon fiber, which definitely is a concern and carbon is just an example.

So, how much damage? Is it not a hole?

Just say no to graphite. It's hard to work with and you don't need it.

If the damage isn't that bad, you might somehow put a reinforcing layer underneath

the existing glass. Then grind the surface and fill and paint.

Please, more detail or a picture.

Thanks again.

I will take some pics and post.

In regards to your dremelling away at the hole, we used this method on some plastic canoes, to fix a split in them. Its the same principle, I suppose if you can get something behind the fibreglass sheets, you could use straight resin to fill the gap - Kinda like polyfiller

...just took notice of: "you could use straight resin to fill the gap..."

"Not!"

The resin itself exhibits virtually zero strength whatsoever (on its own).

If a gap is so extraordinarily tiny (narrow) that you're considering just "brushing-in some resin" , you'd be FAR better off grinding it out so that it would accept an appropriate mix of resin combined with a proper filler (<link), insuring full contact on both sides of the crack from top-to-bottom. ◊

You don't want to leave damaged delaminated fiberglass in place, so you typically won't grind only half way through the damaged areas.

It is important to remove all the damaged material in an area. Grind until all the damage in a particular area has been removed. This allow the repair to be full thickness and attached to good fiberglass. That said, there are a couple helpful things to be done prior to begining to remove damaged fiberglass...

An obvious concern is replicating the original shape.

Take a lot of high resolution pictures first.

It makes sense to work only one damaged area at a time, so things do not get confused, so resist the urge to become 'efficient' by getting all the grinding out of the way.

Whenever possible, rebuild looking from the inside out, take the panel off, or work from inside the body whenever possible.

Making a mold/removable backing of the shape prior to removing damage can be a big help. Plexiglass works well. attach it with large washers and slightly oversized holes in the plexiglass, to allow some movement prior to being screwedor bolted down (filling holes later is easy). Flat sections and sections curved about only one axis are fairly simple. Complex shapes with volume or sharp angles requires the use of a heat gun and patience.

Once you have made the mold, mark the exact location, remove it, grind the damage away, then apply a thin but complete layer of wax or other compatable mold release to the plexiglass and reattach. This allows you a backing upon which to build your repair that should require little surface refinement later.

One more important thing to go prior to grinding is to consider the glass fibers that will become airborne grinding away the damage. You don't want to have this stuff in your eyes, nose, underwear or lungs, and you don't want anyone to track through it or play in it.

I've had some small experience with other materials which you can rework in something akin to the fashion you have in mind. Even if it were possible with fiberglass - which I strongly doubt - the results would probably be aesthetically unappealing. Ever try shaping a slice of half-melted American cheese into the profile of Richard Nixon before it re-solidifies? No? Well, neither have I. Because it's just too crazy to even think about it trying.

Same thing applies here to the alluring shape of your car. And you can't eat your mistakes.

Oh, by the way, welcome.

I can't say if this will work, but I wonder if you could sand and clean the existing surfaces, front and back and then mix up some fiberglass resin, thinned with a little reducer, and brush it on the front and back.

It may creep into those hairline cracks and set, giving you a sound structure to deal with. Then just sand smooth the outside and repaint.

Just a thought.

