GMO Tied To Bee Decline?

I should have copied the references from the other thread. There were only two - an antenna design book and a college physics text.

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In reference to Q factor

Where Q=XL/R=2ΠfL/R - ISBN 0-07-057138-4 - page 133

Without further reference I will suggest that the nervous system, or parts there of, has higher concentration of sodium and potassium ions than the body as a whole; thus affecting the R variable in the equation; in addition to very different and very significant symmetry.

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In the bee post I used the term "action potential" - assuming it meant the operating EMF of the voltage controlled ion gates. It was the wrong term.

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I don't know what the representative Q factor of the different parts of the human nervous system is either, - but I am confident, through the process of electromagnetic induction using low power, finely tuned RF, the heart rate and possibly; the three time differentiated functions of heart rhythm; could be monitored.

I wouldn't care to guess the basis of the DARPA "Silent Talk" technology.

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But thats no reason not to beat that kid up for considering field densities and band widths of Micro-wave radiation to Bee Decline. Somebody has got to teach folks not to question the "argument of expertise" - because in many cases, thats the most expedient thesis that can be presented; without having to review the fundamental principles involved.

Thanks for the input. I don't have the knowledge to comment one way or the other on the cell phone/EMF/RF connection to the bee decline, but I don't think it should be discarded.

I found a link to some studies that were done, but from my amateur prospective, I'm not sure that it's proof. It says that when the phones buzzed, it threw off the bee's behavior.

I guess my next question would be: Are they sure it's the EMF, or is it the annoying buzzing sound inside the hive? We know that Africanized honeybees go completely nuts with the introduction of certain sounds/frequencies....like a lawnmower.

http://inhabitat.com/its-official-cell-phones-are-killing-bees/

That little neural pathway shown in the bee picture in post number 163 - If there is internal continuity or sheathing - it becomes a resonator.

Mr. Faraday taught us that conductivity is a function of structure and valence; when we introduce chemicals that are incorporated into that resonant structure; or expose resonant capable structures to fundamental or harmonic frequencies - there will be effect.

The laws of physics are universal. If long thin continuous membranes exist as part of the honey bee's nervous system, then the potential for resonant effect exists. It now becomes only a matter of scale; perhaps defined by frequency resolution, field density, polarization, and target circuit inductance; where target circuit acceptance is further defined by symmetry, conductivity, and the unstressed operating energy density.

The 'Silent Talk' has mainly utilized either noninvasive or invasive EEG probes/electrodes.

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Thinking about it... there are a lot of people who wear EEGs for a 24 hour period, or order to assess their typical day (to look for clues about seizures for example).

If the nerve system were acting as a resonator in some of the people donning EEGs, if some incident EM wave began exciting the resonator/nervous system wouldn't it be highly likely that the EEG readings would provide some indication that the excited nervous system was re-radiating?

It seems like any meaningful effect would have been noticed by now....

I think there has been some misunderstanding. I certainly ran with my part of it....Let's see if we can back up a couple steps and unravel this.

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I think the ambiguity of my statement in comment #198 introduced the misunderstanding. I should have been more clear.

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The 1st sentence is merely a comment on what has been utilized for 'Silent Talk'.

Writing that made be think about how often EEGs are worn and your earlier comment;

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'....Again, it is this effect (electrical resonance) that could explain why only a small number of people, out of a large population group, would be affected when exposed to the same electromagnetic environment.....'

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I should have made the transition more clear. The point was that if certain people are affected by various frequencies, if the effect is strong enough to be of concern, it should have some effect on brain waves. Because people often are asked to journal their activities, there is a huge amount of data relating activity/location to variations in brain waves. If there was an effect, the possibility that it would have gone unnoticed for the decades EEG use with journals....is infinitesimally small.

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There is the possibility that a resonance could be set up in the central nervous system, and that somehow it causes damage but has no effect on brain waves, but I find this highly suspect.

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The comment about 'genetic info to offspring' was a (poor) attempt at humor. My cape was, as you noted, already donned at that point, and my alter ego has a notoriously difficult time relating the things he find humorous, as translated through the lens of his comments on an engineering blog.

The idea was that the complexity required for a wave to resonate in such a way as to wreak havoc but not affect brain waved would require either design or evolution to that end (either of which seem like ridiculous proposals).

