Is the World Ready for the Waterless Urinal?

I must first say that the curmudgeon in me is rising to the surface here. First, the planet is not running low on water. There is plenty of water available on this planet. Parts of this planet are running low on potable water. In these places that potable water is running low I completely agree that potable water should not be used to flush a urinal, greywater should be used instead.

Now there maybe niches (no pun intended) that this urinal might fit into quite nicely. But I don't see a broad spectrum of use here.

I don't see why greywater should be used, when no water is needed at all...

I look forward to seeing these water-free urinals used more places. Feel sorry for the women though, maybe their day will come soon

I wonder if there could be a complication from undiluted urine sitting in any of the traps downstream?

Traps? What traps? We don't need no stinking traps!

The Treasure of the Sierra Madre

^{_{Sorry, I couldn't stop myself.}}

Their day will hardly come over, since they do #1 and #2 on the same installation, and you don't want the liquid seal ruined by any solids. Oops ! wait a minute, we also do both on the same device (and nearly at the same time) ! This doesn't help reduce the number of flushes too much.

For just a couple of lousy peeings a day? I'm making no home improvements, you can always go to your backyard and compresis narebus Joven salutat.

Yahlasit

Don't they already have these?

Obviously, we have had trees since the dawn of man.

However, I think a number of years ago New York City installed these (not a tree, but a flush-less urinal) in one skyscraper to save money in the plumbing and water costs.

The union had a fit because the plumbers would not need to run cold water supplies to the urinal. A compromise was struck. The flush-less urinals could be installed, but the plumbers would run a cold water line to the flush-less urinal and cap it.

Oh my...how silly is that. I would pitch a fit if I was forced to pay for the resources and a plumber to fit the water line only to cap it! That is so incredibly immoral it confounds my mind just to think of it.

We have 'waterless' urinals in my college, the one downstairs (used more often) seems to stink more, but neither are as bad as some flushing types I have visited that don't flush adequately.

If I read the end of that article accurately, it finished with an argument against waterless stating sewer gasses "could" escape during cartridge changes that "might" possibly cause harm. Ever seen a floor drain in a bathroom...many if not flushed with water will often either dry or stick open allowing sewer gasses to enter the room. And a simple solution to the cartridge problem is to fit a valve on the drain, close valve when changing cartridge, open when done! It is not that difficult to work around.

I don't care how much water is available to a given location, wasting it with abandon is just plain stupid.

Drew

Ain't unions wonderful!

From ¶ #5 in the article: "In California, a fifth of the electrical output was consumed by processing and pumping water."

A fifth of the electrical output of what? Parts of this 'article' read like an endorsement.

I'd like to add to this comment. Also an Engineer working in the water industry (although nothing to do with toilets).

Waterless urinals are very common place in Australia, as I understand the only times they are flushed is during cleaning - and cleaning isn't about sanitising the urinal/toilet, it's about managing the correct bacteria.

Not only do they use less water, they smell amazingly better.

Our workplace converted over to waterless urinals (http://www.desert.com.au/), and it is a vast improvement (no toilet stink). Interestingly though as our workplace toilet waste is sent to a dedicated recycled water system, and the workforce is 90% male, we've had to convert the toilets to full flush to make sure enough water was flowing through the system (essentially the reduced water flow through the system caused problems for the bacteria).

The bacteria population within the urinal and the surrounding area's are managed such that the urea is effectively metabolised.

If James Krug wants to improve the urinal, perhaps instead of making it smooth perfect surface to facilitate cleaning and sterilisation of the surface. It should instead be designed to support and promote bacteria growth. I imagine this would also reduce the "splashback problem".

Regards,

Anthony

i am a cheap sob,and too lazy tonight to log in.

I collect and use the water dripping from the a/c unit in the summer to flush my toilet now. At my remodel house, i plan to sneak in a water collection system for showers and laundry. Dont tell the water company, though. Our water is cheap, but they figure your sewer use by how many gallons of water flow into your house through their pipe, and it is higher than the water costs. I am sure the water company would raise quite a stink, knowing i am flushing ''unauthorized'' water down their pipes. It is nothing for your ''water'' bill to be over $100 a month around here.

As soon as it is used, it will no longer be waterless. Duh.