You can NOT thin out your resin. It will not set up. You must use the hardner and not too much and not too little. Experiment for a while to make sure it have it right. If you use too much it will set up quick but will be more brittle. Too little hardner and it won't set up for a long time if at all. You can get it into the cracks with a method I have used. You can't brush it on. It works better if it can be laid down flat. The resin will not stick to mylar. It's slick and it just doesn't melt into it or bond to it. I have taken a small piece of mylar and use it like a spatula to put your resin on the crack trying your best to work it down into the cracks. Don't do too large an area. You only have about 5 minutes to get it in place before starts setting up. Then take a larger sheet of mylar that will fit over the area of the crack and press it in place over the crack forcing the resin down into the crack. Then as quick as you can tape it into place with mylar packaging tape. Helps if you have the tape on the mylar first so you can hinge it into place and tape it down. Once in place don't move it. Then don't touch it for 20 to 25 minutes. Put a little drop on a little mylar so you can see when it's hardened. When hard just yank that mylar off and it will be a smooth surface. You will have a surface much closer to where you want it and you can use sanding blocks to smooth it out. You MUST sand it or paint will NOT stick to the resin. (Might for a while...) For those areas that are demolished the dremyl will be good to grind away the stuff thats not where you want it. You need to have a clean area that is rough so it will bond well. They make a type of fiberglass and gel in a tube that all you do is add the hardner. It works well on the back to hold it together. You will need fiberglass cloth on the back to hold it together structurally. If the cracks are not structural (not cracked all the way through) I would just use bondo filler and a sharp putty knife. You can force it into the cracks. It is softer than the resin and will shape easier. I use the resin as structure and fill in with the bondo filler. Another important thing is to MAKE SURE it is mixed well. Stir stir stir. YOU MUST work quick!!! If it is cold it will buy you some extra time however. And for bondo start with a smooth board and work your hardner into it until the color is the same throughout. Again be quick. Places that don't get mixed well will stay gummy and will defy sanding. (Plugs up sandpaper and you will end up digging it out.) It won't do paint any favors either. Before you start go get a respirator and eye protection. Auto body shops carry an economical one for around $20. MEK peroxide and resin as well as the glass fiber in your lungs or eyes are bad. You won't know how bad for a while and then you will know it for a LONG time. When grinding it get a fan and blow it away from you. Good luck.

Really, I was not aware of that. I thinned out fiberglass resin and applied it to some exterior plywood, with a brush, for the flooring in my boat. It soaked in, cured hard as rock and made it waterproof. If I recall I used acetone.

By no means did I guarantee that it would work, but a little experimentation will never hurt anything, and could end up saving a lot of time.

Too many cooks spoil the soup. And supply misinformation! You are right. You CAN thin this and almost any other thermosetting resin, if you do it properly.

I hope the OP can make some reasonable decisions about how to proceed. If I were the OP, I'd disregard 95% of what has been postulated here and do as bobc said. Go buy a book. At least with a book you have a reasonable expectation that the author has some direct experience and isn't blowing smoke up your skirt like most of the opinions stated here.

Good luck.

I know you can thin it out, but what liquids for which resin I could not say, but its done by the professionals for example, when building boats using a wet resin on thin ply method (that I have forgotten the name of!).

The pieces are held down using stainless steelpins, that stay in the material forever....It makes a very strong one piece hull.....

I just used off the shelf all purpose fiberglass resin, MEK is the hardener, and acetone to thin. Cure time did slow, but once it did cure it was tough!

To get the project right the OP is going to have to do some research beyond CR4, I don't think there's any way around it. This is a good place to get ideas on how to proceed, but not necessarily for step by step tutorials.

Small Point. Catalyst is MEKP. Methyl ethyl ketone peroxide. And, as long as I'm ragging on you, it's not really fiberglass resin, it's polyester resin.

Take it like a man!

...and , lest we neglect to mention (for those who didn't follow my previous link, post #17) ... the proper thinner for polyester resins is :

Styrene Monomer

Blessings and best-of-luck to the OP and to all ~

I'll give you the MEKP, I actually walked out to my shop this morning to look. I missed the P on the end because I thought it was a ). Forgot my reading glasses and I can't see $hit without them.

I was able to read this this though. No mention of polyester anywhere. I can take it if you can.

Never mind, it doesn't say it on the can, but it probably is polyester resin, whatever.......I don't analyze everything I use. Thank you Mr. Wizard.

I know I,m picky. I'm about to correct another poster, too. Watch this.

I say they called it fiberglass resin because that's what the unwashed masses call it.

Cheers.

That's a can of polyester resin, and even in consumer quantities, should have references to containing ingredients known by the state of ca to cause cancer, etc.

Only ingredient listed is Styrene Monomer. Otherwise, just overexposure can cause brain and nervous system damage, and it's flammable.....that's it.

Note that I wrote should. The MSDS tells the real story. Their are loads of consumer products that would be difficult to get past the plant HSE guy in larger quantities.

The MSDS says it is about equal amounts of polyester and styrene* (with a small amount of silica), that it contains an ingredient known to cause cancer, etc.

