Previous in Forum: Power Cable In Parallel   Next in Forum: Modelling a 2-Phase Transmission Line in ETAP
Close
Close
Close
6 comments
Rate Comments: Nested
Associate

Join Date: Aug 2014
Posts: 35

Regarding Induction Motor Flux

09/20/2014 1:15 PM

How the flux of 3 phase induction motor winding increase with the invrease in speed of rotor?As per my understanding with increase in rotor speed slip will reduce by which the induce emf of rotor will also reduce .this way the rotor current also decrease with increase in motor speed so as per my view flux due to rotor current will decrease with increase in speed but I read in one book that rotot flux is decreased with speed of motor. So please somebody explain where I am wrong.

Register to Reply
Interested in this topic? By joining CR4 you can "subscribe" to
this discussion and receive notification when new comments are added.

Good Answers:

These comments received enough positive votes to make them "good answers".

"Almost" Good Answers:

Check out these comments that don't yet have enough votes to be "official" good answers and, if you agree with them, vote them!
3
Guru
United States - Member - New Member Engineering Fields - Power Engineering - New Member

Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: California, USA, where the Godless live next door to God.
Posts: 4665
Good Answers: 804
#1

Re: Regarding induction motor flux

09/20/2014 2:23 PM

It's a bit difficult to follow your question, likely something getting lost in translation there. But it appears you are questioning something you read somewhere about how motor flux can be said to decrease as speed increases. Is that correct? If so, and without knowing the context of the statement, I will hazard a guess.

Think about HOW you can change the speed of an induction motor; you can either change the number of poles, or you can change the frequency. The statement that you read most likely was in relation to changing the frequency, a common thing now by using a VFD.

A common issue that comes up when using a VFD is that most VFDs can put out a much higher frequency than the incoming line frequency, therefore higher than the motor DESIGN frequency. For example let's say you have a motor designed for 400V 50Hz (in deference to my assumption that you are not in North America). If you want to change the speed of that motor, you must change the frequency. But not JUST the frequency, you must also change the voltage at the same time if you want to maintain torque. This is because to get full torque from the motor, you must maintain the flux density of the original design, which can be represented as a ratio of voltage and frequency, or the "V/Hz ratio". So your motor has a V/Hz ratio of 8:1, and if you can maintain that ratio, +- 10% in typical motor designs, you can get rated torque from it because you are at the designed flux density.

Where this becomes problematic is when you go OVER the designed speed of the motor. So if you want to run your motor at 150% speed, you will need for the frequency to be 75Hz. But you STILL only have 400V available, so the V/Hz ratio is reduced to 400/75=5.33:1. Therefore your flux density has dropped by 33%, so you are LOSING torque as you rise above base speed. Many people have a difficult time understanding why their machines stop working at higher than base speed, so those of us in the VFD world must explain it. Over and over and over it seems. You most likely read something that was attempting to do just that.

Hoped that helped you.

__________________
** All I every really wanted to be, was... A LUMBERJACK!.**
Register to Reply Good Answer (Score 3)
Guru

Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Haverhill, MA
Posts: 1149
Good Answers: 151
#2
In reply to #1

Re: Regarding induction motor flux

09/20/2014 3:12 PM

I love your replies! Every time you respond to a question, whether it be a good question or a dumb question, I learn something new. I am not an EE, but at 68 I am still learning about the subject.

I know you wanted to be a LUMBERJACK, but you would make a damn good TEACHER

__________________
The older I am, the better I used to be
Register to Reply Score 1 for Good Answer
Guru
Popular Science - Weaponology - New Member Safety - ESD - New Member Hobbies - Fishing - New Member

Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Near Frankfurt am Main, Germany. 50.390866N, 8.884827E
Posts: 17996
Good Answers: 200
#3
In reply to #1

Re: Regarding induction motor flux

09/21/2014 3:38 AM

For a "hazard" guess, you really nailed it!! Brilliant, short and correct!!

GA

__________________
"What others say about you reveals more about them, than it does you." Anon.
Register to Reply
Guru

Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Mumbai, India
Posts: 1983
Good Answers: 25
#4
In reply to #1

Re: Regarding induction motor flux

09/21/2014 6:28 AM

Good Answer and nicely explained. I want to just comment that normally VFDs are used for speed reduction. I mean at starting of motor to avoid jerks. In such cases motor flux must be higher than normal so motor generates higher torque?.

__________________
"Engineers should not look for jobs but should create jobs for others" by Dr.Radhakrishnan Ex President of India during my college graduation day
Register to Reply
Guru

Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: About 4000 miles from the center of the earth (+/-100 mi)
Posts: 9910
Good Answers: 1141
#5

Re: Regarding Induction Motor Flux

09/21/2014 10:52 AM

Current is induced in the rotor by the rotating magnetic field. From the rotor's point of view, this field is rotating at the slip rate. For example if the motor is running at 1700 rpm and the synchronous speed is 1800, then the rotor sees the field rotate at 100 rpm. So the slower the motor, the greater the slip rate, and the greater the flux created by current induced in the rotor.

Register to Reply
Guru

Join Date: Oct 2012
Location: 100 miles North from the World Center
Posts: 879
Good Answers: 42
#6

Re: Regarding Induction Motor Flux

09/21/2014 2:48 PM

I.M.O.the rotor magnetic flux is flowing in the same time in stator and in rotor.

Since the flux in the stator winding depends on stator EMF- the supply voltage- it has to be constant [more or less].

The flux depends on stator no-load current-the difference between stator and rotor current- which has to be constant [more or less].

It is true that if the load increases then the stator voltage drop increases then E1 decreases and so the flux. At start -high frequency in the rotor at low speed-the current is elevated and voltage drop is big then the flux decreases. The speed goes up the current decreases and the flux goes up too [a little, only].

__________________
Julius
Register to Reply
Register to Reply 6 comments

Good Answers:

These comments received enough positive votes to make them "good answers".

"Almost" Good Answers:

Check out these comments that don't yet have enough votes to be "official" good answers and, if you agree with them, vote them!
Copy to Clipboard

Users who posted comments:

7anoter4 (1); Andy Germany (1); gringogreg (1); JRaef (1); Rixter (1); suresh sharma (1)

Previous in Forum: Power Cable In Parallel   Next in Forum: Modelling a 2-Phase Transmission Line in ETAP

Advertisement