New Patent Oct 2012 Home Wind Energy

I'm surprised you didn't imbed a link: http://www.ebay.com/itm/PATENTED-Attic-Vent-Wind-Turbine-Generator-PATENTED-OCT-2012-/320877566615?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item4ab5cb1a97

thank you I don't know how to make a link. I want to say every manufacturer makes motors, no one makes generators. eddie

So what amount of actual power does this thing produce continuously?

Also how do you justify its $1500 price tag?

" I want to say every manufacturer makes motors, no one makes generators."

Huh? You gotta be from California....

The GTI unit, http://www.ebay.com/itm/THE-NEW-300-WATT-GRID-TIE-INVERTER-14-28VDC-110-VAC-/221001745445?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item3374bb0425 $89

Turbine head, http://www.ebay.com/itm/Air-Vent-Attic-Aire-Turbine-Head-52606-/400277856983?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item5d326b62d7 $29.99

PM alternator, http://www.ebay.com/itm/MAXAMP-PMA-Permanent-Magnet-Alternator-Generator-PC1212-/251165300493?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item3a7a9e570d $188

I see about $350 at best worth of off the shelf eBay parts in the whole thing.

I hope you didn't mortgage your house to get the patent on this.

Itwill last longer than anything else in this field i see 20= years you should have read the whole discription on e-bay befor you shout. eddie and the sky is not falling

Congratulations and good luck.

Just as a side note, how many do you have to sell at $1500 to pay for the patent and material costs (ie- how many do you have to sell before you see a profit)?

to make up for the 5 years of living and trying everything, loosing my wife and maybe my home, but that just doesn't matter anymore about 70,000. 4 heart attacks and now a pacemaker, it was not worth it. I have made and tested the as i see it the perfect match of materials that wont wear out. eddie

Sorry to here about that.

to make up for the 5 years of living and trying everything, loosing my wife and maybe my home, but that just doesn't matter anymore about 70,000. 4 heart attacks and now a pacemaker, it was not worth it.

About as succinct and real-world an answer I've heard regarding an inventor working his way through the current patent system.

_{Jack - Just the one patent - didn't make a dime but didn't lose anything either so count that as a win.}

well jack check out the new patent laws----guarenteed to get a patent in less than one year. not three like mine. but the cost is hold on and thank the solor people.

$28,000 each if it is just point blank good and no discrepencies. now lets see the next patents.

There's nothing guaranteed in getting a patent. Even after extensive patent searches, it's surprising how things pop up to negate the novelty requirement. Even our simple, no-contest patents have taken closer to 2 years to get to grant status, and that under the UK/European patent laws, which I believe is the system towards which the US is moving.

Jus' sayin'

thanks i needed that, just a little encourgment. I dont have anyone to talk to now. but i am holding out. eddie

Where did the 216 KWH/month come from? It says in the Q & A's on ebay '1 unit is 21.6 KWH PER MONTH'

Must have misread something me thinks

the math started like this question how many amps are in a killowatt. answer all that you can find and paint. that is the only answer i can give you. eddie

A cryptic answer eh?...I like puzzles But right now I just dont have the time, I was simply highlighting the discrepency (for whatever reason) between TCMTechs maths and your answer on E-bay. I got solar, so its all irrelevant to me personally.

Cheers

Daniel

Wow how cheap was your panels?? I am a 40+years of airliner structural engineering. If your panel mounts are aluninum you are going to replace them in less than 10 years or they are going to rot away in the elements. Also how expensive is it to clean them every 6 months like the panel manufacturer says. And last how many hours a day do they work. Do you hve a large screen tv?? or custom stero in your car? not cheap are they. tvs made to last 6 years. radios unknown. My wind gen's have been working 4 years and not touched yet and working 24/7s. thanks good i like your answer.

Where did the 216 KWH/month come from?

This is copied directly from the Ebay listing:

THE ONLY PATENTED, Safe,Dependable, Affordable, system, Generate your own electric discount. Each unit can lower your bill 216 KWH per month.

This is, of course, completely untrue. Even 21.6 kWh per month is completely wrong for an efficient wind turbine of this size in an average wind area.

Here is an example of a more efficient unit of slightly larger projected area: it is advertised to produce 10 watts, but only in winds from 9 to 44 mph (whereas the average wind across the US is 8 mph). This engineered unit is advertised with a real output curve, which you can see in the Amazon ad: 6 watts in 8 mph wind. So the GudCraft unit would produce, over a month: 6 watts x 24hr x 30 days = 4.3 kWh per month.