The reasoning behind the difference in consumer vs industrial labelling is the likelihood that consumers use the stuff in small volumes -- and they have more choice over whether or not to use a product.

*which is standard for what we call "polyester resin"

And to this I would add that, after repair of the damage and sanding down the repair (as well as the undamaged areas) gel-coat prior to painting. As noted, this is no different that repair of a Corvette body or fiberglass boat. In fact the gel-coat/paint used on boats provides an excellent, durable finish. Surface prep and color coat thickness are important. Allow plenty of time for solvents to evaporate to prevent outgassing through the color coat to avoid bubbles and control the color coat thickness to prevent cracking or crazing. Final finish is clear coat.

Fantastic car, the Europa was a great car, especially the ones who were fitted with the lighter Rover V8 3.5 Liter by people wanting a better power unit than the "crap" Renault (?) motor that Lotus originally installed......The V8 was also lighter and improved the handling as well.....

The Rover/Buick V8 motor is described in detail here:-

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rover_V8_engine

To Quote:-

As well as appearing in Rover cars, the engine was widely sold by Rover to small car builders, and has appeared in a wide variety of vehicles. Rover V8s feature in some models from Morgan, TVR, Triumph, Land Rover and MG, among many others. The first use of the engine by a UK maker was actually Warwick who fitted the engine, purchased directly from Buick, to the stillborn Warwick 305GT^[2]. They have even been used in light aircraft due to their light weight and high power output.

The Rover V8 has long been virtually the standard engine for hot rod use in Britain, much as the Chevrolet small-block V8 is for American builders.

Look here for a good weblink (there are many more around) for the Europa:-

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lotus_Europa

With regard to repairing fiberglass, there are basically two different types of resin, Polyester and Epoxy. There are some others but not used often by the private person.

There is a good link here on Fiberglass:-

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fiberglass

Mainly car bodies are made with Polyester as its far cheaper to buy, but has the disadvantage that the whole car body (as in this case) will have to laid up in one session, if it dries/hardens, then the next layer will not stick properly to the dry/hard layer......

This means that you cannot use Polyester for good repairs (many do not know this!!).....generally Epoxy resin is used, which is far more expensive, but provided the Polyester is cleaned and ground first (I even use denatured spirits to clean it off just before mixing the Epoxy), you can get a really good bond.

I would do as others have suggested, fill the broken areas (don't cut them out) as it will help keep the shape for you, then once its hard clean and grind the "inside" and using strong matting, lay up a few good layers on the inside to support the area fully. The grinding and fill the outside to a perfect shape before painting.

The whole body needs to be ground down and a new gel coat applied if you want to get rid of the crazing......or find a paint that is flexible.....

Best of luck!! Keep us informed and post pictures of all stages.....

"This means that you cannot use Polyester for good repairs"

Sorry, that statement is incorrect. Proper surface preparation is all that's required.

All the body filler I'm aware of is polyester based.

I meant "good" repairs.......You are probably talking about unstressed repair techiques.....or only lightly stressed.....

Cars and boats made using polyester resin MUST be laid up in one work period, with enough trained people to hand to make it a continual process. The reason being that polyester only REALLY sticks to Polyester when the previous resin is still tacky.

This means that extra costs are involved in large constructions, of overtime and personnel.....if it wasn't required, it wouldn't be done, but it is required.....

There is an interesting construction information here:-

http://www.garbled.net/tim/fiberglass.html

I found this very true sentence:-

"Paint it on thick, and cover everything evenly. If you need to, do a second coat before the first coat loses it's stickyness."

Now you know one of the big secrets of working with Polyester!!! Not many know this and sometimes that lack of knowledge causes major problems....

"I meant "good" repairs" OK, I'll give you that.

During the Viet Nam war I used to repair gunship radomes that had been shot, but not damaged enough to discard. I used epoxy resin for that work.

"There you go...." I really lie epoxy. I even use it for woodwork repairs that require a high strength!!

Filling a metal car body does not require that much strength really.......it sticks better to clean rough metal than a dry/hard version of itself....

I personally would wash the whole body in denatured spirits. Making sure all cracks are really clean. Using a fine brush. This will get rid of most if not all wax residue. Also a liquid silicone remover might be a good idea as well.....if silicone wax was used.

