Previous in Forum: Surge Arrester for HV Cable Protection   Next in Forum: How to Reduce Energy Consumption (Motors)
Close
Close
Close
9 comments
Participant

Join Date: Feb 2015
Posts: 2

220V Frequency Problem

02/05/2015 4:30 AM

I HAVE A PROBLEM WITH A 220V TO 12V DC BATTERY CHARGER THAT I CONNECT TO A 220V POWER SOURCE. THE DIGITAL DISPLAY ON THE CHARGER READS " IMPUT FREQUENCY TOO LOW" AS A RESULT THE CHARGER REFUSES TO GHAGE THE BATTERY.

IS THERE ANY SUGGESTIONS AS TO WHAT THE PROBLEM MAY BE?

Register to Reply
Pathfinder Tags: 220V IMPUT FREQUENCY
Interested in this topic? By joining CR4 you can "subscribe" to
this discussion and receive notification when new comments are added.

Comments rated to be Good Answers:

These comments received enough positive ratings to make them "good answers".

Comments rated to be "almost" Good Answers:

Check out these comments that don't yet have enough votes to be "official" good answers and, if you agree with them, rate them!
Guru

Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Hemel Hempstead, UK
Posts: 5292
Good Answers: 287
#1

Re: 220V Frequency Problem

02/05/2015 4:55 AM

What is the make and model of the charger?

Where is it designed to be used?

Where is it being used?

Is it an "outback" power supply? :-

THE DIGITAL DISPLAY ON THE CHARGER READS " INPUT FREQUENCY TOO LOW"
IS THERE ANY SUGGESTIONS AS TO WHAT THE PROBLEM MAY BE?

Yes, either: the input frequency is too low, or, the controller believes that the input frequency is too low.

__________________
We are alone in the universe, or, we are not. Either way it's incredible... Adapted from R. Buckminster Fuller/Arthur C. Clarke
Register to Reply
Participant

Join Date: Feb 2015
Posts: 2
#2
In reply to #1

Re: 220V Frequency Problem

02/05/2015 5:13 AM

Hi Randall,

The charger is built into a 2kw 12vdc to 220v ac inverter. I am using power from the municipal supply to connect to the charger.

If indeed the imput frequency is too low:

1. How do I check what the frequency actually is?

2.Normal frequency is 50Hz , Assume the frequency is low how do we rectify it?

Kind regards

Ricky

Register to Reply
Guru

Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Hemel Hempstead, UK
Posts: 5292
Good Answers: 287
#5
In reply to #2

Re: 220V Frequency Problem

02/05/2015 5:44 AM

My best guess at this point is that the charger was designed for use in the US, where the mains frequency is 60Hz.

Lots of things work almost as well at 50Hz as at 60Hz, but, if the controller specifically measures the frequency and refuses to work there's not a lot you can do.

You can buy 50 to 60 Hz frequency converters, but, I would expect one to cost more than the AC DC part of the "whole" thing, although much cheaper than the "whole" thing.

Is there an operators manual? There may be a switch or link setting somewhere.

__________________
We are alone in the universe, or, we are not. Either way it's incredible... Adapted from R. Buckminster Fuller/Arthur C. Clarke
Register to Reply Score 1 for Good Answer
Guru
Hobbies - CNC - New Member

Join Date: Jul 2013
Location: Lost Wages Nevada
Posts: 1578
Good Answers: 54
#6
In reply to #2

Re: 220V Frequency Problem

02/05/2015 9:03 AM

WHAT IS THE MODEL AND MAKE OF THE CHARGER AS OTHERS HAVE ASKED????????

__________________
Though it does seem he frequently has a Swiss Army knife or Leatherman and a roll of duct tape with him.
Register to Reply
Guru
United Kingdom - Member - Indeterminate Engineering Fields - Control Engineering - New Member

Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: In the bothy, 7 chains down the line from Dodman's Lane level crossing, in the nation formerly known as Great Britain. Kettle's on.
Posts: 30321
Good Answers: 817
#3

Re: 220V Frequency Problem

02/05/2015 5:26 AM

The first problem is that Caps Lock is on.

The second problem is an incompatibility between the desired input frequency, which will be given on a label on the equipment, and the input frequency available.

The third problem is either the absence of a User Manual at site or a reluctance to read it.

The fourth problem seems to be a reluctance to pick up the phone and talk to the equipment manufacturer directly. CR4 sees an awful lot of that.

__________________
"Did you get my e-mail?" - "The biggest problem in communication is the illusion that it has taken place" - George Bernard Shaw, 1856
Register to Reply
Power-User

Join Date: May 2008
Posts: 136
Good Answers: 2
#4

Re: 220V Frequency Problem

02/05/2015 5:28 AM

You need to take some key measures:

- Are you sure that your charger works properly? I mean, in terms of its voltage output when no-loaded.