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Whether currently my cape is donned or doffed, I remain troubled by the biological resonance induced disease idea especially for something the size of bees ,as I attempt to reconcile the ideas that:

- At microwave frequencies, the biological effect would be induction heating (agreed)

- Given that microwaves are generally classified as having wavelengths between 1 mm and 1 m, 1/4 wavelength, .4 wavelength and 1/2 wavelength are clearly covered by microwave frequencies for bees (and most humans as well), if we are considering body length.....so 'induced voltage via skin effect' shouldn't be of high concern.

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My work is done here. Up up and away!

Hey, here is another interesting fact that I think was severely misstated somewhere earlier in this discussion about the dangers of cellphone frequencies (specifically to bees).

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Cell phone frequencies range from around 800 MHz to about 1900 Mhz. This means the smallest wavelength is about 16 cm or if you prefer, something larger than 6 inches.

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With the exception of things like carefully designed active or fractal antennae, a lengths below 1/4 wavelength affects drop off very rapidly.

So 1/4 wavelength of the smallest wave would be about 4 cm or roughly 1.5 inches.

Adult worker honey bees are about 1/3 that size, ...about 1/2 inch.

Now that is a reasonable argument; and thanks for the reference to "fractal antennae" - an interesting technology indeed.

Now what I am going to say here is again, off topic, and unrelated to any environmental effect of non-ionizing radiation.

I have always wanted to design a mobile (a piece of moving art) that was powered from ambient broad spectrum RF radiation. At first glance it appears using an array of "fractal Antennas" might achieve the broad spectrum inductance required.

Anyone for charging a cell phone from ambient radiation?

I like the idea of charging a phone with ambient RF. Have estimated the minimum reasonably functional size?

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As for the mobile art piece, I think a big light weight black and yellow rc plane reminiscent of a bumble bee might be interesting. If the ambient RF failed to provide enough thrust to keep it in the air, the blame for the bee's demise could be placed squarely on the those responsible for RF transmission.... you know, for not doing enough.

If ambient field is high enough to induce a usable voltage in an antenna then its probable some energy can be extracted from it. Maybe enough to extend battery life; if you could draw from a broad enough spectrum.

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The Mobile Art Piece: I was thinking more along the line of an Earth Globe; mounted on magnetic bearings, with the axis as the armature of a motor, used as a clock, that is calibrated and controlled using a tunable resonant circuit that is driven by some type of comparator circuit tuned to the atomic clock signal. I mean "art" is a little more subjective than hard nosed engineering - but it would be the hard nosed engineering that what would make it "art".

Genetic modification is simply a tool, pure and simple. Nature practices it all the time. You do it involuntarily every time a viral infection inserts its genome into your genes.

As a tool, it can be used well, nefariously, or iust because...stupid.

Let me describe a simple example with a tool every one of us is familiar with: the nail gun. It has a safety interlock deemed good enough. But, you are dissatisfied with it. So, you redesign the shoe with an added inertial lock, and add a magnetic interlock to the trigger, that can be pulled only by somebody with a magnet ring on the finger. With that addition to the "genetic makeup" now you have a safer tool.

Or you disable the safety of the shoe, and start shooting 2 inch nails around. There are enough genuine bad workplace accidents to know, that such act is totally irresponsible, bordering on criminally insane.

You see, the tool does not matter. The one wielding it does the act.

That is applicable to the lowly E. Coli bacterium. A huge number of strains are known. Almost all harmless. Some of those were taken some times ago, and genetically manipulated in labs to make them weaker 5 ways from Sunday, and equipped with some fancy needs, that can be satisfied only artificially. While they were not supposed to escape from the bioreactors, the fancy needs assures, that they are incapable to survive in nature.

Then they are further manipulated, until they produce insulin, hormones, vitamins or other valuable molecules in quantity. The human safeguards are high too.

Multiple safeguards, stiffly enforced.

There is a recent seeming counter example. A Connecticut outfit was running a dirty pharmaceutical factory, under the false label "compounding pharmacy". Clearly a criminal enterprise under investigation. Some dead, hundred(s) deathly ill.

Again, the one(s) who were pulling the "trigger", matter..