Then mix up small quantities of liquid epoxy and "wash" the car with a small sponge and the liquid epoxy....let it cure for several days and rub the whole body down with "wet 'n dry"......then a spray paint filler and do it again with "wet 'n dry"......I would not use Gelcoat....but simply spray paint the car.

A little history of that V8. In 1960, Ford and Chevrolet felt they needed a small car. We got the Corvair, and Falcon. But, the rest of the GM brands wanted a small car also. So in 61 we got the Buick Special, Oldsmobile F-85, and Pontiac Tempest. They needed a small engine, and so was born the 215 V8. It was used from 61 to 63 when the small cars got bigger. The Olds actually offered the 215 with a turbocharger from the factory. Not a big seller, but it was there.

The Buick V6 was similar in design to the 215,but generally bigger everywhere. Buick almost sold off the V6 at one time to Jeep. They were installing the V6 in Jeeps for years. But the gas crisis reared it's head, and Buick kept it. As the years went on they got many more evolutions out of it. For a while it was the only engine offered in the front wheel drive Rivera, Tornado, and Eldorado.

Next class will be identifying Ford V8s from 1955 to the modular motor.

The Buick V8 3.5 Liter (Known as the Rover V8 in the UK) was even lighter (only 318 lb) than the 1.5 liter cast iron Renault motor that was originally in the Lotus!!!

The original Renault motor achieved 82BHP for the Europa (with such a light car, performance was still "Sporty"!).

The Rover V8 produced in standard form 200BHP and could be easily tuned for higher outputs!

There was a lower power version too, but much later....it became almost the "official" power upgrade. Many car magazines of the time showed photos and even one gave a method of how to upgrade the Europa (and many other car types!)!!

I remember drooling over such articles, but as a lowly paid (RN) serviceman, no chance!!!

...and Pontiac Tempest

... although I think the 215 was never used in the Tempest. The V8 Tempest was a 326, driving the wheels through a flex shaft and rear mounted transaxle, if I recall. An altogether remarkable arrangement for an American car.

I remember when Chrysler and Ford were considering a joint venture, using the best of the Valiant and the Comet, called the Vomet. Bucket seats, throw up top...

"My Cousin Vinny".

Great movie. Two Utes?

After reading about Cousin Vinny, I looked at the Wikipedia article on the Tempest. The 215 was indeed used in '61 and '62 -- something of which I was unaware, I think, even at the time. In 1968 or so I bought and old Skylark w/ 215 (to use the engine in an MGA) and was unaware at that time that I could have looked for a Tempest as a donor as well.

I don't know that I was ever aware that the original Tempest 4 was half of the 389, either.

I am willing to submit to any punishment for having doubted Bob's assertion re the Tempest.

I will add a 62 Tempest w/ the 215 to my imaginary collection of really interesting American cars: aluminum engine, rear transaxle (seen in such like the Porsche 928, later), excellent weight distribution, independent suspension. Given some modernization, this could be a pretty cool car, even now.

Here is another gem for you. The Scout sold by International Harvester used half of the 304, and 392 engine for standard power.

By the way, this series of engines was always timed on the # 8 cylinder. The front harmonic balancer was undercut in the area that would have been used for the #1 cylinder.

With respect to the other posts, there is a LOT of misunderstanding going around nowadays about what can and cannot be (self) done with 'glass reinforced plastic materials (be they polyester, vinyl ester, epoxy, or what-have-you).

I learned an awful lot by purchasing and reading just a few of the "Basic" materials offered by THIS outfit (link) Fiberglast.com.

Yes, you can produce some really exotic items yourself using carbon-fiber, kevlar (ballistic or non-ballistic), or other fabric as the reinforcement.

But when it comes to producing acceptable (long-term/strong) repairs to certain combinations, extraordinary measures may be required.

Does anyone know for certain what the resin used in lotus bodies (that year) was?

I would be most surprised if anything other than Polyester was used.....

I went to Cheshunt Grammar schooool, the road (Windmill Lane) in front of our School was the test track for Lotus till they moved away further north to Hethel......I used to see the Elites being tested and the Super 7s better than Math or Biology!!!.......I did not realise I was watching history being made......