The Incognito unit has a little less projected area and can be expected to be substantially less efficient, because vent turbines are designed for low efficiency, so that they rotate slowly and can be cheaply made (no precision balancing) and quiet. So, perhaps one could generate 2kWh per month: $.20 worth in many locations. Its construction appears crude, and would not meet electrical code, but it might last for ten years. So in ten years, at $.20 per month savings, a customer will have saved $.20 x 120 = $24.

Thus the only issue, (other than the bad math and ludicrous claims) is pricing. If this unit could be priced at about $24, then it could pay for itself over 10 years.

My Garmin Nüvi shows my average speed as something in the range of 430-650 MPH, depending on driving conditions, traffic and so forth, and how often I reset it; the point being there is no point - decimal point, that is. Garmin's programmers forgot to include one!

Hey, it's all SPAM in a can to me!

SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAN...

[I have my solar PV panel power my roof attic fan, and the savings are great regarding lower cooling needs during the spring, summer and fall. And I don't need anything else but my 7.56kW of solar PV on the roof!]

Why hasn't this obvious advert been moved to the "Commercial" Forum?

Where are Admin when you need 'em?

I see it has now!

Who is that Masked Man?

- We jus' call him Ad-min

The reson why it hasn't moved to commercial forum is it seems that many that read the materails are not understanding that I am NOT a company with money! It seems also it takes common sense to understand it with the abblitty to ask questions about it with interest on how to get envolved for our planets' environment.

This system is not for sale! its free information to community size structures needs therfore no one can make money from it. Ity seems like as long as 1 person don't care about the others without the abblity to afford the solar systems panels, This systems is for a community NOT 1 person.

I think it is a safe bet that English Rose was not expressing concern over your endeavor, but instead over this thread in particular. In fact, this thread has already been moved to the commercial space... making your post all the more out of place.

You may want to read the FAQs for this site. They suggest that you should stay on topic. You can perhaps see that, given that this thread is about a system that has been offered for sale, your statement "This systems is not for sale!" seems non-sensical. You are apparently writing about your own system, which could be described in a different thread, if you choose to do so.

Thanks Ken!

kennynabb6: You might find it easier to follow if you use the "nested" layout for posts...then it's more obvious that I'm replying to the OP and not the last post (if yours was the one before mine). Welcome to CR4

I gotta say that the claims are crapp, there is no way that a wind turbine attic like fan unit will generate that much power. It aint so!! The close proximity to the roof will kill any significant wind energy and further it that small fan is getting even one KW of power, you need wind insurance for your shingles / roof. This has no charts, and I believe no chance of going forward. Woody

theory is an unproven fact.

hi woody, have you ever really sat down and looke4d at a attic vent turbine???

why is it shaped like that? why are they still working after 174 MPH winds in virginia and carolina's. because the wind folds in on the shape and keeps it going no faster than 600 rpm. it cost me a lot of time and money to find that out now go buy a turbine and a tachometer and test it.

This is a great Ideal. Now put this same ideal with a cone shape & solar heat engine and you have a more energy power systems that can be more powerfull. It's called renewable thermal wind power. The energy site for public ed site is the same wording all one word. Also input from globle spec's leaders in hydraulics systems.

I did some more digging while having breakfast this morning and things get even worse for this scam.

I found this Darius rotor type wind turbine design that is somewhat more honest rated at 60 watts peak output plus has the exact same alternator as the OP's unit for $239.

http://www.prestowind.com/?mainURL=/store/category/eshd/Presto_Wind_TM_Products.html

Vs

Given an approximate physical scaling of 6:1 I would say the roof vent driven unit might put out around 10 watts in a high wind which if carried out for an unrealistically month long time span might add up to around 10 x 24 x 31 = 7440 watts before conversion.

Personally I would be inclined to think that in a high wind location under ideal wind condition that OP's unit may produce around 2.16 KWH's returned per month giving its $1500 price tag when weighted against a rather high 12 cent per KWH works out as, (1500/.12 = ~5787)/2.16 = ~2679 months or about 223.26 years to break even!

Ha Ha! We posted at about the same time. So two people on opposites sides of the country, working independently can come up with remarkably similar output estimates: about 2 kWh per month. (So this stuff doesn't work by magic after all!)

It's just a pricing issue. At $24 this unit would be an OK deal, if only it were UL listed.

I assume the OP will change the typo on his add to read 2.16 kWh/month. He just forgot to put in the decimal point.

Change the output rating by a factor of 100 times less and the price by 20 times less and now he's got something remotely plausible to sell.

Still scratching my head on this part though, "I am a 40+ years of airliner structural engineering."