- Make sure the source frequency is quite suitable for operating the charger. if it is really as low as the display shows, then you can proceed with "an optional step", which is to contact the local electricity supplying company for doing some load shedding over other areas, not yours...

Hope this helps!!

__________________
Just live and .. Learn!!
Register to Reply
6
Guru
United States - Member - New Member Engineering Fields - Power Engineering - New Member

Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: California, USA, where the Godless live next door to God.
Posts: 4658
Good Answers: 796
#7

Re: 220V Frequency Problem

02/05/2015 10:07 PM

Oooh, Oooh, a guessing game!!! Yay!!!!

I wanna play!

Can I play too???

Here's my guess.

You have a charger that likely uses a voltage control front-end on the rectifier, so it must fire SCRs (thyristors) to accomplish this. But it needs to calculate the firing angle of SCRs based on the zero-cross point, and is expecting a specific frequency within a range, i.e. 58-62Hz, or 49-51Hz, so most likely it has a selector switch, like a DIP switch, that you flip to tell it to expect 50Hz or 60Hz. Right now, the switch is in the 60Hz position, so it cannot find the zero-cross point of reference and the SCRs are firing at the wrong time. But rather than destroy itself due to your inability to RTFM*, it is protecting you from your own folly and stopping itself, telling you that you have failed to be responsible and is waiting for you to correct yourself.

Smart charger...

Do I win?

* Since you obviously have a first language other than English, RTFM is an acronym for "Read The Fu##ing Manual."

__________________
** All I every really wanted to be, was... A LUMBERJACK!.**
Register to Reply Good Answer (Score 6)
Guru
Popular Science - Weaponology - New Member Safety - ESD - New Member Hobbies - Fishing - New Member

Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Near Frankfurt am Main, Germany. 50.390866N, 8.884827E
Posts: 17996
Good Answers: 200
#8

Re: 220V Frequency Problem

02/06/2015 4:42 AM

It has already been said here, but maybe not as clearly as you need, I will try and help.

It appears that you are trying to use a 220V 60Hz charger on 220V 50Hz, and it is one that is frequency sensitive. Seldom in my experience. I have never seen one that good/sensitive!!

The real question is where did you buy it, if locally to you (in country) then they should replace it with one compatible with your frequency.

I have no idea where you live on this planet, but many third world countries have problems keeping the mains frequency stable, so it could be that the frequency you actually get in your house is even lower than the posted 50Hz, assuming that your charger is supposedly good for down to 50Hz.....check!

Let us know what you find out and the markings on the charger for voltage & frequency.

__________________
"What others say about you reveals more about them, than it does you." Anon.
Register to Reply
Guru
United States - Member - New Member Engineering Fields - Power Engineering - New Member

Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: California, USA, where the Godless live next door to God.
Posts: 4658
Good Answers: 796
#9
In reply to #8

Re: 220V Frequency Problem

02/06/2015 11:08 AM

It's probably an older charger based on a linear power supply, as opposed to new designs that almost all use SMPS technology now, where the rectifier is passive and thereby frequency insensitive. I used to work for a company that made firing boards for linear based battery chargers where the rectifier created the voltage change via phase angle control of SCRs rather than diodes. We put a pin jumper on the board to select 50/60Hz input, but since we were a US based company, the default setting was 60Hz. 99% of our tech support phone calls from overseas were people not reading the manual, NOR THE 3 PROMINANTLY PLACED STICKERS WITH LARGE RED TYPE FACE, telling them to change the setting if they have 50Hz. We changed to a dip switch in an attempt to make it easier, made no difference. People do not like reading instructions.

__________________
** All I every really wanted to be, was... A LUMBERJACK!.**
Register to Reply Score 1 for Good Answer
Register to Reply 9 comments
Interested in this topic? By joining CR4 you can "subscribe" to
this discussion and receive notification when new comments are added.

Comments rated to be Good Answers:

These comments received enough positive ratings to make them "good answers".

Comments rated to be "almost" Good Answers:

Check out these comments that don't yet have enough votes to be "official" good answers and, if you agree with them, rate them!
Copy to Clipboard

Users who posted comments:

Ali18 (1); Andy Germany (1); JRaef (2); Original_Macgyver (1); PWSlack (1); Randall (2); RICKY NAIDOO (1)

Previous in Forum: Surge Arrester for HV Cable Protection   Next in Forum: How to Reduce Energy Consumption (Motors)

Advertisement