(Sir Cliff Richard and the Shadows came also from Cheshunt and the surrounds!!)

I left that school in 63 or 64, I forget which.....

See here:-

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lotus_Cars

Quote:-

"The company moved to a purpose built factory at Cheshunt in 1959^[2] and since 1966 the company has occupied a modern factory and road test facility at Hethel, near Wymondham."

Don't use carbon fibre unless you are planning to use it as a structural member. And even then...its not magic. But it will show through and look awful and be dangerous to sand away.

Can't add much to this discussion. There are million resins and more of clear coat formulations, and all react a little differently to fresh resin, paint, and solvents. Is there a factory which still makes these cars? Would a dealer have the information you need?

I have repaired fiberglass trunks and boxes and canoes with fiberglass. Sometimes it works, sometimes it doesn't. Usually the problem is that the new stuff does not bond to the old stuff. I think it residue of the mould release compound on the inside which is the usual culprit, and waxes which have been rubbed into the panels for show on the outside. And sometimes the material itself is just being annoying.

(My neighbour made moulds of the major panels of his mid '60s Ford Mustang, and now has a garage business making fiberglass replicas for the repair market. A nice car like a Lotus might be worth the trouble to do the same. Just a thought.)

Good luck. Its not an easy project you have decided to take on.

Found this on a quick google search. It's a forum dedicated to Lotus enthusiasts. You may find a kindred spirit that's already been through this and can give you precise instruction and guidance. Good luck on your project!

http://www.lotustalk.com/forums/

My late father owned a 1968 "Avanti" until his death. Of course the body is made of fiberglass and once required repair because some knucklehead rear-ended the car in traffic.

To make a long story short, take a few minutes to visit a Chevy "Corvette" forum and learn how they repair their fiberglass bodies if you cannot find the correct advice here. There's a ton of repair forums for Vettes! My brother owns a '65 ragtop that once needed body repair recently and he found the much needed advice in one of the online Vette forums. Sorry, I don't know exactly what that advice was......he lives in Jersey and I'm up here in Upstate NY freezing my butt off, as usual! LOL

Good luck with the Europa! Wonderful and beautiful car!!!!!

Hi,

I had a company that made fiberglass panels for the
refregiration industries. It worked fine until some bastard
started to make trouble and we went belly up. Long story...
As for your lotus firstly for the cracks I would by some cabosyl
( that is very very small glass beads ) and mix it with epoxy
resin to make a paste of the constancy of toothpaste. Once that
is mixed you take a small amount and add catalyst to it. Watch out
for the quantity of catalyst you put. It must be the same ratio of
the resin you mixed before adding the cabosyl. Some resin and catalyst
have different ratio so watch that. Sometimes it's 1 to 1 sometimes it's
another ratio. Secondly there is the time you have to spread a fine
layer. Dont push it because it may harden to fast and you loose your
paste. Then there is the flexibility of the harden resin. It should be
somewhat flexible because your car's body will be subjected to
mechanical vibration, expansion from the heat and contraction from
the cold. Buy the right resin and catalyst. That's the most important
thing to do. Epoxy resin is hard to sand so you might wish to buy
polyester resin. These type of resin come in a wide veriety of properties
and these resins is what I would suggest you to use.
Polyester resins are very sensible to humidity and the curing time
may take a long time to cure if the relative humidity is high.
Try to do these repair in a heated dry garage. If you reside in
Arizona you wont have any problem. Never put to much catalyst.
Use the prescribed amount for the amount of resin you have.
Note: If the work is the size of a pack of cigarette go with epoxy.
But after reading your comment . The 1969 Lotus must have been built
with polyester resin. There is no fast and easy way to do these repairs.
Do it gradually. One square feet by one square feet. Sanding when you
have finished. When all the sanding is done you'll have to put gelcoat
on that beautifull Lotus. Gelcoating needs a lot of practice. Try to get
a old piece of fiberglass and try it. When you get the touch of it gelcoat
the entire body. You have to be at about 30 inches from the surface and
work your way from top to bottom. Dont put to much because it will be awfull.
It will sag and leave high spots and low spots. You'll have to sand your gelcoat
with fine emery. I would go to a car body repair shop to do that because it
will be the final look of your car. If you have questions please email me at
helene.charest@cgocable.ca I dont use hotmail very much but I will be
glad to help you restore that beautiful Lotus.