WTF? 40+ years of working around aircraft engineers yet never picked up on basic aerodynamics theory plus could not find anyone who could help him out with what should be basic aerodynamics electrical related math concepts on this project?

(Good lord, I have a high school dropout level job where I drive a truck and put fuel in trains and I can hack it at that level of aerodynamic and electrical math!)

Now I am just being snarky.

Here are the EBAY producer responses, downloaded info; this wack job of a power generator is supposed to produce, here the power is 21.6kw. The design is not working on a full charge, and is basically a fraud without UL rating. It is STATED that it is to be plugged in WITH AN EXTENTION CORD. Lets have that inspected, gawd what a cludge up elementary school science fair project. Half a bubble off plumb.

Questions from other members : PATENTED Attic Vent Wind Turbine Generator PATENTED OCT 2012

Question & Answer Answered On Q: Hello I was looking at your turbine , and Im planning on puttin on a new roof and before I do that I would like to know , 1 does your system just plug into the outlets or is ther some wiring involved? 2 what needs to be done to store the made electricty?? Joe Aug-09-12 A: Hello, this generator systems plugs directly into a 110 volt, standard plug, you might need a extension cord. If you want to save electric power this is the wrong system for you this is grid tied, the electric is just enough to cut out some of your lights, and appliences in day time and lower your bills. the system is not ment for batteries. look at your electric bill now, see how much you want to deduct, 1 unit is 21.6 KWH A MONTH 3 units is 64.8 KWH IF YOU REMOVE YOUR BILL YOU HAVE TO HAVE AN AGREEMENT AND CONTRACT WITH YOUR UTILITY CO AND A $5-8000INVERTER ON THE SIDE OF YOUR HOUSE SO YOU CAN SENT IT THRU THE GRID AND GET PAID. You really don't want to remove more than 3/4 of your bill if you already have solar panels you make out with lots of cash with the extra electric especially at knight, hope this answers your questions Q: Hi, I don't have a vent on my roof already? How would you install one?? Is there a power output estimator? I live on the Southern Oregon Coast with lots of wind. Jul-29-12 A: one, go to home depotand buy one Lomanco GT 12 inch attic vent. put it together outside and then place it on the roof with tape. watchit for a couple of days to make sure you have the best spot with good wind speed. when you find the spot cut a hole (12 inches) and install the base. put the tubine back in the box for the next one. Install the gen-e-verter out of the smaller box I send. and follow directions in box. the power estimater is 300 watts in good wind. or 400rpm to 500rpm of turbine. 300 watts for 12 hours is 7200watts or 72 watt hours per day.times 30 days in a month makes 226 watt hours. check that againest your bill and remember this unit will last at least 20 years, so one time investment that only you know about. This works perfect with solar, as it works nights too. Myphone 1if you want more info. eddie Q: I live in Phoenix Arizona, the wind here is more than most people think,so no problem there. That being said, just how robust are your bearing? I've already had expoaed fan bearings seize up on an A/C unit less than ten years old. Can these bearings be serviced or replaced? This is a great idea since most larger cities will balk at the triditional "wind mill" type generator "what if my child (17 year old hoodlem trying to steal something) climbs up there and gets hit by the propeller or falls I'm gonna hafta sue"....You know what I mean... Jul-22-12 A: if you live in phoenix, i livein mesa with 3 running most of the time, my phone is i will answer any questions you have.

What's the patent number? If it is patented, all the relevant details are publicly available and verified easily enough.

That number would be: 8283799

The provisional was filed around the same time that somebody thought it was a great idea on the ecomagination site. A novel feature of the device is the fact that the AC power plug (item 46 in the drawings) is inverted, so that when unplugged, the live conductors are more easily contacted. This should help flush uncautious people from the population.

correct patent number but i don't understand what you are saying about inverted plug?? If this is wrong how can i correct it? eddie

Throughout the world, the thing that supplies the power does not have prongs sticking out. The thing receiving the power has prongs.

Dead qiveaway. Don't you see? This thing is an attic-fan-powered taser. First line of defense stuff. You don't wanna be burgled through your vent hole do you? Hmm..that didn't come out right.

pmsl ! The thing might be more efficient if rammed up the ****. Converting beans into power sounds a bit more credible from what I've read so far.

GA.

[1st-grade electrocution victim thanks to a 'suicide' extension cord which had male plugs at both ends.]

Grievance noted.

I thought I would take the high road and just discuss the specifics regarding Kenny's product with my Electrical Inspector, Product Designer and Patent Holder hats on, afterall, bad math won't kill people like a flawed consumer product design.

