Could we Harness Organic Muscle Power?

As long as it isn't human.

We've now got people that choose the path of least resistance, electing presidents.

Historically we did harness organic muscle power and did so for a few millennia by using domesticated animals of every shape and size. The problem was it proved to be very limited and inefficient.

I figure human power is dismal at best so using an animal even smaller isn't likely going to gain anything.

Since your screen name is energyconversion you should be full well capable of understanding the conversion of calories into KWH or HPH or whatever common energy form you chose.

From that you will quickly see that animal power isn't practical for anything but entertainment.

One hyperactive little dog might be able to charge a few cell phones in a day but then again a $20 solar panel can too and without all the barking along the way.

"I figure human power is dismal at best so using an animal even smaller isn't likely going to gain anything."

Fair enough, but I'm talking about an "organic machine" not an animal. It could be very large, perhaps consisting of thousands of units, each consuming organic waste, water and oxygen. Efficiency would not necessarily be a concern if somehow they could be self-replicating. May I remind you that solar panels are only a wretched 15% efficient and are no use at night.

I know where you're coming from, and I've thought the same.

An organic, perpetual machine; a cross between a living organism and a machine.

I think it will be here someday...

A machine that runs on calories...even if it is digesting human waste.

Not sure about the self replicating part.

If things become so efficient that humans need not exist, we will follow the dinosaurs.

"An organic, perpetual machine; a cross between a living organism and a machine."

Exactly right. I'm not sure about the "self-replicating" part either, but threw it in for good measure. Perhaps, "self-renewing" might be more appropriate, just as biological cells replicate and split.

It will be feasable when calories are all that's left to burn.

About self-replication: Most of the design work for computers is done by computers. Most of the manufacturing of machines is done by machines. How long before a computerized robot starts inventing & building better computerized robots?

They already exist. They are called pigs. And when they wear out you have a source of food too

Rich Hurd

This is completely off topic; but we are organic machines.

I can afford not to lay in my gravel driveway and work on cars, and I can afford not to cut and split wood for the winter. I don't have to have a garden...

I do the things I do, because I am terrified of forgetting how.

Humans have been given a near perfect organic machine; like all machines, it gets rusty and ruined if not used.

We have not even touched the tip of the iceberg in terms of human potential...lets hope that it's not simply figuring out ways to kill each other.

Maybe it's already too late...I hope not.

Now that you mention it, my dog is as close to a perpetual motion machine as one can get. S.M.

Just visualize the engine room of Holland America Lines' cruise ship Hamsterdam.

Nice one.

Imagine a ship with an array of genetically engineered organic muscles 50 yards long, arranged in parallel, alternately contracting and relaxing upon electrical stimulation, each one connected to a crank, worm drive or compressor. The muscles are "fed" on stored waste products or perhaps plankton from the sea, plus air. Certain whales survive very nicely on plankton throughout their long lives and grow to the size of small ships.

A bit fanciful now? Perhaps, but when all our oil and gas has gone - what then? Perhaps nuclear fusion might step in, but what if it doesn't? Back to muscle and wind power.

Well... you've forgotten that a whale is not just a muscle, it is a plankton harvesting-digesting and waste excreting machine as well, and spends the vast majority of its time and energy to fuel itself. If you mean to use plankton to fuel the disembodied muscle machine, you need harvesting equipment, a synthetic 'stomach/liver' to break it down into useable compounds, and a signalling system to ensure that what's needed gets where it's needed, also a system to carry away the waste products... I doubt you can do that more efficiently than the original basic animal design to fuel itself and excrete waste, and doubt there would be power left over to run anything if you used machines to perform those functions for a disembodied muscle.

Our muscles don't run on waste, either. That's why it's called waste, it's the used up stuff or part we can't use, typically toxic as well to the organic systems that therefore have systems to carry it away from the tissues in question. Yes I know, someone out there is synthesizing 'meat' from human waste, I'm sure that's all very energy intensive though.

You might want to read this page for a good overview of how muscles are powered and maintained. http://www.extension.iastate.edu/humansciences/content/carbohydrate

The Matrix! Done on humans! I never understood where they left the dogs!

C'mon people ,lets stop thinking on a local level and think about putting something into place that provided non stop energy supply ,two examples come to mind eg a continual

connected solar array circumnavigating the earth ,eeg tide genorators connected together also in circle configeration.

We have clean sustaniable unlimited power available to us right now we just need to be able to think collectivally big enough not only to imagine but to create and enjoy!!!!!

Hokey-dokey, how about some calculations with the decimal point within 3 places of the correct position?

Too big for me ; can you compute?

Suppose that your solar array costs $20,000 per kW of generating capacity, and/or suppose that the electricity produced costs $3.00 per kWh. Take it from there.

Yeah, but it's endless---we can make it all back in volume!

The Tin Lizzie process could come into place, the bigger the infrastructure eg transmission and distrubution which we already have part of should create lower supply costs,

still too big for me to compute. Are we starting at the wrong end? How much sunlight are we wasting each 24 Hr period now ?

Sorry for the off topic ,just trying to create the power, to bake the biscuit, to feed the dog,to run the genorator,to power the world, that we build.

Well, Horse Power actually was muscle power of a Horse. We all eat food and use muscle power so what is new here? Perhaps you may like to store energy from muscle power so in ancient time people used to lift weight and store it on some height to stock in static energy far more longer than batteries can do so and roll it down when you need that energy again. Good luck.