Bob

"I would by some cabosyl( that is very very small glass beads"

Actually it's Cab-O-Sil and it's made by the Cabbot Corp. No endorsement.

It's fumed silica, not glass beads. It is used as a thickener.

Small points, I know. But this thread has taken on a life of it's own. Mis-information is not a good thing.

Cheers

Links are soooo great. Thixotropic Silica

Cabbot is actually spelled Cabot.

I knew that.

First and foremost, I must caution you on handling FRP systems. MAKE SURE YOU ARE ALWAYS WORKING IN AN EXTREMELY WELL VENTILATED ENVIRONMENT. Catalyzed Polyester Resins give off FUMES THAT CAN DO PERMANENT DAMAGE TO YOUR SYSTEM. I know, I spent a month in a hospitol. THAT SAID, DON'T BE AFRAID TO TACKLE THE JOB, JUST MAKE SURE YOU ALWAYS WORK IN A WELL VENTILATED ENVIRONMENT. I have 35 years of experience in plastics including FRP. Have made several cars of my own design, all FRP bodied. Simply put, I made a "skin mold" of the "Plug" (car body in your case). The Skin Mold is a Gelcoat and layup of FRP over the body-puttied Plug, which I coated with car wax (non silicone type). You will need to do some studying of FRP systems, but believe me it is not that involved. Critical elements of Mold Release, Cure Time vs Catalyst, Gel-coating, Parting Lines, Molding in Inserts, and Rigidizing the Mold Structure. Two or three days of study type reading will cover all of this plus, with the visual aid of pictures and drawings in most good books specifically on this subject, an enhanced understanding.

Here is a publication by the Gudgeon Brothers re repairing fiberglass boats, most of which were (and many still are) built of fiberglass in a polyester resin matrix. Your Lotus is built the same way as many boats, with lots of mat, little cloth, and polyester resin.

If it were my car (wish it were -- it's one of my all-time favorites) I'd seriously consider repairing it with epoxy resin and glass cloth. This would entail a huge amount of work, because even carefully applied thin cloth in fiberglass will yield a surface that looks pretty smooth until you apply a gloss finish, at which point it looks awful. Lots of filling and sanding is required. I'd sand through most of the gel coat, and then apply a single layer of 4 or 6 oz cloth in epoxy. Finish with no gel coat, substituting linear polyurethane paint (Imron, etc).

The materials used are the same as use in Corvettes of the same era, so spending time talking to Corvette restorers would be well spent. I think most would recommend polyester resins -- and many would consider epoxy resins too expensive, hard to work with, overkill, etc.

Most of the cracks you see are non structural -- old fiberglass is famous for stress cracks in the gel coat that do not go into the laminate itself. On the other hand, ten-year-old Lasers (the world's largest sailboat racing class) are considered by many serious racers to be too "soft" to be competitive, so some actual structural weakening is to be expected. (You don't, however, stand on the roof of your Lotus -- most of the body is effectively non-structural.)

Good luck... any time spent keeping one of these on the road is a gift to humanity!

You will want to practice a lot before you get started, regardless of the resin choice.

I got the impression, right or wrong, that the entire body was cracked and or smashed and/torn. This is not something that any kind of body "patching" can fix. Yes, slight thinning with acetone will aid in patching an area that is crushed or smashed. To the credit of FRP, it will often retain its shape even if it is crushed, provided you gingerly work it back into its original shape. Repairing it then becomes at best a temporary repair, since the application of "new" resin thinned or not, is only a suface bonding to the original material and not a chemical re-linking, if you will.

I once bought a Kelmark FRP body on a VW chassis from a lady in Chicago. Her son had been building it in her garage and a severe snowstorm collapsed the gararge. Needless to say there was every type of impact damage you can think of. That is what started my string of "Skin Molds" and "One Off" car bodies over a period of twenty five years. My son and daughter made a 4 passenger "T" bucket roadster body in this fashion from a mutilated two passenger kit "T" body that I ran across. Oh incidentlly, he was ten at the time and she was thirteen.