How the hell did your blood-sucking leach of a patent attorney actually put such a thing in the patent drawing

You know as well as I do that a patent doesn't necessarly guarentee a device that will work or is safe. Looking at the product from another point of view it makes perfect sense in a way to have a plug on the end because it means you don't need any fancy fixed wiring installation or involvement of an electrician, which is a great product marketing plus!

The main reason I posted was to clearly explain WHY this was not a good idea, as Kenny (and any other interested readers) may not be aware of the downsides.

My favorate patents are still an electronic device with only one connection to the positive side of the battery and my all time favorate city missile defense shield using soap bubble covered in grit.

Grievance Note.

Kenny Has nothing to do with atic fans in any order.

The system was in ref only to the facts of thermal wind from atic only, & suggested if inclosed into a cone shape roof, then the volvume of air flow wood increase.

For thoses that think I need a engineer to help put this system together WRONG. It has already been done, NO BIG MONEY will be allowed to get involved with this project.

This is in the structure phase now & will stay privet. Only the information to any community that wants their own power systems will then be released with the 20 year none discloser filled, So as to keep out big money.

As for the public fliers' is for the community meetings travel cost NOTHING MORE. If you have read the web site then you should know that NOTHING is for sale! The system is free as the inventor giving back as a veteran to his country. How dare you! don't you have respect for disabled persons.

For thoses that have read the web site you will know that I am a reteired army vet. & don't really care if you or any body gets involved or not, Communitys around the world have met with me and in process of discloser.

This systems does not have batterys, regular generators with hydraulic accumlators to drive the gens. as a energy storage systems.

Thanks for your concerans.

Kenny Has nothing to do with atic fans in any order.

Oops, my mistake. I did in fact mean incognitoeddie as the original poster, not you as the other poster.

Same kinds spelling errors from both posters. Same writing style. Same attitude towards others here. Lots of 'sames'.

You'd almost think it was the same poster.......

At his listed price level plus the fact he wont/can't/doesn't have any valid info to give out relating to its as tested or true power output I rather doubt that anyone will spend any money on it.

There are clever AE scams and then there are the paint sniffers like this. Fortunately these types tend to starve to death before they ever break even on their efforts.

I also looked up the specs for most of the PM type alternators based on the same Delco 10 and 12SI size units and not one has a 300 watt or higher output rating in the 400 - 500 RPM range as he mentioned to me in his eBay reply I posted earlier.

This is the highest output unit I could find in the same alternator design that appears to have honest rated specs I could come up with in a quick search.

http://www.windbluepower.com/Permanent_Magnet_Alternator_Wind_Blue_High_Wind_p/dc-520.htm

12 volts 25 amps/300 Watts @ 2000 RPM and costs around $300+

The more I dig on this concept the worse this design looks. Go figure.

The more I dig on this concept the worse this design looks. Go figure.

Interestingly enough the safety concerns of this product mean it is not suitable for sale as it is at this time, regardless of any other issues (such as it being inferior to existing products on the market or a potential scam as others have mentioned, which I am not going to get into this time).

Being out-of-pocket is one thing, being electrocuted and dead is another.

Haha.....its called a 'suicide lead', being a former electrical safety inspector Jack, im sure you have seen a few of those in your time. Primary use, albeit highly illegal, is plugging one end into your generator when your power is out, and the other end into your wall socket livening up your house circuit (which I assume the OP is proposing), and removing the need for a changeover switch (which is far to safe and costly in some peoples eyes). Works well, just not if you happen to be a child playing down the road near downed power lines, or a linesperson trying re-instate supply after some from of natural distaster. Happens everytime we have a cyclone up north here. Moral of the story: test before you touch - everytime.

True, and they do work (and are relatively safe if proper islanding of the home is conducted and the home's main switch isolated and tagged to prevent inadvertent closing) but we have lost a few good linesmen because of it. This is why (down here) we always earth the power lines when working on them, because you never know when the line could become live.

Jack - Guilty of using a 'suicide lead' on an occasion (but in my defence a controlled testing laboratory application).

Yeah, the lineys earth the powerlines in breakdown/shutdowns up here (Far North Queesnland). I assume it is standard safe practise everywhere. As you say though, although quite rare, we have lost a few good linesperson's/electricians over the years due to the practise. Very sad indeed .

That's why although you have measured and know the line is dead, you ground to ensure it stays that way.

