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Alkaline Batteries

05/22/2011 8:55 PM

Hey heres one for ya and I really need good answers please. Like before all inputs are welcome.

Question 1, when is a battery really dead, Like is a SLA battery dead at the same voltage as an Alkaline battery.

Question2, I have heard of battery rejuvenation, what causes that and how long will it last?

Hope I can better understand what a dead battery is regardless of how it's enrergy is produced!

Gary

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#1

Re: Alkaline

05/22/2011 10:24 PM

Q1A A battery is dead when it can no longer do the required task.

Q1B No, a SLA battery and an alkaline battery will not be considered dead at the same voltage. At full charge a SLA will produces 2V an alkaline has 1.5V. Also the discharge curves of reserve power for each chemistry will be different. So starting with 3 SLA cells and 4 alkaline cells will both produce 6V initially but when these battery packs reach half of their available energy they will produce completely different voltages. It also greatly depends on the type of load one places on the battery.

Q2 Battery rejuvenation is when some of the charge of a fully discharged battery returns to the battery through no known external charging. When this happens, it happens very slowly. One can never get back a full battery charge through this mechanism. What causes this gradual rejuvenation will depend on battery chemistry (both type of chemistry and the circumstances of the particular cells), temperatures and some say the background EMI. I would be startled to find a cell that self charged to 10% of its initial energy.

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#4
In reply to #1

Re: Alkaline

05/23/2011 3:33 PM

Q2. Is there a way to add a charge to an alkaline battery and use it at the same time, thus activating the rejuvenation process and draw. Like a slow stream in to a tank and a drain at the other end. wouldn't it slow down the consumption.

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#5
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Re: Alkaline

05/23/2011 3:37 PM

I was a bit worried but I see that you are half way around the world so no problem.

Recharging alkaline batteries is a fools game.

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#6
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Re: Alkaline

05/23/2011 3:41 PM

Not really because rejuvenation is why a formally "dead" battery will get back some of its energy without applying a recharging current. What you are trying to do is recharge a battery by applying current. Now not all battery chemistries will permit recharging. Rayovac use to make a rechargeable alkaline battery, but the energy density was 1/4 a regular alkaline and the total number of recharge cycles was relatively small. Not all batteries that can self rejuvenate will self rejuvenate.

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#7
In reply to #1

Re: Alkaline

05/24/2011 2:19 PM

A couple of clarifications or amplifications:

Q1A ... and in many chemistries for rechargeable batteries, trying to draw more current from a dead battery can permanently damage it.

Q1B: It is worth noting, for the sake of the OP, who seems unfamiliar with batteries, that batteries are usually cells connected in series. For example, a 12V SLA car battery consists of 6 cells in series, with each cell having a full-charge voltage of about 2.1 volts, for a full charge battery voltage of 12.6 volts. This terminology, however gets almost constantly misused with regard to small cells (typical flashlight "batteries", etc) which are routinely single cells but called "batteries".

Q2 Battery rejuvenation is when some of the charge of a fully discharged battery returns to the battery through no known external charging.

This term is more often used in conjunction with SLA batteries, and refers to the reversal of sulfation (lead sulfate crystals, which accumulate especially when the battery is at a low charge level) by repeated charging to just short of the gassing voltage. It is also used to describe a process in NiMH cells in which very high currents are pushed through (briefly) to break up dendritic crystals. Here, the current source is apt to be something like a welder. I would not recommend this (second) practice, because one can easily imagine the cell exploding.

"Recovery" is the term more often used to mean the spontaneous increase in voltage that occurs slowly (over 10 - 20 minutes or more) after removing a load from a battery. This is what sometimes allows a car to start after you've turned off the lights (which you inadvertently left on) and waited for the battery to regain its strength.

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#9
In reply to #7

Re: Alkaline

05/25/2011 9:30 AM

Yes, I got the terms rejuvenation and recovery transposed. GA.

I'm not sure that it matters with the OP but while one is rejuvenating a NIMH or SLA battery one will certainly not be drawing power from them, too. I presume one could design a circuit to switch between the three modes of discharge, charge and rejuvenate. But I would expect that this would be dangerous to the battery and the local vicinity. So I wouldn't want this to be an automatic function.

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#2

Re: Alkaline Batteries

05/23/2011 3:56 AM

It is possible to recharge a zinc-carbon battery using lop-sided AC, i.e. an AC waveform where the +going wave is bigger than the -going wave. Amateur electronics magazines have shown useful circuits in the past.

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#3

Re: Alkaline Batteries

05/23/2011 10:53 AM

No specific answers to your questions, but if you want to learn more about batteries in general, check out Battery University here:

BatteryUniversity

The site is provided by Cadex, and company that makes chargers/analyzers for the battery industry, so may be a bit biased, but I have learned a lot from their informational site.

Tom D.

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#8

Re: Alkaline Batteries

05/25/2011 8:12 AM

Question2 Battery Rejuvenation means to restore it to an original condition.

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#10

Re: Alkaline Batteries

05/25/2011 9:50 AM

So it appears that the general concincise, Alkaline batteries put off hydrogen and could be explosive?

Why aren't engineers taking the alkaline production of hydrogen to the nth?

True or not?

Great replies from eveyone and thanks. Is their a battery that is cacpable of low level voltage drains and many charges?

Gary

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#11
In reply to #10

Re: Alkaline Batteries

05/25/2011 10:19 AM

Who said anything about hydrogen? If you're not going to speak up, we're going to have to gag you. (What?) GAG HIM!

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#12
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Re: Alkaline Batteries

05/25/2011 10:32 AM

Lead acid batteries can generate hydrogen - not alkaline.

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#13

Re: Alkaline Batteries

05/25/2011 10:55 PM

Just a few more links to helpful information...

Electropaedia
http://www.mpoweruk.com/index.htm

Energizer Tech Info: (Not limited to just Energizer brand batteries.)
Battery Handbooks: Comprehensive manuals (PDF) covering standard primary cell chemistries
http://data.energizer.com/Static.aspx?Name=AppManuals

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