Making a mold and then molding a new body isn't as difficult as it sounds and, at the same time, you can improve the body by making it thicker, adding gussets, modifying details, etc... If you are looking to get it back to original, it's not likely gonna happen. I suspect that you are not the original owner, and that the vehicle has evidently been "re-gelcoated", which at best is a temporary fix(good enough to suck in a buyer).

Good Luck

First and formost thank you all for the great info. Quite unbeliveable as to the responses. Greatly appreciated to say the least.

I have posted a few pics. The first shows the body, on dollys and under the body, the frame also on dollys. (Dollys, Harbour Freight, $8.49, 1000lb capacity each). The rear body support is cantilevered over the frame. The front body support is in front of the frame. This arrangement allows better room usage and to very easily move all items about any axis. Pretty sweet if I do say so.

The 2 and 3 pic shows the crack thru. The 4 and 5 shows the stress crack, if that is the correct term.

I think the correlation between this body adn a Vett is probably correct and is a great place for me to spearhead the info search. (Why didn't I think of that?) In addition, back to the original post, I can see there is no easy or relatively easy way to "fix" this glass body. With a few replys sighting health, safety and an expertise that I can only believe comes with "doing", I will be looking for Vett body repair shops also. I say also as I have no idea as to the cost of repair from the "expert" will be. If out of line, then I may be the next expert in training.

That's not as bad as I had imagined. I'd we'd be interested in the outcome, when it's done, with pictures.
I have an old Vette with cracks in the body that I might want to fix someday. I'll need your help then.

Good luck.

Not bad at all. But still a lot of work.

I'm glad you were able to have so much fun on this thread slapping down everyone's posts. I hope you're on your game in the next several days, payback is hell.

Slapping down? Or proving how ignorant I am. It was fun. For me at least.

I don't care. I can take it. Give me your best shot!

I hope us0tsc reads a book or two and does a good job.

It's always fun.........otherwise what would be the point?

I will most assuredly pick up a book or two in addition to visiting the area boat, vett etc repair places and try to pick their brains as to the correct approach. Maybe even help them on their next job. In addition, I am thinking the local Tech school may have something to offer.

Thanks again. This was enlightening and fun! A combination that is rare these days.

Wait! Don't go! You haven't identified the green car in your pics...

It is a modified Renault Fuego.

As it so happens, I currently have one last remaining versions of that fine vehicle. Although mine does remain in its pristine original appearance, it would be wonderful starting place for your fertile imagination.

A small deposit will reserve your selection till Christmas. Act soon before all of the great collector cars vanish.

Green car in pic is a Fiat Spider, 1969 I believe. I will check and post if different.

I am being tormented by the green car. I thought original Elite at first, but the hood is wrong. TVR/Griffith... no not quite. Elva?

I even checked for this possibility. It is a production car, an example of which I worked on in the late 60's/early 70s. Three points for the first correct identification.

A lot of good (and some... er, not so good) advice here. Regardless, you're on the right track in learning all you can prior to jumping into repairs of the Europa (S2) body. Here's another word to the wise (from a guy who has owned and repaired these cars for over 30 yrs now... including one JUST like yours): You should also correct the CAUSE of the body cracking. On the S2 Europa, most of the front-end body cracking can be traced back to either a missing or damaged lower brace (it's a formed sheet metal pan affair which bolts to the bottom "T" of the frame and angles up to enage/bolt to the front "floor" of the nose.) On many of these cars it's either bent or missing (it's a pain in the neck to remove/install since it interferes with the anti-roll bar, etc.). With out it in place, when the car is driven all the up/down motion of the car (bumps, etc.) is carried into the nose by (only!) the top surfaces of the fenders and nose. Think of the nose section as an "overhang" for everything forward of the frame "T"--basically, everything in front of the mini-trunk above the footwell--as the car goes up and down the unsupported nose does a flex like a diving board... cracking at the tops of both wheel arches and also near the front trunk lid corners (where fenders meet upper nose.