We almost lost an electrician who did not follow this rule and isolated the supply by switching a circuit breaker in a switchboard in another room while he worked, not realising the building workers commonly blow and reset the circuit breakers. The circuit breaker was accidentally reset and the electrician learned why it is always a good idea to tag the associated switch or circuit breaker rather than assuming someone will not accidentally turn it on.

_{Jack - No electricians were injured in the making of this post.}

Roger that, danger tags and detailed isolation procedures arnt there just for the hell of it.

Whats the go with earthing 3 -phase lines. Eg: If you had a 3 - phase generator back-feeding the grid, and a lineperson crossed phase to phase? Even in an insulated bucket, and with each phase earthed to ground, there would still be the chance of getting a good 'tingle', no? Forgive my ignorance; im of a mechanical background, and my elctrical knowledge is limited to the red (brown), black(blue) and green/yellow.

For example (for overhead power lines) after checking there is no voltage present on the power lines each phase is individually bonded to earth. That way the lines are as safe as they are going to get. Even in the event of the line(s) becoming live the shorted line will fault directly to ground and trip the upstream protection (disconnecting the current) and the voltage rise will be low at the point the linesmen are working (preventing electrocution in the event they are touching the line when it is momentarily live).

Even still it is common practice (I believe) to always assume the lines could become live and so not to take unnecessary chances (for example using high voltage protective gloves and covers even on dead or partially dead lines).

The last time I was up in the air in a bucket was in the middle of a substation, with a linesman, who only had 9 fingers.

9 fingers? .....thats one more than the average pesron.

"Jack - No electricians were injured in the making of this post."

No, but a lot of electrons were inconvenienced by your sending it.

Well, this thing doesn't make enough power to thin out the gene pool.

So, it'll just keep the slower ones from licking the plug when it isn't plugged in.

Yes it is true! 1 person can't power a community nor can be heard over the noise of others. Now many can be a big turn around to help others with the same approuch to a better environment & lower electric bills for all in a community.

Who are you?

How did you come to insert yourself into this thread?

Would you pay $1,500.00 USD for this contraption? We pay about $.09/per kWh for electricity here in Mesa. You do the math.

Just curious.

Me thinks incognitoeddie and kennynabb6 are the same person. Somebody just happened to sign himself in under the wrong personality for this thread.

Granted multiple personalities plus a bit of medication issues (too much or not enough) could explain a bunch!

And I just spotted someone else posting on lyn's oven thread using the same avatar as fast eddie. Got me quite confusaled

The guy in central Arkansas is OK. I grew up in central AR.

Now, I live in Mesa where the other avatar resides.

That's ok then...

English Rose

NO! We are not the same!

I am the inventor of renewablethermalwindpower.com Not the atic fan system, although the air flow from the atic is a small way to use the heat in the atic. I don't understand where the output is so high, rather the flow concept of the system is sound.

I have posted a public awearness site for this proven systems known as the best combinations of wind & solar together in 1 structure.

I suggest before going speeking without knowledge of facts get the information reveiw.

Thanks for the lack of real (questions).

Your web site is all fluff and no substance!!!!

Typical of the HHO/Brown's gas/perpetual energy clown's web sites.

Lots of fancy words about saving the world, but not a shred of meaningful data to substantiate any claims about this "proven system".

At least Ed has a product.

It's common knowledge of facts from proven world wide research unv. it's the lack of common sence that makes people sound off like you that makes a good thing Questionable! lack of everday things from nature.

You wrote, "It's common knowledge of facts from proven world wide research unv."

Kenny,

Get a grip. Your web site is a joke. It is a scam. There is nothing there, but air.

And, I have enough common sense to know that you have nothing to offer society, except a chance to accept their money for your noble cause. Whatever that may be.

Good Luck.

Well the only joke is on the people that can't see how the system works. Not the disablity's of the person that has put it together with engineers as the structures' inner workings from very important researchers from around the world. First you need to have common sense to understand what is involved.

It's NOT FOR SALE get it I make nothing. Sir you get a grip on the facts that some very smart people have spent most of their lives doing good work over their disablitys.

Now think & have some respect.

Kenny, you seem so convinced everyone here is a complete fool, which naturally begs the question: "Why are you still here? Self-flagellation? A masochistic streak, perhaps? Here for your fair share of abuse?"

I don't get it. What is it, exactly, that you are hoping to accomplish here, and why did you come in the first place? For applause? For condemnation? To shore up a sagging Persecution Complex? Do you need to leave here feeling justified once more that "Everybody's a fool! See! What'd I tell you!?"

This isn't the first time you've encountered resistance to your poorly-executed ideas, I'll wager. Whatever it is you came for, I'm sure you're getting it - as planned.