I consider both the Bt and the Roundup ready modifications at best a "because they could...", or worse the promise of the pot of the gold at the end of the rainbow for forever and ever after. With the locked in customer base, forever. Safety testing before release? What safety testing? Some assertion before congressional commitee did take care of that. And nobody i talked to has an idea how to undo such a gigantic experiment, if and when it becomes necessary.

Here a cautionary story is appropriate. Some 30 years ago the cyclosporin an immnosuppressing drug came as godsend, allowing tuning the immune reaction of organ transplant recipients. Hence, most all transplants were successful. And the system could be tweaked later. Pharma marketers saw in in a multiple pot of gold, in constant payments to them for life on behalf of the patients. And as the life expectation goes up, the demand for transplant goes up, so does the constant payments for life.

Well, not so fast. In the last 3 decades genetic research was coming up rapidly. Then your own stemcells were discovered. Then this years Shinya Yamanaka won the Nobel Prize for "induced pluripotent cells", inducing skin cells with only 4 genes to behave as good enough stemcells of your own. There is already practical procedure in use. When (not if) a hearth valve of yours hardens, it needs replacement. Now, they take a pig valve. Strip it all cells, leaving only a structural skeleton. Then it is populated with your stemcells. 3 weeks later it is sneaked into your hearth, and it grows into a fully functional valve. It is YOU, no need for any medication. You are repaired for life. The same is coming up for hearth attack damage, rapidly.

There are no pots of gold payments for life. NONE.

What will be the "genetic bypass" for the GMO mess? I have no idea. But, if I have to bet in a contest between a company covering its behind, and many, many thousand smart people sick of (or from) the setup, I bet on all my smart fellows, hands down. And the fellows here are smart, in their own way, most of the time.

'....Here a cautionary story is appropriate. Some 30 years ago the cyclosporin an immnosuppressing drug came as godsend...'

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The 'cautionary' part of this 'cautionary tale' seems to have gone missing. Care to elaborate?

Sure, no problem. Cyclosporin was an excellent solution for a whole industry. Logical too. Too bad, that genetic engineering bypassed the whole cute financial setup.

Disruptive inventions are coming fast and furios in high tech industries.

I wiew 3D, 4D and biological printing as such too.

The cautionary story is, that leaders of companies with none of the "vision thing" for the want of better expression lose out, almost by definition.

Thanks. I'm glad I asked. Sometimes it is easy to read in what turn out to be meanings that weren't intended.

Something that has crossed my mind. I've seen article showing GMO produce having less nutritional value than Natural produce. Would the lack of nutrition create a craving for missing nutrients and create and urge to eat more to satisfy the nutritional needs? From what I gather GMO products are a lot of empty calories.

I placed the dog food on the ant hills last night around dusk.

Day 1. Dog food has been completely incorporated into the mounds, and the ants are active:

Try HFCS; maybe it will give them all diabetes; to go with their dog chow induced obesity.

Some research on possible GMO/pet illness.

http://healthypets.mercola.com/sites/healthypets/archive/2012/11/14/genetically-modified-corn.aspx

My experiment is over...

Despite some initial enthusiasm over a potential food source, the ants have moved their exit tunnels around the perimeter of the puppy chow, and will not touch it.

In an act that is almost poetic, some nocturnal animal pooped in the middle of one of the puppy chow mounds. I'll post pics if anyone is interested.

I think I am noticing some yellowing of the grass that is in contact with the puppy chow, so for my next experiment, I am going to soak some of it in water for several days, strain it into a spritzer bottle, and see if the resulting liquid will kill plants.

I think this begs the question: Are the bees reacting the same to the HFCS that they are being force fed, and could starvation be playing a role, until they finally give up and feed on the only thing that's available?

It amazes me that this puppy chow is just laying out in my yard, and no creature will bother with it.

I definitely want to see the pics. Perhaps the MoMA would also be interested.

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I'm guessing the desecrator of the corn chow was probably one or more raccoons.

A common behavior among raccoons is to defecate in any food sources they haven't completely consumed and urinate in any sources of drinking water. Some say it is a way to discourage competitors from entering their territory.... I say it is revolting.

Yeah. I figured either a raccoon or possum. I don't know if I'll be able to capture the poop, since it's raining pretty hard tonight, but it's interesting that the ants have moved outside the radius of the puppy chow. I'll post pics soon.