There are plenty of systems which use water, but much less.
Additives are needed to prevent the build of of chrystaline solids, with some water types, the urine reacts with it and deposits out all the calcium carbonate and other stuff which can completely block the pipes.
The company I work for actually sells a unit (I designed the electronics...and they say my job isn't glamourous) which allows the dose time and rate of both chemical and water to be adjusted. Water is expensive these days and at some venues, say a race course, the stystem can remain idle for days at a time and then just be activated when needed.
Typically one might flush just once every 30 minutes with the right additives during times of high use and then during the rest of the day, say once every 2 hours.
Hmmm ok, I'm boring you guys now....
Del

"Additives are needed to prevent the build of of chrystaline solids..."

I use Boddingtons, sometimes mixed with 50% Guinness.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Urinal_(restroom)

Waterless: all there already! Splashback: bring it on, will see how it works after five (5) beers!

After 5 beers how do you know you have splash back?

I've seen waterless urinals in most large European cities. Unfortunately, I've also seen them being used or stepped in them post use.....they are those big concrete/metal structures that people work in...you know, the ones on every block. Most of the users tend to be someone with a bottle in their hand or someone staggering out of a drinking establishment. Oh, I've also seen the designs that resemble light poles on the side of the street. Very clever designs.

Actually, they may exist in large American (or other countries too) cites however, I don't visit New York or Los Angeles, or Chicago, so I just don't have enough data.

In Philadelphia area we have several "green" buildings that have waterless urinal. This is nothing new. Our local DEP has them set up in-fact the system is set-up to recycle the urine and the us it for watering their green roofs. It a pretty neat set-up.

I have used them at a number of rest areas along the highways up and down the East Coast. Nothing new, and yes I was surprised they didn't stink. They do however have cartridges that have to be replaced periodically. I hope and pray someone did the cost analysis and found that the water saved more than pays for the cartridges but I have my doubts since they still have to supply water for the sinks and the commodes. Since most urinals only take a fraction of the water of a commode, how much are we really saving?

But, lest we forget, sometimes it's more important to make people feel good rather than actually achieving meaningful results. We are blessed to generally have plenty of fresh water around here so it isn't necessarily saving any resources. It would make a lot of sense in areas with scarce water supplies (hence, expensive).

I suppose they could install small pelton or paddle wheels and use the mechanical function to drive a counter that would record the number and duration of whizz events for the purpose of replacing the cartridges in a timely manner.

This would also provide entertainment so sorely missed since the smoking ban and the enjoyment of displacing ciggi butts with the stream.

OOOhhhhh!!!!! GREAT IDEA!!!!!!!!!!!!!! then we can start generating electricity with the falling urine, sure it will only be minuscule amounts, but just think, after several days it might just store up enough to light a dim LED bulb for the next patron at the paddle wheel! Sure everyone else will have to wee in the dark, but imagine how happy it would be to have a little LED lighting your stream's way you know is only powered by everyone else's wee!

I bet it would even pay for itself in 50 or so years...oh wait? you say it would wear out by then? Well, it is still free energy, saves water, and....and...well you know.

Drew

It was a joke son, I say a joke!

"falling urine"? You should have your prostate checked, I bet I could get .5 watts after a six pack!

OH MY GOSH!!! I didn't even think of the possibilities of installing these in a pub! A few pints of Green King IPA and anyone would be capable of lighting an LED.

Just think of the ramifications! We could put 90% of the pub's electric consumption off the grid!

Thats it! I am off to my local to start researching!

_{<grin> I like jokes too}

Drew

Doesn't this bring a new power into "getting Pissed"?

"Hey, I got such a load in that I just produced a WHATT?"

You won't find any urinals on German Autobahn rest places that use water, since YEARS!!!!

I thought that they would promote odour, simply not true....

I cannot remember the last time I used a water urinal in such a station.....maybe 2000?

Could this be Napoleon's Waterlessloo?

In a laboratory 10 miles east of downtown Los Angeles, a mechanical penis sputters to life. A technician starts a timer as a stream of water erupts from the apparatus's brass tip, arcing into a urinal mounted exactly 12 inches away. A small loudspeaker emits an "AHHHHHHHHH" sound, and then the comment " Its no longer deep or cold, HAHAHA".

• Technician: How long?
• Engineer: Beg your pardon?
• Technician: The timer, how long should I set it for.
• Engineer: Good question, now we will have to do another #$% @ survey!"