In most cases, you can prevent FURTHER destruction--or ensure longevity of your repairs--by modifying/fabricating a new nose support which utilizes the bottom frame "T" attacments and incorporates weight-bearing "struts" which tie into (bolted) the front bumper assembly (think 3/8" chrome moly tubes with "ears" at the ends... ears receive the bumper bolts inside the nose... using the existing bumper bolts and assembly to help support the very front of the car).

Another hint: NEVER carry the spare tire in the nose (in the designed for space)... it puts too much load on the nose and makes the diving-board effect even worse. Leave the spare tire at home and simply call a flat bed truck if/when you have a tire problem. Much cheaper in the long run.

Oh... and one other thing; they fellow who referred to the Renault engine as cast iron couldn't be further from the truth. The Renault R16 engine adapted for the S2 Europa was ALL aluminum--block, head, etc--with wet (cast iron) cylinder liners, a hemi head, steel crank, etc. Chapman ("Mr. Lotus") bought them from Renault as "uprated units" With only MILD massaging they easily put out ~120hp. Quit a good power-to-weight ratio for a car that only weighs (mine) 1340 lbs.

Cheers.

Is this car an S1, S1a or b or an S2.........??? That changes the possible engine installed....The OP neglected to mention which model he has bought, bolted chassis or glued for example.....

Hello and long time no post.

I appreciated and enjoyed the previous posts so I thought I would post an update. I think the pics are self explanatory but I will give a short story for giggles. I studied up on fglass repair, talked to untold number of people, businesses, friends etc and came to the conclusion; "a man's got to know his limitations" so I found a Vette repair expert shop and hired them to repair and repaint the body. Glad I did. They fixed all, found additional thru cracks and spiders and weak factory fglass that I probably would not have. They even added their touch; urethane paint in the engine bay, under the 4 wheel openings and the front nose section. Very nice.

By the way; this car is a Lotus Europa 1969 S2 from Canada I believe. There are S1 parts on it also for whatever the reason. Maybe "use up the parts bin" change over.

So time has passed. The body is fixed. I grit blasted the frame, repaired the rust by welding in new metal and painted it. The motor, which is a Renault, aluminum block and head, hemi has been taken apart and reassembled. I basic wired it up, (battery, ignition switch, starter and distributor only) and the bugger started right up! COOL! Although there seemed to be a lot of gas blown out the carb but that's for another day.

On a side note; this is my first auto that I have ever "rebuilt". Friends, family etc thought I was nuts! (Some truth to that, I guess.) It has been, still is, a great experiance; I am having a blast! I hope to have it on the road by spring, but I am under no timeline. How cool is that?!

The work does indeed look great. I wish you the absolute best with the project. Very seldom is a project like yours practical. You must do it for the enjoyment. Weather it is the challenge of the project, the challenge of a repair, or just the chalange of completing and driving something as unique as that is. I hope that you learned as much as you could from the glass experts, and now feel that you would tackle another repair on another glass body if needed. Hopefully not as large a project as this was. I find it is usually best to start small and work up to bigger projects.

Enjoy yourself, and ignore the crowd that can not understand your passion. Good luck and keep the pictures comming.

Thank you for the kind and quite frankly very true words. Much appreciated.

I repair and paint fibreglass cars in Manchester 01617038427 ask for Paul http://www.flickr.com/photos/59219582@N03/?saved=1

Looks great, thanks for the update.

Where are you in the world?

Thanks. I am in Wisconsin, USA.

I don't know whether I ever mentioned it but the Rover (and MG) Aluminium 3.5 liter V8 used to be fitted to some Lotus cars, the Europa was done at least once privately.....it was lighter than the original French cast iron engine in the S1.

Yes, I believe this was done by Lotus owners, kind of like the USA Hot Rods modifying cars. From memory that was a 215 cu in. motor which used to be a GM. GM sold all manufacturing equipment molds etc of that motor to British Leland, which in turn manufactured the motor and put it into a few of their product lines. Also, I think the S1 had the aluminum block and head Renault, 1465cc 821-02 type motor.

The 215 V8 was used in the 61 to 63 small Buick, Oldsmobile, and Pontiacs that they sold. Later sold to Roots, and appeared in the TR8. What else I do not know. It did have many of the design fearures found on the Buick V6, and the leter Buick V8 engines. Timing chain components, oil pump, and cylinder head design as I recall,