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The 5-stroke Engine

02/26/2015 6:44 AM

In December I got suddenly inspired to invent something new. After a couple of weeks of sketches I came up with an idea that seemed so good and obvious that I couldn't believe no-one else had thought of it. I was right. On trolling the internet I eventually came across this interesting site, a history of engines, and in this particular case, "compound engines."

http://www.douglas-self.com/MUSEUM/POWER/unusualICeng/compoundIC/compoundIC.htm#adv

As you can see the idea was first patented by Deutz Diesel in 1879 as the "Compound Gas Engine" and was followed by many others using the same idea. I thought the idea was worth pursuing again and sent my ideas/sketches to a company in UK in January. What I didn't think of calling it, was a "5-stroke engine" and therefore further searches did not reveal till later that Ilmor Engineering in UK have already built and run an engine on this principle. Their site shows an engine exactly like "mine." Ilmor (well know in race car circles - pun not intended) claim that it was invented by a Gerhard Schmitz of Belgium.

http://www.ilmor.co.uk/capabilities/5-stroke-engine

I followed through to find that he patented it in 2003. The original patents would have expired long before he was born. I don't know much about Patent Law, but as far as I know, once something has been built and shown to work, it passes into the public domain and cannot be patented again. So how come Gerhard Schmitz has re-patented this idea? It rather pisses me off. By the same principle I could patent the Otto Cycle Engine.

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#1

Re: The 5-stroke Engine

02/26/2015 7:03 AM

Go for it. Hire a shark shyster lawyer.

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#2

Re: The 5-stroke Engine

02/26/2015 8:14 AM

You can patent a rock. Bo$e does it all the time. The waveguide radio is nothing more than a 1/4 wave transmission line,developed in the 1930s, and poorly designed. Given enough lawyers you can do anything.

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#9
In reply to #2

Re: The 5-stroke Engine

02/27/2015 3:19 PM

Yes, you can patent anything, even the same basic "thing" as patented before, you just have to change the appropriate wording and a few minor descriptive details to prove that it is "different" that existing. Just be prepared, if applying for a patent, to spend lots of $ on lawyers, if your idea is even close to something else already having a patent. The fewer the patents "similar" to yours, the easier(<$) it is.

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#3

Re: The 5-stroke Engine

02/26/2015 8:35 AM

The animation on the Ilmor video seems to show a strange firing angle - it looks as if ignition is shortly after BDC of the HP cylinders. Is that correct, or artistic license?

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#4
In reply to #3

Re: The 5-stroke Engine

02/26/2015 8:55 AM

No, not correct. I don't see any spark plug here either, so it's rather diagrammatical. They've colored the exhaust "red" at the wrong time in my opinion. The 2 high pressure cylinders are just normal 4-strokes, 1 & 3 being 360 o out of phase with each other, so that they exhaust alternately into the larger low pressure cylinder (2). Cylinder 2 is therefore a 2-stroke, having a power stroke every 360.o

Obvious configurations would be a V-6 or flat-6, but I proposed another configuration that I thought was beneficial - a 6 cylinder but with the length of a 4-cylinder, and only slightly wider, so that it could fit existing 4-cylinder engine bays.

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#5
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Re: The 5-stroke Engine

02/26/2015 9:02 AM

That's what I thought. Looks a bit like they're conflating the petrol cycle with a diesel cycle (i.e. just showing the air/fuel mix getting hotter due to the compression). Odd.

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#6

Re: The 5-stroke Engine

02/26/2015 5:15 PM

I have often wondered if this design could be improved upon. For instance, tuned exhaust or modern ignition. I was told this design had advantages with lower octane fuels. (Ethanol?).

The pistons appear to be mislabeled.

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#7
In reply to #6

Re: The 5-stroke Engine

02/27/2015 6:12 AM

Yes I was aware of the Puch Split-single engines and those by DKW. You are right about the mislabeling of the pistons, although it really doesn't matter which way round the engine is mounted, so I don't even see the purpose of labeling them forward/backward. The idea goes back to 1912 and some of them (DKW) were quite successful. But they are 2-strokes and have the attendant exhaust pollution problems:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Split-single

There is another so-called "Split Cycle" engine - the Scuderi. If you look at this and listen to their over-long description, you realize that its just a supercharged single cylinder, the supercharger being the adjacent cylinder.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BK2Mm7TYHuk

As ever, nearly everything has been tried, yet we still have the same basic design I.C. engines regardless. But you are right in that some of these might benefit from modern ideas and technology - even the (stolen) Gerhard Schmitz 5-stroke design.

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#8
In reply to #7

Re: The 5-stroke Engine

02/27/2015 1:37 PM

This is what I had in mind when I mentioned tuned exhaust:

It may that these acoustic principles would apply to the cross-over for split cycle.

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#10
In reply to #7

Re: The 5-stroke Engine

02/28/2015 5:04 AM

Re. Scuderi Engine: My description is not accurate - it is not the equivalent of a supercharged single cylinder - there is no supercharging. It is, as described, a "split cycle" - 2 cylinders doing the function of 1. Silly me.

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